Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 31
05-09-2012, 07:48 PM
It's crazy to ask us to workaround stuff, when the actual assets are inconsistent. Just take a look at the Cardassian buildings. There is absolutely no way to predict when or where my npcs will walk through them. I myself can walk through parts of them, like they aren't solid.

Asking us to build our missions around this platform/jello bug is unreasonable.

Some objects are solid. Others are like quicksand. None of it is consistent. The npcs may or may not shoot through it. If you've played missions when it didn't happen, then the author was simply lucky with the props.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 32
05-09-2012, 07:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Akrilon View Post
As a foundry author, I have to respectfully disagree. Missions behave differently in the editor than they do when published, and once published, they can behave unpredictably. Even when published, multiple runs through the mission doesn't guarantee the absence of bugs that occasionally pop up only under special circumstances.

If foundry authors played it safe and never attempted to create their own maps, working only within the limited, default templates that are given to us by Cryptic, then I think the Foundry experience would be very bland. The bottom line is that bugs such as the bridge officers jumping through the walls and other pathing issues are things that are beyond the control of the author, save the solution of never changing any of the default maps by putting up any walls, doors, objects etc, that the NPCs routinely get caught on.

It's a shame that players who don't understand the limitations of the foundry hold the authors accountable for bugs that should've been addressed by the developers by now. Unfortunately, there's no real way to educate people on this, if they haven't dabbled in the Foundry themselves.

Until the fixes, people like you will in my opinion, continue to hold the author accountable to unreasonable standards... and you're not really to blame. You expect the mission to be polished, and shouldn't have to worry about who's fault it is.. the author is the logical person to hold accountable, despite it being out of their control.
You and others assume I don't know many of the bugs are a part of the engine. I accept that it is, but I expect an author to make an effort similar to a director who doesn't have the budget/tech they want and be creative in telling the story despite the limitations. Not subject me the player to something known to be a problem and wash your hands of it.

Also, I'm not talking about a glitch here or there, but something which bugs out repeatably. If that's the case it shouldn't be there.

I know it may seem like a lot to ask of people who invest a lot of their personal time and energy, but if a mission is buggy I'd like to know about. If the author doesn't want to address it fine. But, please don't complain if some prefer to avoid buggy missions. Accept the review and move on.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 33
05-09-2012, 08:15 PM
I respectfully ask (in a mild attempt to not completely derail this topic)
1)what missions have you played Iamid that fit your qualifications

and
2) what is the name of your mission that also maintains these qualifications
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 34
05-09-2012, 09:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluegeek View Post
Maybe they should require that players be Foundry reviewers in order to rate missions?
Considering the speed at which trolls 1-star new missions, many of them probably are reviewers.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 35
05-09-2012, 09:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by castmodean View Post
I respectfully ask (in a mild attempt to not completely derail this topic)
1)what missions have you played Iamid that fit your qualifications

and
2) what is the name of your mission that also maintains these qualifications
I liked Red Omans (name may have changed one way or the other): KDF zombie slasher mostly ground (indoor&outdoor).

There was 2 part Orion themed mission set. Don't remember the names, but the 2nd included a tacticle battleline w/incoming artillery & tacticle beam ins.

Other then those there's 1 or 2 others, but I don't remember the names. I rarely look anymore as I mentioned, probably stopped around the time of the Season 4 ground changes. I don't know if they're still on or have been updated. And no, those probably aren't w/o bugs. But, nothing which breaks gameplay.

I looked around @ the editor, but never put a story/mission together.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 36
05-09-2012, 09:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by castmodean View Post
Another issue with the rating setup as it stands right now are reviews like this http://i1093.photobucket.com/albums/...e/review-1.jpg (Brandon can probably get you a copy of the link if you don't want to look at the cap of the review itself) As we have no recourse on these reviews, these reviews sit there, visible to all, earned or not, and thats even if they leave feedback.
Maybe it's just me, but that actually makes me want to try that mission.

But I see your point.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 37
05-09-2012, 10:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamid
I looked around @ the editor, but never put a story/mission together.
Until you actually take the time to make a mission and then try to fix bugs and respond to reviewers, you're just an armchair critic. You tend to get a little more 'perspective' when you actually have to spend your own time and effort on doing things yourself.

I challenge you to have the same attitude when it's your efforts on the judging table. Just sayin'.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 38
05-10-2012, 12:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeroniusRex
What if you don't want to complete it because it borders on slashfic and that's not your thing?

What if you think the story is derivative or is basically plagiaristic of some other Foundry author's work?
The most important reason im my opinion would be: The mission cannot even be completed. Be it a Foundry bug, an error by the maker, or because the player cannot solve a puzzle. There needs to be a way to inform the author and others of the issue.

What maybe should exist is a way to make such reviews "go away" once the issue has been resolved. Maybe simply a way for the author to click on a review and say "issue resolved" and the original player getting an automated message: "You issue reported with Foundry Mission XYZ may be resolved. Click here to start the mission". (It is obvious to me that this would actually be very difficult to implement with the existing infrastructure that I am aware of as a player... ). So even if you can'T just delete the review and pretend you fixed something, at least there is a reasonable chance a player retries and alters his review.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 39
05-10-2012, 01:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkfat View Post
This reminds of when one reviewer criticized my mission, saying that "The moon in the sky is transparent. You can see stars behind it. Please fix."
Seriously...wow.

I am sure every foundry author has had weird reviews:

I had a mission where i 100% needed to test a mechnic before going live (wander pathing) so i published with the description:
"This is NOT a full mission. It is to test a feature only. Please do not play or review"

You can guess what happened.

Also people with the black block graphics issue also complain too, even though its not the missions fault.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 40
05-10-2012, 10:19 PM
I think it's fair to point out to you Zero, or anyone else monitoring this thread, of this one too.

http://forums.startrekonline.com/sho...d.php?t=269901

Not really the same topic, but a lot of things cross over between them IMO.
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