Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 91
04-16-2012, 09:59 AM
Where are the players?

...
you ask me?

in front of the Transporter room hitting the quickie missions panel fore easy daily Dilithium.

Personally i was one of the biggest fans of UGC before the Foundry was a "thing" that was talked about.

At that point STO was about gaming + fun playing it.

Today STO is all about grinding that damn Dilithium...
so will i waste time playing a 3 hour Epic Foundry mission?
or will i go to that console, slapping F 3 times for 1440 dilithium and get on with my daily grind?


mmmh... yeah sorry the REWARD vs TIME part of Foundry is just a bad mechanic that has to be redone from scratch and needs new "tech".
also if i play a 2 - 3 hour mission i expect some EPIC dilithium reward for it, and not just a pitty penny.

Dilithium was supposed to be a "time spend"-currency... so where is the TIMER that counts how much dilithium i earned playing?
Nope... still stupid DAILY Quests with fixed outcomes.
Where is the Easy, Advanced, Elite multiplier for dilithium rewards?
only STF's have that.


if i can play a 3hr Foundry Mission for 8000 dilithium every afternoon, hell yeah i will do that, and i will have FUN doing so!
playing a 3 hr foundry mission for... 1/3 of 1440?
or just *for fun*?
sorry these days are over... i've got to grind grind girnd


what i am saying is:
i hope that with the Season 6 Foundry update there will be some MAJOR revamping of the reward system so that these one click missions do not count any longer and that LONG missions will have appropriate Dilithium Rewards that are properly scaled to the invested TIME.


That might not be the *end of all things* why i don't play foundry, but it's the one BIG RED BLINKING exclamation mark why i keep my distance from it.


The sad thing is, the missions i played i totally enjoyed and would place many of them even above most Cryptic Content.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 92
04-16-2012, 11:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain.Hunter View Post
Quite frankly I think most of the really good Foundry authors are making content for folks just like you. Detailed, involved stories including characters that have substance and depth to them.

Take your choice of just about anyone who has posted in this thread and the missions they have made are fantastic. I think that is why there is so much angst felt here - the terrific stuff they have made is effectively hidden from, or ignored, by the majority of the player base because of it's 'Community Authored' status. It's unfair to the authors who have put so much into creating something great they want to share - for free - with their fellow players and it's unfair to the players who are missing out on some absolutley outstanding content; the very people who seem to clammering for more new missions all the time.

Until a way is found to put Foundy content on equal footing (promotions, UI improvements, etc) with all other game content, I'm afraid it will remain the best part of the game - - that is never played by the vast majority of players.
STANDS AND APPLAUDS!!

You said this more perfectly than I could have. This is exactly correct, and without what amounts to "sponsorship" or at the very least, real support from the devs, things are unlikely to change. Sign into the community authored content for the first time and the first thing you see is a big scary screen with all kinds of warnings and legal-babble about how the devs are not responsible for any trauma, death, or dismemberment one may recieve by playing a foundry mission.

(Yes, exxagerated, but only slighty)

I remember thinking my computer might get a virus or something, lol. This sort of thing has to change.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 93
04-16-2012, 11:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CptBANG View Post
Where are the players?

...
you ask me?

in front of the Transporter room hitting the quickie missions panel fore easy daily Dilithium.

Personally i was one of the biggest fans of UGC before the Foundry was a "thing" that was talked about.

At that point STO was about gaming + fun playing it.

Today STO is all about grinding that damn Dilithium...
so will i waste time playing a 3 hour Epic Foundry mission?
or will i go to that console, slapping F 3 times for 1440 dilithium and get on with my daily grind?


mmmh... yeah sorry the REWARD vs TIME part of Foundry is just a bad mechanic that has to be redone from scratch and needs new "tech".
also if i play a 2 - 3 hour mission i expect some EPIC dilithium reward for it, and not just a pitty penny.

Dilithium was supposed to be a "time spend"-currency... so where is the TIMER that counts how much dilithium i earned playing?
Nope... still stupid DAILY Quests with fixed outcomes.
Where is the Easy, Advanced, Elite multiplier for dilithium rewards?
only STF's have that.


if i can play a 3hr Foundry Mission for 8000 dilithium every afternoon, hell yeah i will do that, and i will have FUN doing so!
playing a 3 hr foundry mission for... 1/3 of 1440?
or just *for fun*?
sorry these days are over... i've got to grind grind girnd


what i am saying is:
i hope that with the Season 6 Foundry update there will be some MAJOR revamping of the reward system so that these one click missions do not count any longer and that LONG missions will have appropriate Dilithium Rewards that are properly scaled to the invested TIME.


That might not be the *end of all things* why i don't play foundry, but it's the one BIG RED BLINKING exclamation mark why i keep my distance from it.


The sad thing is, the missions i played i totally enjoyed and would place many of them even above most Cryptic Content.
See, I don't see why you have to "grind grind grind". (Although, I *am* a Level 50 Vice Admiral, Betazoid Science Officer who doesn't do PVP or STFs, so maybe I'm different). The 1440 dilithium I get for playing 3 Foundry missions is nice, but I play because the stories are pretty much their own reward. With the Foundry, I still get that "gaming + fun playing it" feeling.

Plus, if all a person cares about is grinding and fighting, why would they go to the Foundry in the first place, since it's specifically intended for people to "create and build brand new missions and stories to share with your friends and the entire Star Trek Online community"?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 94
04-16-2012, 12:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DancingDoctor
Plus, if all a person cares about is grinding and fighting, why would they go to the Foundry in the first place, since it's specifically intended for people to "create and build brand new missions and stories to share with your friends and the entire Star Trek Online community"?
Precisely.
Why on Earth would you want to make grind grind grind maniacs to play foundry? It is like trying to sell Nitze or Kant to Michael Bay fans. That is clearly not for them.
They don't fricken care about things like "story" or "meaning" or "depth". They just want their easy 1440 DIL for whatever reason. If you make them play a story mission, let alone a Diplomacy mission, they will just hit F-F-F-F-F-F-F-F-F-F-F-F and at the end they give a 1 - What was this about? or 3 - Good mission and move on.

That is the reason I advocate to remove the DIL or change the DIL handout process for playing Foundry missions. Want grind? Fine but grind elsewhere and leave my missions alone, I don't want the attention of mindless drones.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 95
04-16-2012, 01:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DancingDoctor
See, I don't see why you have to "grind grind grind". (Although, I *am* a Level 50 Vice Admiral, Betazoid Science Officer who doesn't do PVP or STFs, so maybe I'm different). The 1440 dilithium I get for playing 3 Foundry missions is nice, but I play because the stories are pretty much their own reward. With the Foundry, I still get that "gaming + fun playing it" feeling.

Plus, if all a person cares about is grinding and fighting, why would they go to the Foundry in the first place, since it's specifically intended for people to "create and build brand new missions and stories to share with your friends and the entire Star Trek Online community"?
Agreed.

Every MMO has essentially the same basic game structure, including 'grinding'. If people are here to just grind, why not do it in WoW - or any of a couple dozen other game venues?

The difference lies in how the content, the vehicle for grinding, is set out.

I know for one I was sadly disappointed when STO first launched. Missions were bereft of anything save the simplest storylines; go here, scan 3 of this, kill 5 of that, oh, and they happen to be Klingon, or Romulan, or whatever BTW. After the first 30 days that were included I dropped it, it was no where near what a Star Trek product should be. (Can't really fault the Dev team here, they were under enormous pressures required by the very short development window to get anything out the door).That all changed when I heard about the Foundry being implemented and the Featured Episode series being rolled out. I resubbed for a month to check it out and was so impressed by the turn around with FE's like 'Colosseum' and the quality being made by Foundry authors (and Dan's changes like ESD, etc.) I decided to go lifetime on the sub.

Sadly, the Dev team is being given new directions these days to make money. Instead of quality content writting (FE's, dailies, mission chains, STFs, etc), the focus has shifted to "lockbox" items. And again, I can't fault them - their bosses are telling them what to do.

The thing is, STO can have both, in a winning combination.

The dev team can continue to focus on the quick money stuff their bosses demand and their development schedules allow for while Foundry authors create long term 'meaty' content they have the luxury of making without deadlines to meet or corporate interference. (As you said earlier DancingDoctor, and most poeple agree, much of the Foundry content is equal to or exceeds what has been put out officially, despite being hamstrung by the limited tools available).

All that is required are some of the simple things mentioned in this thread to make (good) Foundry content more visable - and viable - to the game in general.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 96
04-16-2012, 02:38 PM
I was going to work on a new foundry mission but due to the problem and feedback I got I have had to unpublish all of my missions and stop creation of my latest one due to the unacceptable behavior that was going on. Ah oh well foundry was a great ride now its over.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 97
04-16-2012, 03:06 PM
Zeux, maybe we can help you solve some issues if you tell us what the feedback was. As for the publishing bug, it will get fixed. We know from experience that they get fixed, although sometimes it takes longer than we'd like.

My 2 cents: I think that conference call they had a while back touched on some good issues. These Foundry challenges have been good about getting author's engaged, but now Cryptic needs to focus on how to bring in players to the Foundry.

I don't think rewards are the way to do it. I know my Foundry missions are not made for grinding, and I don't want players to grind them, they are meant essentially to be episodes of Star Trek, thought provoking, exciting, with quality story and quality characters (at least I hope they're quality, lol).

My suggestion: get rid of the foundry daily, it's not adding anything. The people who are just after dilithium won't do the Foundry. That's fine by me, there's plenty out there to cater to them. We also need featured foundry episodes and featured foundry series. These need to advertized right along Cryptic missions. They did it once before Foundry went to Holodeck, would it be that hard to do it again?

I'll put it out right here, right now: Cryptic, you may use my missions for these featured episodes. Please do.

As a community we're doing everything we can to get our missions out there, case in point the recent Klingon Awareness Week. Now it's time for Cryptic to step up to the plate. They brought this baby into the world, they have to remember to feed it.

And hey, authors can always do what I did back when my missions weren't getting much play, just fly through sector space and spam each zone chat! Just be prepared to get heckled a bit.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 98
04-16-2012, 06:57 PM
Basically to be nice and not break any rules i was refered to contact PWE support. The conduct issue wasn't going to be dealt with so I only have one recourse but to delete my foundry missions and stop creating any. I was going to buy some more slots but this problem got out of control and I am not getting any support from it so its a sad that it has to come to his.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 99
04-16-2012, 07:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pendra80 View Post
Precisely.
Why on Earth would you want to make grind grind grind maniacs to play foundry? It is like trying to sell Nitze or Kant to Michael Bay fans. That is clearly not for them.
They don't fricken care about things like "story" or "meaning" or "depth". They just want their easy 1440 DIL for whatever reason. If you make them play a story mission, let alone a Diplomacy mission, they will just hit F-F-F-F-F-F-F-F-F-F-F-F and at the end they give a 1 - What was this about? or 3 - Good mission and move on.

That is the reason I advocate to remove the DIL or change the DIL handout process for playing Foundry missions. Want grind? Fine but grind elsewhere and leave my missions alone, I don't want the attention of mindless drones.
I just don't understand why a grinder would even consider going to the Foundry in the first place (save for that 1440). I mean, *if* I were a grinder, wouldn't it take a lot more work to go and find 3 missions meant for grinding and then play them, as opposed to jumping into a PVP or an STF?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain.Hunter View Post
The thing is, STO can have both, in a winning combination.

The dev team can continue to focus on the quick money stuff their bosses demand and their development schedules allow for while Foundry authors create long term 'meaty' content they have the luxury of making without deadlines to meet or corporate interference. (As you said earlier DancingDoctor, and most poeple agree, much of the Foundry content is equal to or exceeds what has been put out officially, despite being hamstrung by the limited tools available).

All that is required are some of the simple things mentioned in this thread to make (good) Foundry content more visable - and viable - to the game in general.

While ideally I'd like to have the devs spend at least an equal amount of time on content and whatnot, this seems very workable.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 100
04-16-2012, 09:29 PM
I still think that the ability to sort by such things as number of maps, objects, dialogs, total size, etc. will solve a lot of problems. I know that a large file with lots of maps, objects, objectives, and dialogs is going to be better (hopefully!) Than a mission with a single objective and one map...

Grinders can find their material by sorting in the opposite order.
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