Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,163
# 21
08-25-2012, 08:14 PM
Originally Posted by levi3 View Post
I can't fathom why anyone else would spend real money on buying Zen to convert to dilth unless you have so much money you use it to light your fireplace in yout 20 bedroom mansion.

Looking at the falling prices on the exchange soon you will only get 100 dilth for each Zen point.
Do not forget those of us who have a Stipend. We do not have to spend anything to exchange for Dilithium.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,143
# 22
08-25-2012, 09:52 PM
Originally Posted by levi3 View Post
I can't fathom why anyone else would spend real money on buying Zen to convert to dilth unless you have so much money you use it to light your fireplace in yout 20 bedroom mansion.

Looking at the falling prices on the exchange soon you will only get 100 dilth for each Zen point.

Not burning money in my fireplace. Heck, I don't even spend the money on firewood. We have a gas fireplace that we rarely use. Low cost.

I live in a 3 bedroom 2 bath duplex. I have a budget. A periodic purchase of Zen is in the budget.
STO Forum member since before February 2010.
STO Academy's excellent skill planner here: Link
I actually avoid success entirely. It doesn't get me what I want, and the consequences for failure are slim. -- markhawman
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 189
# 23
08-25-2012, 10:47 PM
Originally Posted by levi3 View Post
I can't fathom why anyone else would spend real money on buying Zen to convert to dilth unless you have so much money you use it to light your fireplace in yout 20 bedroom mansion.

Looking at the falling prices on the exchange soon you will only get 100 dilth for each Zen point.
What else am I going to do with my monthly stipend?

Yeah some of us still subscribe monthly.

z store
costume packs
doff packs
lockbox keys (if your into that)
miscellaneous (acount addons etc.)

Ship weapons
Ship consoles
Ground Weapons
Personal Shields
Starbase Assignments
Crafting Materials

In many ways Dilithium is much more valuable to me than Zen. I've already got all the ships i'll ever need. I'm sure i'm missing some things too, but you get the picture. At some point you just don't have as much use for Zen as you used to.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 131
# 24
08-25-2012, 11:34 PM
Originally Posted by ariseabove View Post
Mate I work like alot of people now I can easy spend $100- $200 at the pub in one night.

So for entertainment value STO is very cheap and I don't get a hangover the next day lol.
Thanks for mentioning that. Working in a pub, one can readily see what people will spend on fleeting pleasures. They're called vices for a reason. Me, games are my second biggest vice. I don't spend any measurable amount of money on cigarettes, booze, coffees, or even chocolate bars unless they're wholesale at a reasonable price.

Of course, as a Commerce major, my response is always to spend smarter.
Hence: My_Awesome_STO_Exchange_Spreadsheet.xls which you cannot has.

But I definitely am buying less dil than I did before season 6. Yet Dil is still the absolute best way to turn Zen into EC through Unreps. It will have to hit rock bottom for that to change. What makes me shake my head is seeing people STILL talk about buying close to 100 Lock box keys and getting upset they don't have anything worth keeping from it. Stop sooner. You're just making all the key flippers rich. And possibly enough Lobi for a Widow Fighter. Sigh.

=/\= Transwarp 10.0 Victory Achieved on 26-July-2012, Six Months After F2P =/\=

Last edited by brackynews; 08-25-2012 at 11:43 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,651
# 25
08-26-2012, 03:14 AM
Originally Posted by thecosmic1 View Post
Why is it so hard for you to grasp that there are people who are willing to pay for that 10% bonus in STO just like they are at Target, Jewel, Ford, Wal-mart, and everywhere else we buy things?

The answer is obvious as it is the main problem with the f2p model. If you're not one of the big spenders you fall behind. Simple as that. All f2p games like to say how they're not like that but in fact most are. Eventually people realize that and decide to either become big spenders, to always be behind, or simply be a churn player and leave for whatever else catches their fancy.

The problem is STO not only had a pre-existing playerbase, its players are usually also trek fans, so even if they want to leave they feel doubly trapped. They feel trapped because they've already invested of themselves in the game and they love the IP. In all honesty everyone should've approached F2P STO as a new game and decided if they liked the model (and the trends it would inevitably follow) instead of thinking it'd still be the same game... but how could anyone do that? They had roots in the game and they loved the IP.

As far as money mattering as it does in RL.... you need to realize that games are mostly about escapism. Even if they can't afford a nice car, fancy clothes or a big house they can escape to a place where they CAN get a shiny starship and live adventures... except now RL is intruding into their escapism... and again their limited funds just can't keep up with those with more disposable income. The game isn't about providing a fun place for everyone anymore, but rather about catering to the few large spenders. Its a mess really, they clearly aim everything at a certain type of customer but need to at least give lip service to content for everyone else... except SBs really shine a light on how non content they are.

Its simple business sense, but it also causes resentment when its rubbed too hard on player's faces.

Edit: I have a LTS but I do see both sides of it. I can even understand WHY the SBs are such money grabs, everyone remember the comment made by Stahl (I think it was him)? That everything they do has to have a demonstrable profit? What we're experiencing is the result of that design rule

Last edited by skyranger1414; 08-26-2012 at 03:22 AM.
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,395
# 26
08-26-2012, 04:57 AM
I'm with thecosmic on this one. If people didn't want to pay $20 for a ship, they simply wouldn't, and Cryptic would either lower prices or lose out on revenue.

It's a free world and if Cryptic can make a living satisfying a market for people who want the stuff they sell, all the power to them.
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,270
# 27
08-26-2012, 05:59 AM
Originally Posted by skyranger1414 View Post
The answer is obvious as it is the main problem with the f2p model. If you're not one of the big spenders you fall behind.
Fall behind at what?

I do STFS all the time where I generally use my free RA ship. I do Dailies every day, with my free RA ship. Do I care if it takes me 1 minute longer to do an STF or Daily because I am using a free ship? Not at all.

The only place a C-Store ship gives someone an advantage is in PvP - and the PvP community in this game is quite small compared to the PvE community. But even if you are a PvPer it's massively easy to earn Dilithium in this game and convert it to Zen and buy whatever ship you want.

I earn over 17,000 Dilithium every single day just playing 2-2.5 hours. I average between 500,000 and 600,000 Dilithium per month. At the current Exchange rate that is between 3,300 and 4,000 Zen just from playing the game. You can buy any ship you want in the game each month just playing. I know this to be true as I haven't purchased any CP/Zen from Cryptic in 7 months and I own every Fed ship, Fed Uniform, and Pet the game has released - and I currently have over 15,000 Zen on my account.

You don't need to be a "big spender" in STO to get everything you want - assuming you don't want it all by tomorrow.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 158
# 28
08-26-2012, 06:32 AM
Originally Posted by levi3 View Post
Its funny I explained the starbase thing - in simple terms to a mildly retarded person(IQ in the 80's) who I work with at a volunteer job

After explaining that a lot of people are spending tons of money for ships that are only 10% better than current ships(or a tiny bit as explained) and tons of time as well - and that for 90%(most) of these people the ships will make no real difference in their ability to fight in PvE(or the bad guys) and that within 6 months there will be ships coming out better than those that they could get without all the work(via the Zen Store) and they could get several of these new ships with the money they spent for the price of 1 starbase ship

His response "are they stupid?"

My response - "some are, some are bored and have nothing better to do(apparently I am one of those - athought I have the monthly sub from the sale - I would not spend another dime buying dilth) and then there could be lots who are being bullied into contributing dilth(the pink/purple rocks) in their fleets"
This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Perfect World Entertainment Community Rules and Policies . ~syberghost

Ask anyone who sets up a ship correctly, a 10% advantage over anyone else can go along way in pvp. Hense why some people say the jem'harda ship or other zen ships is over powered. That's the reason I fly with a galor, recluse and trying to get hold of a Jem'harda.

Last edited by syberghost; 08-26-2012 at 06:26 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 352
# 29
08-26-2012, 11:43 AM
As a Autistic Person which is Considered by some a retardation, I fully Understand the Benefit of 10% OVER someone with 10% less. It in the end comes down to numbers. These Stats in the game Give you a significant Boost over someone. If we have the same ship, But mine is 10% boosted then yours and we open fire at the same time, hit the skills at the same time, you are still going to blow up before I do, because I am doing 10% better. If we each worked as hard as each other but I received 10% more then you, I am Still doing better. 10% Can become a large number depending on which way the scales of Fate swing. I do not Drinking, I do not smoke, I bust my ass for my Family to support them. Keep a roof over there head. In the end How people either take there Finances and purchase a fancier Car, blu-ray player, Console, Hardware for a Clone (that would be a Personal computer to the less intelligent you speak down to) it is up to us how we spend our money to keep ourselves happy. I have a Life Time membership as you can tell with the tag I have. I burn money into this game just like I burn money onto my family. I am sure if we looked at what you spend you money on compared to what we spend it on we would ALL have a difference of opinion on foolish spending. Personally you will not see me waste money on Alcohol or Sports games. Some people where I used to live drop near 5$ a gallon for Gas just to take there vehicle a mile down the road, As well as spend 12$ on a pack of Marlboro Cigarettes. Some Blow it on illicit Drugs. It is these things that make us all different and all unique. It is also these different things that Make us happy. If I feel like dropping $300 into Digital Game, Vs dropping $300 for a lapdance or a night at the bar, it is what makes each of us happy. In the end, We all try to remain happy and should not have to be questioned Why we do things to make us happy. It is the simple factor of "It makes us happy". I do not understand why you do not Drop Money into a game you play, it shows support for the game you enjoy and helps Keep the company running to continue playing the game. Afterall if no one pushes money into the company none in the company would be able to feed there families nor would they want to keep pushing countless hours into Developing a program for you to enjoy at a rate that does not support There own habbits. Be happy for us, For you in the end enjoy what we spend so you do not have to.
Proud Fleet Commander in Garfon's Renegades!
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 33
# 30
08-26-2012, 04:02 PM
Originally Posted by thecosmic1 View Post
Why does someone buy a Blue Ray over a DvD even though it's only 10% better?
Actually, the storage capacity of a Blu-Ray disc is over 500% more than a DVD (25 GB Blu-Ray single layer-single side vs. 4.7 GB DVD single layer-single side), and allow video to be shown in a much larger resolution and much clearer than DVD, and even in 3-D (which a DVD cannot store due to... file size limitation).

[condescending Wonka]Tell me again how a Blu-Ray is only 10% better than DVD... [/condescending Wonka]

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