Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,315
# 11
09-13-2012, 03:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stofsk View Post
The short answer is 'no' because I really hate that uniform design. I prefer cryptic's variants over it any day of the week.

The longer answer is that those episodes took place in timelines that became invalidated due to the acts of the various characters (Picard was time hopping thanks to Q, Adm. Janeway went back in time purposefully to change the timeline, Jake Sisko killed himself to prevent his dad from becoming permanently stuck in subspace or whatever was happening to him in that episode). So it's not anymore valid than choosing some other uniform.
but the key thing to keep in mind is its useed in future timeline's more then ones so logic say that the one feds will end up with
swimwear off risa not fixed
system Lord Baal is dead
Quote:
Originally Posted by valoreah View Post
It's not their fault you feel trolled by the new ability to be immune to your disco ball, sorry'boutit.
Starfleet Veteran
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Posts: 1,429
# 12
09-13-2012, 03:40 AM
I would be happy if their NPCs could finally single out a uniform to be standard and have it be one that at least looks like it could be fro ma show or movie of the time period.
Maybe take the AGT uni and improve on it.
Some players (myself included) already improve them with a different and more traditional color pattern.
Buff them up a bit to make them more in line with the TNG movie uniform and you would really have something.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,251
# 13
09-13-2012, 03:42 AM
I prefer them personally, however I'd like an option for both factions were one can choose a particular uniform and that is what they see on all NPC's. On Starbases, Fleet Starbases and even onboard Ships.

It makes sense as everyone has their version of what is nice and what is horrid. Might also encourage people to buy c-store costumes if once unlock them you can use it on NPCs. Having it character rather than an account feature would be cool as well so different characters could use different uniforms for NPC.
Quote:
Originally Posted by macronius View Post
Cryptic is sloppy. Breaking News at 11. This is what happens when there is no outline or plan and you just make up **** as you go along.
Quote:
Originally Posted by shredder75 View Post
We can tell our great grandchildren, "In my day, our cloaks were so sensitive that even dialogue broke them and we couldn't change our clothes!"
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,203
# 14
09-13-2012, 03:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by daan2006 View Post
but the key thing to keep in mind is its useed in future timeline's more then ones so logic say that the one feds will end up with
Yes I know it is used several times but that doesn't alter the fact that those timelines were discontinued due to the plots of the episodes they took place in.

Hell in 'The Visitor' we see Captain Nog (edited here for correction) command the old USS Defiant which was brought out of mothballs. Jadzia was at the helm. Both shouldn't be possible because the original Defiant was destroyed and Jadzia was killed off.

In the timeline of 'All Good Things...' Deanna Troi mysteriously died, which caused a rift to develop between Riker and Worf. Last we saw in Nemesis Riker and Troi were happily married and presumably went off to have further adventures on the USS Titan. She didn't die, there was no feud between Worf.

In 'Endgame' Admiral Janeway went back in time to outright change the timeline. These future timelines are all invalidated by the end of the episodes in question. It seems funny that everything else that happens in these episodes would be so different but the uniforms would stay the same. But really my point is only that these uniforms appear in futures that turn out to be unrealised possibilities anyway.
Career Officer
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Posts: 5,315
# 15
09-13-2012, 03:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stofsk View Post
Yes I know it is used several times but that doesn't alter the fact that those timelines were discontinued due to the plots of the episodes they took place in.

Hell in 'The Visitor' we see Captain Nog (edited here for correction) command the old USS Defiant which was brought out of mothballs. Jadzia was at the helm. Both shouldn't be possible because the original Defiant was destroyed and Jadzia was killed off.

In the timeline of 'All Good Things...' Deanna Troi mysteriously died, which caused a rift to develop between Riker and Worf. Last we saw in Nemesis Riker and Troi were happily married and presumably went off to have further adventures on the USS Titan. She didn't die, there was no feud between Worf.

In 'Endgame' Admiral Janeway went back in time to outright change the timeline. These future timelines are all invalidated by the end of the episodes in question. It seems funny that everything else that happens in these episodes would be so different but the uniforms would stay the same. But really my point is only that these uniforms appear in futures that turn out to be unrealised possibilities anyway.
ok its was Captain Nog and Jadzia being in it well it was dun before she was killed off and the Defiant was destroyed and replaced with the same ship type not the name but was later change back to Defiant

also you talk about all good things but did you forget its was all in picards head dun by Q to see if humans had it in them to expand there minds and who would know better then Q to know what the Feds would have been whereing just a thought

yes janeway change the timeline in endgames but that was a time line that did happen before it was changes

and you can say all you want them time line are gone and i will come back it keeps poping up in the future
swimwear off risa not fixed
system Lord Baal is dead
Quote:
Originally Posted by valoreah View Post
It's not their fault you feel trolled by the new ability to be immune to your disco ball, sorry'boutit.

Last edited by daan2006; 09-13-2012 at 04:03 AM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 11
# 16
09-13-2012, 04:20 AM
I agree that AGT uniform is poorly designed, and I agree that all timelines it is presented in are invalid. But the thing that has bothered me for a while is this: why should voyager returning early alter some committee's choice of a new uniform style? None of the Voyager crew would have any say over the uniform change, so why wouldn't the transition happen since that timeline was just a progression of reality undone by impatience and a "temporal prime directive be damned" attitude. (DTI asleep at the wheel on that one...)

I'd love to hear a good explanation as to why I'm supposed to believe these time travel/alternate future scenarios are so effected by the "star" crew. Example: I mean, sure, the Kelvin being destroyed altered things and cause Starfleet to prepare greater defenses...but why would that change the shape and size of the Enterprise so radically? If anything, shouldn't it just make the development of the Constitution class happen earlier? And why would it change the uniforms? Voyager returning, why would the uniforms change? AGT was undone be Picard having knowledge of the future and telling his crew about it. Thus Deanna doesn't die, Riker realizes life is precious and pursues her and Worf fades to the background. (I got nothing on the subject of Warp 13 though...) But WHY would the uniform change? What about those events being undone would negate the vote of an unseen board of quartermasters that are unrelated?

I agree with the spirit of this thread though. There needs to be a quality standard uniform for all NPCs.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,203
# 17
09-13-2012, 04:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dbosco2 View Post
I agree that AGT uniform is poorly designed, and I agree that all timelines it is presented in are invalid. But the thing that has bothered me for a while is this: why should voyager returning early alter some committee's choice of a new uniform style?

*snip*
I don't know. Why would these different timelines have the same exact costume? We know why (out of universe): it's because they already had that prop available and it would cost money to design another costume. But inside the context of the show? All of those timelines were unrealised realities anyway, so why NOT say that the uniform is unrealised as well?

EDIT Hell in 'The Visitor', another line was how the Dominion War never even happened. We don't bat an eyelash at this and the other inconsistencies in this episode with what ended up happening even later in the show, but the costumes are somehow always destined to come about? It can't be both.

In the end they did end up with a new uniform change by First Contact, and that could easily be where the timeline diverged. In AGT and The Visitor, the Dominion weren't a threat and the borg weren't mentioned either, and things seemed to descend into a new cold war with the klingons. Maybe the quartermaster at the time was a different person from the one who designed the FC uniforms. But this is all sort of anciliary to my point; that it's not really any more valid to base the STO era uniforms on the AGT ones because that was a timeline that was outright discontinued in every instance it appeared. I could just as easily say that the FC uniforms became the one settled on by the 'prime' timeline because that's the last uniform we ever see anyone wear by Nemesis.

Last edited by stofsk; 09-13-2012 at 04:48 AM.
Career Officer
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Posts: 427
# 18
09-13-2012, 05:33 AM
STO's canon is dictated by Cryptic, which subverted those future variants for their own designs and a story about openning up the uniform restrictions. That's where the canon argument ends.

Now, ideally i wonder if they could allow uniforms to be a client-side option. This way you could set up a series of uniforms based on certain variables (perhaps something letting you be as basic or indepth as you want) which would change all the npc's and other players wearing uniform slotted costumes, this would be viewable by you alone. The player next to you, with their own client-side uniform options, would see you, other players and npc's wearing the uniforms in their options.
Joined August 2008
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,261
# 19
09-13-2012, 05:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cormoran View Post
STO's canon is dictated by Cryptic, which subverted those future variants for their own designs and a story about openning up the uniform restrictions. That's where the canon argument ends.
Which is a poor explanation for "everyone would want to buy a specific uniform he has seen on TV"

I have come to think that in STO there is absolutely no canon whatsoever, no story and no progress. It's just a digital playground for us players to play with all sorts of Star Trek themed "toys".

Although I'd welcome a uniform amongst NPCs, even the STO default ones if only they would be consistent I like the thought of the default sierra costume tiles come with the late TNG uniform color pattern. This way, it'd sinmply be an update on the materials used as the STO costumes kinda look like a mixture of classic uniforms and the "combat armour" prototype used in the dS9 ground combat episodes ths simply offering better protection.
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Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,825
# 20
09-13-2012, 07:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cormoran View Post
STO's canon is dictated by Cryptic, which subverted those future variants for their own designs and a story about openning up the uniform restrictions. That's where the canon argument ends.

Now, ideally i wonder if they could allow uniforms to be a client-side option. This way you could set up a series of uniforms based on certain variables (perhaps something letting you be as basic or indepth as you want) which would change all the npc's and other players wearing uniform slotted costumes, this would be viewable by you alone. The player next to you, with their own client-side uniform options, would see you, other players and npc's wearing the uniforms in their options.
That would be the perfect sollution in my opinion.
Not only we wouldn't have to see those hideous combat armors anymore if we don't want them, but the word "uniform" would have it's meaning back.

To the thread starter:
I would love to use the AGT uniform on all my characters and their BOFFs but i just hate that ugly cumberbund (i hope thats the right expression).

Don't missunderstand me, i like the general style of that uniform, simple and elegant, much more than Cryptics plastic uniforms.

On female tons it can look quite OK, but on males it looks stupid and rediculus, because that stupid cumberbund it is much to high/big.
IF we had a alternative version without a cumberbund or with a significant smaller one i would happily use it.

EDIT:
I just made a mock up, to show how the AGT uniform would look like without cumberbund.
I don't know what you think, but i think it looks way better without it.
With Cumberbund
Without Cumberbund
Since the servers are down right now i only had this picture to work with, i hope it is ok that way.




Live long and prosper.

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T6 Guardian Class design / A 25th century Ambassador refit

Last edited by yreodred; 09-13-2012 at 08:11 AM.
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