Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 Damage Output?
03-01-2012, 03:08 PM
Background: level 33 engineer in a science ship, 4 mk vi (rare) phaser arrays + 2 photon torps. Relevant damage skills at 6. Everything I know about game tactics I learned in the tutorial and Klingon story arc.

When I'm trading broadsides with an computer-controlled cruiser, my damage tics read off in the 40-50 range on shield hits, and it takes 10-15 seconds to grind through their shields before I get to 400-500 on hull damage. When I get jumped by a PVPer on Kerrat (hate the place but its the fastest dilthium grind), they cut through my 6k point shields inside of 2 seconds, plus 20k hull in 2 more. I'm dead before I can respond. Now admittedly they're half again my level, but even carriers, with just as many weapon slots as my Intrepid, are doing that. Likewise any returned fire doesn't seem to phase them at all.

How? By back of the envelope math it seems like their damage output is like 5-10 times what mine is? I looked on the STO Wiki but it isn't very clear on what bridge officer powers do SPECIFICALLY what, just 'increases rate of fire' but no numbers saying exactly how much Nor does anything ever explain what "+11 to phasers" actually means for consoles.

I'm not interested in PVP, but I would like to multiply my damage output for PVE play. I can increment it some right now by messing with power settings I know, but that doesn't get nearly the results of what I've seen other people doing. So what ARE they doing thats making them so much more powerful?

PS: Please no acronyms. I'm new to MMOs in general and had to look up PVP and DPS.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
03-01-2012, 05:28 PM
Quote:
When I'm trading broadsides with an computer-controlled cruiser, my damage tics read off in the 40-50 range on shield hits, and it takes 10-15 seconds to grind through their shields before I get to 400-500 on hull damage.
I don't use the phrase often but...You're doing it wrong. If you try to fight a Cruiser on it's terms, you will lose. You are in a Science Vessel. They fight dirty. You will gouge out eyes, hit below the belt, box their ears, drop caltrops, poison the water supply, annoy, harass and drive them into a frothing rage. All the while, bobbing and weaving and shooting them with beams and peppering them with Torpedoes.

What I've been describing in real world terms is fighting ships on YOUR terms. You use the Science BOFF abilities you have on you ship to blind (Jam Sensors), hit below the belt (Target Subsystem Shields), etc. The idea is to use your crowd control abilities, debuff abilities, and buff abilities to fight your foes. And Science ***** turn better than any Cruiser. You need to be using your superfior movement to keep fresh shield facings towards your enemy, softening shields up with your broadsides, and whn you get a down shield facing your quickly turn and lob torpedoes towards the ship. you don't care if they hit or miss, you keep moving land turning (bobbing and weaving).

If you get licky on some procs, you can blow a NPC cruiser out of the sky before they fire a shot. Litrally not evey see you. But that's just one strategy and Science Vessel build. The bottom line is that you now out DPS Cruisers and Escorts. So you will annoy them to death with your science abilities and survive their damage as an Engineer.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
03-01-2012, 05:31 PM
DPS is definitely not the strength of science ships. And it takes longer for sci ships to kill things compared with other ship types. Sci ships only get 6 weapon slots, 2 tactical stations, and 2 tactical console slots. Compare that with escorts which have 4 tactical console slots, 7-8 tactical stations depending on the ship, ability to use cannons, and inherent +15 power to weapons. Cruisers are sort of in between. They have up to 8 weapon slots, but have lots of engineering stations to buff their damage like Emergency power to weapons, and directed energy modulation.

As far as defense goes, hard to say why you pop so fast without knowing your set up (you're welcome to post if you want opinions on it). The other thing to consider is that Kerrat is sort of broken right now with the levels. It is supposed to be level banded, but players of different levels can currently mix. You may have been attacked by a max level character. Plus, most klingon ships can cloak, and they get a damage bonus when they decloak. You just gotta pay attention when you are there, or stay grouped up with other fed ships.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
03-01-2012, 07:07 PM
I know I'm never gonna max out DPS in a science ship but I didn't enjoy my attempt at a tactical ship (couldn't keep my cannons on-target long enough, not a good pilot). I just want to make the guns I do have more effective.

My offensive bridge powers are the the science targeting ability (I usually aim for the shields), high-yield topedo 2, tractor beam 1, tachyon beam 2, photonic shockwave 1, gravity well 2. Defensively its the tac, eng, and sci teams at 1, auxiliary to dampeners 1, hazard emitters 2, polarize hull 2, and transfer shield strength 3. So many icons to click by the time I find them to use I'm usually dead before it matters. I forget what consoles I'm carrying, whatever drops I've run across, all just a minor boost to this or that number though.

To upgun this ship, or if I switched to another ship, what ability/gear combinations are people using to so dramatically increase their own abilities? I've heard people comment how boringly easy they find PVE as they level, and I'm finding it more difficult, so clearly they know something I don't.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
03-01-2012, 07:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ReginaMala View Post
Now admittedly they're half again my level, but even carriers, with just as many weapon slots as my Intrepid, are doing that. Likewise any returned fire doesn't seem to phase them at all.
So, you're saying that you're fighting lvl 50s? Yeah, you're going to get torched. Don't worry too much about it.

You are a self-described noob, fighting in the roughest of STO's back alleys, against people that have likely been PvPing for 2 years, AND are 17 lvls above you. There is basically nothing you can do at this point to beat them. Their gear (weapons, shields, consoles, etc) and the powers they have available at max lvl are FAR beyond anything you can compete with at 33.

Now granted, there are a lot of areas that you could improve, most likely. But a lot of that improvement will come with time.

My advice is to lvl up, but stay in Ker'rat regularly. Ask questions, and pay attention to the good players, you'll catch on.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
03-01-2012, 08:07 PM
It is all in your build - ship, weapons, BOs, consoles, skill tree. Don't sweat it too much now. You have to re-equip and add BO skills at every level. Use this time to experiment and learn.

Once you make admiral, post your build and ask for advice.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
03-01-2012, 09:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_House_of_Darok View Post
So, you're saying that you're fighting lvl 50s? Yeah, you're going to get torched. Don't worry too much about it.

You are a self-described noob, fighting in the roughest of STO's back alleys, against people that have likely been PvPing for 2 years, AND are 17 lvls above you. There is basically nothing you can do at this point to beat them. Their gear (weapons, shields, consoles, etc) and the powers they have available at max lvl are FAR beyond anything you can compete with at 33.

Now granted, there are a lot of areas that you could improve, most likely. But a lot of that improvement will come with time.

My advice is to lvl up, but stay in Ker'rat regularly. Ask questions, and pay attention to the good players, you'll catch on.
I'm not even trying to beat them (more futile than selling socialism to the Ferengi). I know that even when I'm at level 50 I'll never be fast enough or agressive enough to do PVP. I more bring them up as an example that I'd expect them to do twice as much damage as I currently can, not 10x as much. Its that difference between 2 and 10 that makes me think I should have more relative punch than I do, and must be doing something wrong (hence asking for help.)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
03-01-2012, 11:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ReginaMala View Post
My offensive bridge powers are the the science targeting ability (I usually aim for the shields), high-yield topedo 2, tractor beam 1, tachyon beam 2, photonic shockwave 1, gravity well 2. Defensively its the tac, eng, and sci teams at 1, auxiliary to dampeners 1, hazard emitters 2, polarize hull 2, and transfer shield strength 3. So many icons to click by the time I find them to use I'm usually dead before it matters. I forget what consoles I'm carrying, whatever drops I've run across, all just a minor boost to this or that number though.
First of all, you want to use that Gravity Well ability as early and often as possible--it can do quite a bit of damage to enemies. Look into getting that BOFF trained in Gravity Well 3 as soon as you can, as well.

Second, you should hit that Polarize Hull 2 the instant any shield quadrant goes down--it'll make your hull last much longer.

Third, you should use that Tachyon Beam 2 as early and often as possible as well, at least until your enemy's shields are down. Then hit the High-Yield Torpedo 2 and hammer him with a torpedo salvo.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
03-02-2012, 11:52 AM
*bump, hopefully*
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
03-02-2012, 12:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ReginaMala View Post
I know I'm never gonna max out DPS in a science ship but I didn't enjoy my attempt at a tactical ship (couldn't keep my cannons on-target long enough, not a good pilot). I just want to make the guns I do have more effective.

My offensive bridge powers are the the science targeting ability (I usually aim for the shields), high-yield topedo 2, tractor beam 1, tachyon beam 2, photonic shockwave 1, gravity well 2. Defensively its the tac, eng, and sci teams at 1, auxiliary to dampeners 1, hazard emitters 2, polarize hull 2, and transfer shield strength 3. So many icons to click by the time I find them to use I'm usually dead before it matters. I forget what consoles I'm carrying, whatever drops I've run across, all just a minor boost to this or that number though.

To upgun this ship, or if I switched to another ship, what ability/gear combinations are people using to so dramatically increase their own abilities? I've heard people comment how boringly easy they find PVE as they level, and I'm finding it more difficult, so clearly they know something I don't.
A sci ship's offensive ability is not really in doing damage. It's more in crowd control and debuffing the targets so that a more DPS oriented ship can kill them faster. That said, for damage, you really have to run full power to weapons, and then try to get more power into them with gear and skills (putting skill points into Weapon performance. For gear, you should get the Borg console when you hit the appropriate level. This will give you another +5 to weapon power.) Also, you might want to consider Fire at Will instead of tac team or high yield torpedo. Against a single target, FAW can be quite effective. Unfortunately, with only 2 tac abilities, your choices here are limited. You only get 2 tac console slots, so use them wisely. I would go with 2 Phaser relays (mark VIII blue if you can find/craft them). You could even swap out the rear torpedo, and put in another phaser beam for a total of 5 beam arrrays. And finally, UPGRADE YOUR WEAPONS to Mark VIII. Mark VI won't cut it fighting against level 30+ enemies. You can get rare phaser beams as mission rewards, so just replay the missions until you have your set.

Defensively, use the strength of the sci ship - SHIELDS. At your level, you should be able to get the Reman Shield which is pretty decent. Run mission replay to get the captain level version. Give your engineering BO Emergency Power to Shields 1 and 2, and chain them for continuous shield buff. You'll have to give up Aux to damp and eng team, but you will be better off that way. Aux to damp only gives you kinetic damage resist, whereas EpTS gives you all energy damage reduction to your shields of between 18 and 24% depending on the version. Plus it increases your shield regeneration rate. This is further augmented by your transfer shield strength and sci team (synergy is a beautiful thing). Against PVE in a sci ship, you should never have your shields depleted with this combination. That would leave your hull heals to Hazard Emitters, and you can take your pick of what version you want. Honestly, with your shield buffs, you shouldn't need haz emitters very often in PVE.
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