Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,014
# 111
10-10-2012, 12:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stark2k View Post
It amazes me how ludicrous it sounds when people cry fowl because in essence they desire folks to wait in line, for "PERKS," out of all things. As I stated before that these perks should be given off the bat, It is akin to buying a collector's edition Plus.

The concept of "Vet rewards" is best removed all together; If anything, the Vet Rewards should just be in "TITLE" only. Much like accolades for accomplishments.

Why does it matter if you get it now or later? In the end you'll attain it. Thing is, its an ego thing going around stating "Look at my shiny Toy." I deserve it first because I played STO since day one, no other need apply.

I am happy that new Lifers get all the virtual perks right off the bat - I say again, play the game, enjoy STO, make friends, and continue to support STO
So you wouldn't be upset if you waited in line for a very long time and someone just walks by you and got the goodies before you did?

That's what people are really angry about, it's not about the titles or the perks. Its that we waited a very long time and when we finally finish line of the 1000 days, Cryptic trips us and rushes someone to the finish line before us. Which really sends a negative message that they value money more than those who been putting money of new LTSs than those who steadily supported and put money into this game since before Day 1.
NO to ARC!

Season 9.5 = STO's NGE is Here! Welcome to the Grind!

New Crafting = It's not Crafting, is an overblown Reputation System.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,458
# 112
10-10-2012, 12:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stark2k View Post
It amazes me how ludicrous it sounds when people cry fowl because in essence they desire folks to wait in line, for "PERKS," out of all things.
That is absolutely what some of us expect .
It is also about saying that I've played nice . I've waited . I did my dues . I supported Cryptic . I got promoted slowly .
Yet you have no problem with someone else essentially buying that same promotion .
You know ... , I wish STO didn't mirror RL this much .


Quote:
Thing is, its an ego thing going around stating "Look at my shiny Toy." I deserve it first because I played STO since day one, no other need apply.
Who said no other need apply ?
I don't see anyone in the forums saying : don't pay your dues .
But I guess they should ... ,'cause why pay your dues when you can buy them , right ?

Last edited by aelfwin1; 10-10-2012 at 12:30 AM.
Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,994
# 113
10-10-2012, 12:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by azurianstar View Post
So you wouldn't be upset if you waited in line for a very long time and someone just walks by you and got the goodies before you did?

That's what people are really angry about, it's not about the titles or the perks. Its that we waited a very long time and when we finally finish line of the 1000 days, Cryptic trips us and rushes someone to the finish line before us. Which really sends a negative message that they value money more than those who been putting money of new LTSs than those who steadily supported and put money into this game since before Day 1.
Again with lines, that don't exist.

Players are mad because they won't be able to fly around and show off their toys, and feel special when they get a PM from someone asking where they get that from, and the player with a smile says, its a Vet reward for I am special.


Career Officer
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 170
# 114
10-10-2012, 12:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by aelfwin1 View Post
That is absolutely what some of us expect .
It is also about saying that I've played nice . I've waited . I did my dues . I supported Cryptic . I got promoted slowly .
Yet you have no problem with someone else essentially buying that same promotion .
You know ... , I wish STO didn't mirror RL this much .




Who said no other need apply ?
I don't see anyone in the forums saying : don't pay your dues .
But I guess they should ... ,'cause why pay your dues when you can buy them , right ?

Veteran Rewards are a FAIL concept which most new and even old MMOs are slowly retiring from.

1 ) As MMOs gets older, the path to the highest Reward gets ridiculously far away and often potential subscribers will even wonder if the game still be there for them to achieve it.

2 ) Players tend to expect always better and better perk/reward as they achieve higher milestones. The problem is that most often, there is only a handful of really dedicated players left that will actually grab the highest reward. So devs waste lot of time and energy to devise great stuff that only a few selected people will get to enjoy? Bad business practice right there.

3 ) Some unique Titles or Accolades for very old players can make sense since they are cheap dev resource investment and i woudl not be surprised if that would be somewhat preserved in a way or another.

4 ) At this point, for Cryptic to convince people to jump into a Lifetime subscription, they really needed to "sweeten the pot" and getting rid of an archaic old school model at the same time is a very clever move from them imho.

That is my own humble opinion.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 351
# 115
10-10-2012, 12:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by aelfwin1 View Post
How do you know the din't run out of cups ? Again .
Even if PWE cuts off their cup supply like Atari apparently did, it won't kill the game. The only thing that's likely to kill the game is CBS getting persnickety with the license, or PWE deciding the resources here would be better used elsewhere, which isn't likely to happen since...

(a) it's cheap to keep an MMO going sans-development, and hard not to turn some kind of profit there, thus it's always somewhat worthwhile to do as opposed to simply shutting down.

(b) Champions Online isn't spectacularly more successful than STO, so there's really no sign that Cryptic as an entity can pull off something spectacularly more successful, and thus more worthy of the involved resources. Nor does it make sense to divert resources there.

(c) they're currently running another MMO and developing a third. Realistically it would always make more sense to shift labor and run this in maintenance mode than shutter any doors. Don't need a lot of cups where there's a minimum of people. And should the game pick up when, say, the new Trek movie comes out? They shift people back.

(d) Champions Online seems to be doing worse business than STO, and seems to have been doing worse business than STO all along, and yet it's still up and running, even without $25 ships (yet) or lottery boxes that are anywhere near as abusive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tali9999 View Post
Go tell that to my City Of Heroes friends and to NCSoft.

Sometimes, it is simpler to shut down a game than put it into maintenance mode.
Nah, CoX was a whole 'nother ballgame. That was an executive decision at NCSoft to refocus on other products using other types of revenue streams which are (or at least were at the time) showing a greater success rate. There's no such avenue here. PWE has nothing more successful at Cryptic to focus those resources into. Cryptic has two launched products, both very similar in framework and this one is more successful. NW isn't out the door yet, and is still built on the same foundation... so no bright and shining option there either.

What, you think they want to double down on Champions, despite it doing worse? Or that they'll shutter Cryptic as a whole after spending what they did to acquire them? Their shareholders would feed them their own butts...
________________
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,014
# 116
10-10-2012, 12:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by neoakiraii View Post
Players are mad because they won't be able to fly around and show off their toys, and feel special when they get a PM from someone asking where they get that from, and the player with a smile says, its a Vet reward for I am special.
A fallacal argument.

Anyone can get that "I'm better than you" from a simple lockbox ship, or being the first to buy a C-Store ship and publicly display it for the masses.
NO to ARC!

Season 9.5 = STO's NGE is Here! Welcome to the Grind!

New Crafting = It's not Crafting, is an overblown Reputation System.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 115
# 117
10-10-2012, 12:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by azurianstar View Post
So you wouldn't be upset if you waited in line for a very long time and someone just walks by you and got the goodies before you did?

That's what people are really angry about, it's not about the titles or the perks. Its that we waited a very long time and when we finally finish line of the 1000 days, Cryptic trips us and rushes someone to the finish line before us. Which really sends a negative message that they value money more than those who been putting money of new LTSs than those who steadily supported and put money into this game since before Day 1.
I agree totally......i assume they will have to change the name now seeing as Vet reward were brought in as a reward for the time you sub to the game.......possibly a new name would be fire sale rewards. lol
Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,994
# 118
10-10-2012, 12:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by azurianstar View Post
A fallacal argument.

Anyone can get that "I'm better than you" from a simple lockbox ship, or being the first to buy a C-Store ship and publicly display it for the masses.
of course, but the Vet ship would have been the mother of all...Haha I'm special because you have to wait 3 years to get this...till now


Career Officer
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 170
# 119
10-10-2012, 12:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by happyhappyj0yj0y View Post
Even if PWE cuts off their cup supply like Atari apparently did, it won't kill the game. The only thing that's likely to kill the game is CBS getting persnickety with the license, or PWE deciding the resources here would be better used elsewhere, which isn't likely to happen since...

(a) it's cheap to keep an MMO going sans-development, and hard not to turn some kind of profit there, thus it's always somewhat worthwhile to do as opposed to simply shutting down.

(b) Champions Online isn't spectacularly more successful than STO, so there's really no sign that Cryptic as an entity can pull off something spectacularly more successful, and thus more worthy of the involved resources. Nor does it make sense to divert resources there.

(c) they're currently running another MMO and developing a third. Realistically it would always make more sense to shift labor and run this in maintenance mode than shutter any doors. Don't need a lot of cups where there's a minimum of people. And should the game pick up when, say, the new Trek movie comes out? They shift people back.

(d) Champions Online seems to be doing worse business than STO, and seems to have been doing worse business than STO all along, and yet it's still up and running, even without $25 ships (yet) or lottery boxes that are anywhere near as abusive.



Nah, CoX was a whole 'nother ballgame. That was an executive decision at NCSoft to refocus on other products using other types of revenue streams which are (or at least were at the time) showing a greater success rate. There's no such avenue here. PWE has nothing more successful at Cryptic to focus those resources into. Cryptic has two launched products, both very similar in framework and this one is more successful. NW isn't out the door yet, and is still built on the same foundation... so no bright and shining option there either.

What, you think they want to double down on Champions, despite it doing worse? Or that they'll shutter Cryptic as a whole after spending what they did to acquire them? Their shareholders would feed them their own butts...
Interesting comment. I respect your point of view. I still believe getting rid of an archaic Vet Reward model is a good move thought. More to gain than to lose for Cryptic imho.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,458
# 120
10-10-2012, 12:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tali9999 View Post
Actually, i believe alot of Gold subscibers will do like me and jump on the LFT opportunity because it is REALLY a WIN WIN situation this time.
Really ?

Quote:
Without yesterday advertisement, i would have kept my monthly Gold sub going just as usual because i was not seeing any good reason to pay upfront for Months of Subs.
So you would have given them more money in the long run ?

Quote:
Let me tell you that ALOT of Gold subbers are thinking fast right now and doing maths.
And how do those maths work out as a Win/Win ?

There were folks who subbed close to 1000 days and they gave Cryptic $800+ , just by their sub .
Now Cryptic is selling the same "game time / experience" for $200-300 .

Sure it might be worth it for the player , but is it worth it to Cryptic ?
Not to mention , how many subbers are thinking : "well now I don't have to pay any more !" .
Do you know how wrong that is (unless you treat STO like a second job) ?

So in the end you're telling the players to "support Cryptic" , but on the other hand you're pro-LTS (which takes away a lot of money from Cryptic on the long run , because subs make Cryptic more money on the long run) .

So which is it ?

Last edited by aelfwin1; 10-10-2012 at 12:50 AM.
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