Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
03-26-2012, 05:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by maicake716
this is actually one of the most limiting things i can think of to do.

i've always felt its more important to fly what your comfy with first then figure what ship to stick the captain in.

ive seen great success with engineering escorts, or science escorts, or tactcal cruisers (excelsior only) or science cruisers or even tactical science ships.

mixing and matching is half the fun. (im not saying they all need not fly their "class" of ships but that only limiting to those ships may hinder your efforts at pvp.)
Sorry, but I have to completely disagree. Really good teams can get away with running hybrid fail boats simply through strength of teamwork. But an engineer escort is never going to be as valuable as a tacscort or sciscort. An engineering or tactical science vessel will never be as valuable as a sci/sci.

When SP was first formed we had almost the exact same mindset as these guys. Have a preset team (back in the day was 3 sci/sci, one eng/cruiser, and a tac or sciscort), have multiple people able to fill multiple roles so that we can run that setup as much as possible, and practice like mad. Our motivation was that we had something to prove -- and that original team became more or less unstoppable.

I think it's somewhat unfortunate that we've fallen away from that ideal a bit recently, but if we had started out running whatever the heck we wanted to we would have never gotten to the point we're at now.

Creating a great PvP team isn't rocket science. Assuming they aren't hopeless players, If these guys follow through with the plan they have set out it'll only be a matter of time before they can best every fleet that has less discipline -- including the present TSI and Pandas. Don't discount power of a fleet that has something to prove and a solid plan to do it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
03-26-2012, 05:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dribyelruh View Post
Sorry, but I have to completely disagree. Really good teams can get away with running hybrid fail boats simply through strength of teamwork. But an engineer escort is never going to be as valuable as a tacscort or sciscort. An engineering or tactical science vessel will never be as valuable as a sci/sci.

When SP was first formed we had almost the exact same mindset as these guys. Have a preset team (back in the day was 3 sci/sci, one eng/cruiser, and a tac or sciscort), have multiple people able to fill multiple roles so that we can run that setup as much as possible, and practice like mad. Our motivation was that we had something to prove -- and that original team became more or less unstoppable.

I think it's somewhat unfortunate that we've fallen away from that ideal a bit recently, but if we had started out running whatever the heck we wanted to we would have never gotten to the point we're at now.

Creating a great PvP team isn't rocket science. Assuming they aren't hopeless players, If these guys follow through with the plan they have set out it'll only be a matter of time before they can best every fleet that has less discipline -- including the present TSI and Pandas. Don't discount power of a fleet that has something to prove and a solid plan to do it.
Myself and my fleet mates have the same mindset as yourself, we have a plan that we will stick to and practice unitll we are completly happy.

Maybe on one vs one the hybrid builds will come into their own, but not for what we want to do, we want to play to each career strenghs and that means for us running tactscorts, engicruisers, sci/sci.

I used to run an engi in a defiant for over a year and swore it was the way forward, but i tried a tact in an escort and realised to get an escorts maxiumum potential was to put a tact toon in it.

Be kinda nice if other fleets that dont have premade pvp teams to start and form one up, the more premade teams for me would = better more varied diverse pvp matches, Altho I can imagine would not be to inviting for pug teams. I must admit how ever I do like to pug at times and run into premades just to practice bit of tanking and try and get at least one kill lol

I do have another question however if any of you existing premades are reading..... who do you normally get to call the game plan in battles.... the escorts, sci or cruisers ? I did read the thread that was linked on premades which suggested the healer, but just wondered if anyone else had any other ideas. Cheers
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
03-26-2012, 06:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texus
I do have another question however if any of you existing premades are reading..... who do you normally get to call the game plan in battles.... the escorts, sci or cruisers ? I did read the thread that was linked on premades which suggested the healer, but just wondered if anyone else had any other ideas. Cheers
You'll get a lot of different answers to that, all of them with some solid reasoning. I've always been of the opinion that the spike damage dealer should call targets since he has the most crucial role in delivering a strike. His positioning, cooldowns, and timing matter the most. No matter how good another person's situational awareness might be, he'll never be able understand the escort's cadence better than the escort pilot himself.

The engineer cruiser should be the main heal caller. He has the burst hull heals that are the last line of defense. He also has the least amount of other things he needs to focus on. He doesn't need to worry about positioning as much, or timing spikes or debuffs. He does need to focus on enemy spikers, on when and who they are going to hit, and give warning and healing. An engineer cruiser who calls targets and looks for weaknesses in the enemy players is liable to miss split second heals that save lives. Best to have a narrow yet intense focus.

Science vessels should collaborate with the escort for timing spikes. They should collaborate the timing of science fleet / scattering field. If you're hardcore like QEW was you even make sure to call sensor scans. They also need to call out the cooldowns on their subnukes and other major debuffs to line up with alpha strikes and give the escort pilot a good idea of when to switch, and when to build up an alpha for. Some skills like CPB work best when all the science vessels use them at the same time in conjunction with an alpha. On top of all of that they need to work with the healing cruiser to send out HoTs without over-healing. Things like Target subsystems also need to be called out so as not to put on redundant debuffs. A science vessel might need to subnuke the main target, tractor beam another, and target weapons or engines on the enemy escort. Less twitchy than heal cruiser or escort, but much more demanding of multitasking.

Basically, the escorts focus on lining up kills. The cruisers focus on lining up heals, the science vessels have a broader focus and more or less need as much awareness of everything as possible.

No matter what though, never lose your cool. If you're on TSI's vent in the rare occasion they are losing a match, you'll notice that they are still completely relaxed. Fight or flight is you enemy.

Better to have too much communication than not enough.

And be sure to turn health bars on for enemy players.

A subnuke is a terrible thing to waste, so make sure you set up an order to deliver them. All you need as one person to say "I've got the first subnuke when it's needed." If you have a sciscort, he should always be first.

Just because it's the escort's job to line up kills doesn't mean another player can't chime in if he sees a vulnerable target. Science vessels need to be ready to take over heal calling if the cruiser is lost. The roles need to be defined, but flexible.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
03-26-2012, 07:53 AM
Sound advice buddy, thanks for your time
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