Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
03-23-2012, 08:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirrelloid View Post
WRONG

Every sector has its own shipboard mission list. EVERY SINGLE SECTOR. Even if those sector-specific ship lists reset only once a day (which has not been verified at all), you still have to wander your ship >40x to check every shipboard. (ok, i'm not sure ESD, SFA, VulcanG, AndoriaG, DS9g, or Deferi G have separate shipboard sections even...)
There may be a few sector specific missions. But people still keep saying "have to" like they are being forced to do this. You dont "have to" go to your ship in every sector, you dont "have to" go to every sector. This is an optional thing, a side part of the game.

I want them to add special missions to Risa, Vulcan, Andoria, ect. The way you guys talk, you are going to complain that you "have to" go to all these different systems, and you "have to" land on the planet.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
03-23-2012, 09:01 PM
After seeing how completely ... off the rails people have gone in the Doff channel, I hope that 1) Heretic posts in here about as often as devs post in the PVP forums and 2) he takes Stevie's idea of system-specific missions and runs with it. The tears would be amazing.

Heretic: you should probably sticky your "I'm fixing this" post, else more people will miss it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
03-23-2012, 09:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevieboysw View Post
There may be a few sector specific missions. But people still keep saying "have to" like they are being forced to do this. You dont "have to" go to your ship in every sector, you dont "have to" go to every sector. This is an optional thing, a side part of the game.

I want them to add special missions to Risa, Vulcan, Andoria, ect. The way you guys talk, you are going to complain that you "have to" go to all these different systems, and you "have to" land on the planet.
We already stopped at all the planets (space and ground).

Oh, and its 64 different sector areas btw.

Look, either DOffing is a game, or its click for credit.
-In order for it to be a game, players need to be able to make informed choices about assignments. Ie, the game is optimizing assignments done within limited assignment space.
-In order to make informed choices, its necessary to have a good idea what the 'state of the board' is. That means being able to know ALL the desirable assignments available at one time. The game was already pushed about as far as it could go on that if you were playing solo (64 different sectors to check + old shipboard). DOFFJOBS helped make it bearable.
-New Update added 64 x Ship Contacts places to check. FOR EACH PLAYER. (And you can access another player's list by getting a bridge invite).

CONCLUSION: DOffing is no longer a game. Its click for credit. Its impossible to have any idea what the state of the board is, because the size of the board increases with the number of people you're talking to. Even if we assume you are a hopeless hermit who never talks to anyone, there's still over TWICE as many places to check and that take additional non-trivial time to do so.

In the old version you could really figure out what was out there, then choose a particular goal (Dilithium, cxp in general, focused cxp on on area, chain completion, bonus DOffs) and optimize your assignment selection to fulfill that goal. In the new and really not improved version you might as well take the first 20 plausibly decent assignments you see, because anything else takes FOREVER.

Thats not a game. That's click for credit. I enjoyed DOffing for the game. I'm really not enjoying it now.

Time to DOff per 4h previously: ~1h
Time to DOff per 4h now: >4h, averaging time spent shipboard over its 20h refresh time (even assuming the sector-related shipboards do only cycle every 20h).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
03-23-2012, 09:56 PM
Agreeing with the negative opinions...it sounds ok on paper but works out to nothing but pain. It took me several hours to try and check doff assignments, and the fact that assignments are different inside for personal didn't help.

Zone in
Check zone quests
Check personal
Beam to ship
Check personal again
Check diplo
Check tactical
Go to crew deck (if I'm feeling up to it) and try to get beer. usually fails
Go to engineering deck
Check engineer
Check ops
Check scientist
Beam out

All this zoning makes me nauseous, in complete truth. I had to log out several times - all the zoning and the spinning of the camera that happens was making me ill. And there were several voices (but so so few) saying you could do the same missions outside that you could inside, but that would be wrong. Both of the Support missions I did were ONLY avaiable from my OPS person and I could not see them in space.

I'm glad I was waiting until today's paycheck to subscribe. I'm not going to bother until this is revamped. The mostly negative feedback from Tribble should have made this project be held rather than launched, and seeing that there were even a few last minute changes would point out how bad it was. A better idea would be to simply unwind the patch. Hours and hours to do this isn't worth the 20h reset. I'm not doing this in 20h. Instead I'm going to play another game and come back in a week or so and see if the game is worth investing in or not.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
03-23-2012, 10:23 PM
I think the negative comments are coming from only a small hardcore minority that seems to think you have to check every available mission. In general this is a positive thing, and it allows most normal players access to the chains that would get buried in the shipboard missions. It adds a nice immersive feel to the game of the captain doing his rounds. It adds a lot of potential for the future. Im glad they released it and dont think it needed to be held back at all.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
03-23-2012, 10:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevieboysw View Post
I think the negative comments are coming from only a small hardcore minority that seems to think you have to check every available mission. In general this is a positive thing, and it allows most normal players access to the chains that would get buried in the shipboard missions. It adds a nice immersive feel to the game of the captain doing his rounds. It adds a lot of potential for the future. Im glad they released it and dont think it needed to be held back at all.
Um, Captains don't do rounds. They use the comms and have officers report to them in their ready room as necessary.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
03-24-2012, 12:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevieboysw View Post
There may be a few sector specific missions. But people still keep saying "have to" like they are being forced to do this. You dont "have to" go to your ship in every sector, you dont "have to" go to every sector. This is an optional thing, a side part of the game.

I want them to add special missions to Risa, Vulcan, Andoria, ect. The way you guys talk, you are going to complain that you "have to" go to all these different systems, and you "have to" land on the planet.
There were no diplo missions in sector space for 90% of sectors. I HAD to go to bridge each sector to find a diplo mission. The day before there were diplo missions everywhere.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
03-24-2012, 12:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevieboysw View Post
I think the negative comments are coming from only a small hardcore minority that seems to think you have to check every available mission. In general this is a positive thing, and it allows most normal players access to the chains that would get buried in the shipboard missions. It adds a nice immersive feel to the game of the captain doing his rounds. It adds a lot of potential for the future. Im glad they released it and dont think it needed to be held back at all.
Nobody is saying this isn't a good thing, its just that people don't want to do a TON of running around.


The old system, you can DOFF on the run and check all missions within 20 minutes and if you had other characters, you can send them there and be done within 1 hour. But with this new system you have to enter sector space, see what's there, go inside to see what special sector missions there are, zone out, rince and repeat for every zone in STO that offers DOFF missions. In short that 20 minute run now literally becomes 2 hrs!

That is a massive wasted of time that didn't need to happen. And time is precious when it comes to casual players who only have a limited ammount of time to play.



Even worse, with interior missions requiring goods and no access to the bank or exchange, you have to write what you need down, and do a bunch of zoning to complete that mission before the timer is up. And that is not very fun. It turns DOFFing into a job.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
03-24-2012, 12:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurian View Post
Nobody is saying this isn't a good thing, its just that people don't want to do a TON of running around.


The old system, you can DOFF on the run and check all missions within 20 minutes and if you had other characters, you can send them there and be done within 1 hour. But with this new system you have to enter sector space, see what's there, go inside to see what special sector missions there are, zone out, rince and repeat for every zone in STO that offers DOFF missions. In short that 20 minute run now literally becomes 2 hrs!

That is a massive wasted of time that didn't need to happen. And time is precious when it comes to casual players who only have a limited ammount of time to play.



Even worse, with interior missions requiring goods and no access to the bank or exchange, you have to write what you need down, and do a bunch of zoning to complete that mission before the timer is up. And that is not very fun. It turns DOFFing into a job.
You mentioning casual players is a good point, I'd wager that alot of casuals only player because of the doff system. I know I do.
But hardcores are going to suffer too, the players that run dailies, stfs. They aren't going to like having to run round the ship every sector, and you do HAVE to, cos they wanna be getting on with other stuff.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
03-24-2012, 12:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zekesulastin
After seeing how completely ... off the rails people have gone in the Doff channel, I hope that 1) Heretic posts in here about as often as devs post in the PVP forums and 2) he takes Stevie's idea of system-specific missions and runs with it. The tears would be amazing.

Heretic: you should probably sticky your "I'm fixing this" post, else more people will miss it.
Im sure that if you had to go do 1 full series of an epsiode before you could do even 1 PvP match, you would be in full scream mode.
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