Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 Science ships
02-20-2012, 10:13 AM
I know science ships are built for a support role, But I've been wondering about certain. Hypothetical builds, assuming you have the Long Range Science vessal

Build 1,

Fore weapons
Quantom torpedo
Beam bank of personal choice
Beam Array.

Aft Weapons

Quantom Torepdo,
Beam Array.
360 turret.

Consles
Tactical focusing on energy damage (type specific) (To make up for the low fire rate/damage output of beams due to low energy)

Enginering one power transfer modual and one of the following
Hull (personal choice/ situational) or Aux power.

science consles
Flow capacitor,
Flow capacitor,
flow capacitor.

so you can reliably knock down systems even at the built in levels

now the idea behind the ship is to be more of a Smack and run style fight, while constantly peppering them so their shields can't regnerate. constantly knocking down power of various systems every 15 seconds while swinging either to the fore or aft to keep the damage spread along all four shields and hit them with the quantoms.

Active DOs would be something along the lines of torpedo reduction, (multiple torpedos with otu needing a volly skill or high yeild)) mixed with chance to reduce time on subsystem targeting.

The Boff skills could be
Tactical High yeild 1, Spread 2, to capitilize on the torpedos, and drain sheilds all that faster, I KNOW that torps don't work the best on shields But when you hit that 300+ damage you see ring up is 10 or 5 % of the damage done to the hull so would't that mean the rest of the damage is transfered to the shields?

Enginering, Emergancy power to shields 1 (Of course) and then Directed energy modulation ((Again because of the slow power regen you do need to make every shot count. with those energy guns.))

Science would run
Ensign
Jam sensors 1
Hazard emitters 1

Lt.
Shield Transfer
Shield Transfer

Lt.Comm
Hazard emmiters 3

Commander
Gravity well.

the reason emmiters 1 isn't taken twice is because emmiters 3 and 1 run off the same global, and a second 1 would just screw up any timing. The sensors also give you a tactical advantage when it does stick, letting you reposition your self, or get in multiple free hits, recharge your shields or run away. the shield transfer is to make up for the really sucky hull, letting you soak more shield damage think the Turrtle aproach. with the gravity well capatlizing on the auxliery power you have standard. letting you run away after taking to much damage, or a localized warp core chain ((assuming you get into a large fight with multiple core breachs possible))



Thoughts? Comments?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
02-20-2012, 04:03 PM
I would disagree that science ships, or any ships are "made" fir support roles. In my opinion, any ship can play a support role or be effective in a non-support role. It just depends on the player and the way your set up your ship.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
02-20-2012, 07:56 PM
I don't think the weapons layout offers enough focus for what you're trying to do. On the frontal arc, you have the quantum torp, a DBB, array and turret. Broadside you have 2 arrays and a turret and aft you have a torp, array and turret. If your intention is to smack them in passes, you don't have enough concentrated firepower in any of your arcs to put real pressure on a target. At the very least, go three turrets at the back and put in Cannon Rapid Fire in the Lt Tactical Boff slot and you'll find that you can strip shields much faster in a frontal pass and be able to employ rapid fire in any orientation, which is handy if the target is almost dead but have looped into your rear arc.

I personally don't think DEM is contributing anything to your current set up. The cool down is horrendous, and you don't have any boff abilities which synergise with it. Replacing the aft with turrets, swapping the frontal weapons with cannons and putting Cannon Rapid Fire into your tac lineup will help with that, but I still don't think it's worth holding on to DEM for a gimmicky combination. I'd much rather putting in Aux to SIF in its place to add a very time cheap and effective hull heal. While you may insist that you will tank all damage to your shields, the stronger your shields, the more you realise that bleed through damage will be your undoing, especially with shield bypassing damage such as plasma fire dots from the plasma torps. Using Aux to SIF for general hull repairs, especially in a high aux power setting, while holding onto HE for when the plasma fires break out will greatly enhance your survivability and reduce the need to carry two copies of HE.

I don't think having two copies of TSS is all that useful. Unless you are going to be babysitting something and rotating TSS when they aren't doing anything to help themselves, TSS has a shared 30s cool down with other copies of itself. I'd rather get TSS III and push HE to the Lt slot and knock off the ensign version in exchange for something else, like Science Team I for extra shield healing and to add an ability on an otherwise vacant system cool down. Rely on EPtS for your general shield tanking, TSS for when the proverbial hits the fan or when you need to rotate for more general shield damage resistance while you're waiting for EPtS to come off CD and Science Team to boost your shield levels.

The proposed Sci powers would then be:
Jam Targeting Sensors I
Science Team I
--
Hazard Emitters II
<Something>
---
Transfer Shield Strength III
---
Gravity Well III

You can move Science Team to the Lt slot then put say, Tractor Beam into the Ensign slot, or put Power Siphon in the Lt Slot or even move TSS to the Lt slot and put in Tyken's Rift in the Lt.Comm slot seeing how you've gone with Flow Capacitors for even more power draining.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
02-22-2012, 07:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mysteana View Post
The proposed Sci powers would then be:
Jam Targeting Sensors I
Science Team I
--
Hazard Emitters II
<Something>
---
Transfer Shield Strength III
---
Gravity Well III

You can move Science Team to the Lt slot then put say, Tractor Beam into the Ensign slot, or put Power Siphon in the Lt Slot or even move TSS to the Lt slot and put in Tyken's Rift in the Lt.Comm slot seeing how you've gone with Flow Capacitors for even more power draining.
I do enjoy this feed back, and I agree the engi slot was just me trying to find SOMETHING to place there, And the Aux to SIF I didn't even think about.

I used to run SciTeam1, untill I realized TSS2 had a better damage reduction, What I was doing with two coppies was having a 50% uptime, yes the skill has a 30s cooldown together but with one I get 15 seconds of healing and 45 seconds of Pain, with two its 30/30. if I could figure out what else runs on the same cooldown as TSS I would put something like that inbetween them giving me a skill sequence of TSS2/(What ever runs here peferably Damage Reduct with universal 15s cooldown)/TSS2
this will let me run A huge damage reduction, and I use Resilient shileds, I don't see why the hell not and 5% bleed through isn't much compared to 10%,

The problem with 3 whole Turrets on the back is the CONSTANT energy drain, if I could I would stick another beam aray on the end and that way I would constantly have a gun on them in sweepin strikes ((3/2/3 beams as I pass along with torpes for back up)) A sci energy transfer is SLOW, and let me tell you you start to notice when you use something liek BFAW with a tactical debuff of attack pattern Beta, Two shots everythings debuffed but so are youn.

The rapid Fire, would just cause the hole ((Which is a pretty big hole)) to grow larger and when you fight someone else who targets systems, I know for a fact I've been weapon drained first.

Another thing I did ((Not sure if this is true)) was use Polaron beams, someone said flow capaciters affect beam %s so 2.5% to debuff 25 energy to a random system, ontop of Sub system targeting. Yea

But I tottaly love your response, and will look into it the next time i'm online
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
02-22-2012, 09:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by william128
The problem with 3 whole Turrets on the back is the CONSTANT energy drain, if I could I would stick another beam aray on the end and that way I would constantly have a gun on them in sweepin strikes ((3/2/3 beams as I pass along with torpes for back up)) A sci energy transfer is SLOW, and let me tell you you start to notice when you use something liek BFAW with a tactical debuff of attack pattern Beta, Two shots everythings debuffed but so are you.
I'd dispute that. I have very few weapons energy issues with my RSV which is running 2xDBB, Photon Torp in the front and 3x turrets at the back. Sure, when running at 104 power, the energy drops to the 75-80s when everything is firing but cannon rapid fire, scatter volley, FAW doesn't drop the power any more than regular attacks. I like to refer to my RSV as a 'light escort' and I play it similar to one. Set up attack lines, reposition with Evasive etc but with DBBs instead of D(H)Cs and ever since I loaded up on WPO doffs, the photon torpedo has gotten significantly more effective. I am using an EPS conduit console, but that's mainly to support my power switching between 'stances'.

I use Polarons myself on the RSV, and with my current skill levels plus three flow capacitors, a proc drops the target's power levels by ~43, which is nearly an instant subsystem offline for NPCs. Even if it doesn't take the subsystems offline, it nearly cuts the engine off, weakens the shields considerably and makes their weapons harmlessly glance off. If it procs close to a target subsystem, yeah, it's down and out. Which is another reason why I got the turrets, the rate of fire lends itself to getting procs.

I didn't consider rotating two copies of TSS for the shield damage resistance. I normally go with EPtS and rotate with TSS when I need to extend the duration, though rotating two TSS and adding EPtS's 66% uptime would be nice... You may want to consider getting TSS III if you're going to rely on it.

The purpose of the Sci Team isn't really to add damage resistance, but it's there to remove science based debuffs and provide a shield heal if nothing else. Since you don't have Eng or Tac team, that's pretty much a free ability without any shared CDs.
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