Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 547
# 11
09-16-2012, 05:59 PM
Quote:
"Dstahl: Well that depends on what you define as ?major?. In Season 6 we are making a massive overhaul of the underlying code that makes the Foundry work, but my expectation is that players are not going to deem this as a ?major? change."

Ask Cryptic from June.
We were the ones who said it was going to be major. I still think it is. Call me crazy but seeing what Neverwinter has, where TONS of our feedback has been implemented and addressed, leaves me hopeful. We're now using a code base which lets them implement a lot of that here. But then again, I think foundations are huge.

His additional comments about the issue in that ask cryptic go into a lot more detail about why I still think this is big.

But he called it, his expectations do apply in this case. Hopefully, as time goes on, you feel we do get an honest major change. No doubt that would please everyone.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,953
# 12
09-16-2012, 06:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by designationxr377 View Post
We were the ones who said it was going to be major. I still think it is. Call me crazy but seeing what Neverwinter has, where TONS of our feedback has been implemented and addressed, leaves me hopeful. We're now using a code base which lets them implement a lot of that here. But then again, I think foundations are huge.

His additional comments about the issue in that ask cryptic go into a lot more detail about why I still think this is big.

But he called it, his expectations do apply in this case. Hopefully, as time goes on, you feel we do get an honest major change. No doubt that would please everyone.
Yes, I remember the quote. It was the first dash of cold water on what was (up to that point) being hyped as a really big update that would have noticeable results. I'm just kind of let down by what is noticeable in Sept.

Where is the stuffing, ya know? Will we see it by June of next year?

It wasn't us alone that hyped it. Several dev posts, including previous ones by dstahl implied or openly stated that there was a huge update in the works. I just want to see stuff, not continue hoping that stuff is being done behind the scenes.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,826
# 13
09-17-2012, 11:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kirksplat View Post
Every one of these features is buggy, especially multi-select.

3D asset preview is nice when it works, but it would probably be nicer if the object dimensions matched the values of coordinates.

Again, every one of these new features is rough and buggy, and I'm staring at the bugs that have been there for a year and a half.
QTF

It took me about 3 months to finally overcome my fear of the interior of just about every prop, NPC, and whatever else in the Foundry because of that 3D preview, only to find upon my return that Foundry functions that were key to my next mission had been broken, causing CTDs whenever I tried to make the mission that way. Which, mind you, was the only way I could have done it given my capabilities as an author and a person.

Edit: Quoted Truth For? Wtf?

I won't fix it, you know what it was supposed to be.
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Oh, lovely, I can't even requote the Douglas Adams quote I used to have here I WANT IT BACK!!!!
Dalo Lorn
DaloLorn, StarCraft 2 Roleplayer and proud of it.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,379
# 14
09-17-2012, 11:36 AM
Kirkfat, I think I can sum up what happened to the update (this probably applies to just about anything else Cryptic promises) in a colorful metaphor:

The devs take the update and put it in a blender. They press the "obliterate" button, then forget about it. Several months later, the moldly concoction slides out of the cryptic blender in bits and pieces, full of bugs and maggots. Then the devs say they'll get the whole thing out and clean out the bugs, but in truth no one wants to touch the disguesting mess sitting there.

The multi-select and other stuff that's come out are the bits and pieces. And of course they're full of bugs. So the choice the devs face is to spend time sifting through their blender fixing everything or just dumping the contents out on us, coating the foundry in a very nasty and very bugged layer of 'updates'.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramming Speed at its finest.
[Combat (Self)] Your Ramming Speed III deals 158125 (201492) Kinetic Damage(Critical) to [Player's Scimitar].
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Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,700
# 15
09-17-2012, 02:17 PM
I've been accused in the past of trying to infringe on people's right to vent, so I'll try and be sensitive to that, but I do want to throw in my two cents.

By all means, bugs need to be fixed.
By all means, tell Cryptic what you want added in the Foundry.

Do not expect it tomorrow.

I'll tell a little story: I run a newspaper. I have a staff of 5. Myself, an office manager, an ad salesperson, an ad designer, one staff writer and me. The staff writer and I do all the stories and take all the photos for news and sports. That size of a staff is pretty much all we can afford.

So last week I get a visitor who spends 20-30 minutes haranguing about not covering junior high sports. Now, we have just one public school system (one high school, one junior high, two grade schools) and we have a technical college which has several sports programs. I and my sports writer do my best to cover the high school and college sports, but we're only two people, and we also have to do the rest of the news. We do not have the resources to cover away games in person, so we either listen to them on the radio or rely on coaches to send us stuff. Coaches are, shall we say, hit and miss. Some are great about sending scores, some are not.

Now, this lady had a grandson on the middle school football team, so she thought I should drop everything and cover that in great detail, never mind that there were two high school games at the exact same time as the only home middle school football game so far this season.

Requesting that I give priority to the middle school is fine, but I am the one who has to decide where to put my resources, and I choose to give more importance to the high school and college games because that's what I feel (not having hard data) the majority my readers want to hear about.

As I was discussing this with her, I realized how similar it is to conversations between devs and players. Here I was with a consumer who was loudly proclaiming that she wanted something very specific given priority, and I did not have the resources to give it that priority. I can, and have, gotten together with the school district so I can have more middle school scores regularly sent to me. She probably wouldn't call that giving her what she wanted.

I would love for Cryptic to drop everything and put in all the bug fixes, improvements and additions to the Foundry that I want, but I know that is not going to happen. They are going to put their resources behind what they think will do them the most good. At some point, I imagine their priorities will swing back to the Foundry, but I don't know when.

At the end of the day, I have to choose to use the Foundry I have in front of me - or not.
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 844
# 16
09-18-2012, 12:53 AM
The changes do make things a lot easier. Sorting by alphabetical order saves a lot of time that I previously pissed away trying to find anything in the damn list. I'm talking about hours of time in aggregate spent just scrolling through the list in frustration.

The increase in the detail limit is a major improvement, perhaps as big as any features they can add. The previous limit was so incredibly, well, limiting.

Basically at this point I just accept whatever I can get. As a result, I can't really be disappointed.

The idea behind the Foundry is good, execution has been maybe a C-. But, realistically, I've long since come to the conclusion that this is what to expect from the STO dev team. They severely lack resources or something. Otherwise the game would not have been run how it has been (content drought, now apparently not even bothering with story content, etc).


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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 844
# 17
09-18-2012, 01:08 AM
Just as an example, the new multi-select ability just saved me 5-10 minutes when I decided to move 10 small monitors to a different wall.

While the actual capabilities of the Foundry may not have been improved, usability certainly has.


Click here for my Foundry tutorial on Creating A Custom Interior Map.
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