Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,020
# 41
10-10-2012, 08:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by echodarksided View Post
There is a false premise by some that length of time played is the primary measurement to be used in relative comparisons specific to a players commitment to STO. This premise includes a working assumption of entitlement for those who were around in the beginning.
And it's a false premise you're popularising and attributing incorrectly to the 1000-day vets.

I'm not ticked 'cause people can spend the same money I did and get the same (largely irrelevant shinies).

Back when the game launched, we didn't even know there'd be a veteran rewards program.

All the LTS guaranteed you was to be able to play, for as long as the game was running. None of us knew how long that would be.

It was a gamble - one that did and didn't pay off. Yes, the game's still alive but it's a perversion of what it was originally intended to be. Honestly, those of you that are buying LTS' now, I have to ask 'why?'. Even with the ship, you're not getting that much that you can get through Dilithium.

I'm ticked because 1000 days ago, I gave a not inconsiderable sum of money for the only benefit of not having to pay-to-play. In those 1000 days, the game has broadened in scope but become far removed from what it could have been. And there's no going back now.

To those like me that stuck around, this was Cryptic's final chance to say 'thanks for believing in us and the game' - instead, all they've shown is that their longest-standing supporters are of no consequence to them.

I'd hate to work for them.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,427
# 42
10-10-2012, 08:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by weylandjuarez View Post
To those like me that stuck around, this was Cryptic's final chance to say 'thanks for believing in us and the game' - instead, all they've shown is that their longest-standing supporters are of no consequence to them.

I'd hate to work for them.
I don't get why you have such sentimental attachment to this point.

Did you want to leave? If so, you could have left... and come back... or done whatever you wanted to do.

If you were here, you got nanopulse weapons, the Next Generation title, ship trophies, fire extinguishers, etc.

All the lifetime was about was the option to come back. It was never an investment in the game. Heck, I don't know if Cryptic ever saw a dime from Lifetime sales even though they have to budget for them now.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,020
# 43
10-10-2012, 08:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stoleviathan99 View Post
I don't get why you have such sentimental attachment to this point.

Did you want to leave? If so, you could have left... and come back... or done whatever you wanted to do.

If you were here, you got nanopulse weapons, the Next Generation title, ship trophies, fire extinguishers, etc.

All the lifetime was about was the option to come back. It was never an investment in the game. Heck, I don't know if Cryptic ever saw a dime from Lifetime sales even though they have to budget for them now.
It was a $300 gamble - pure and simple. What existed wasn't deserving of that kind of money (and arguably, what exists now still isn't). The difference being that back then we didn't know if we'd still be playing the game in six months time or not - much less whether we'd get any neat perks (besides the Liberated Borg Captain) for the money.

Now LTS's have it pretty simple: Is the package of goodies worth $300 to me? You know exactly what you're going to get and you get it immediately - no risk, no waiting.

Back then, Cryptics life-blood was the box-sales and the subscriptions and yes - the LTS. The only stuff in the C-Store was the (promised) cosmetic, micro-transaction stuff - no $25 ships (in fact, no ships in the C-Store at all). LTS sales dumped a big chunk of cash Cryptics way early on in the life of this game that they'd have otherwise ha to wait around 20 months to accrue.

Maybe you see it as stupidity. Maybe you see it as just being cavalier with money. I prefer to see it as having faith in a developer and paying up front as a sign of that faith. It's pretty obvious though that to Cryptic I'm just another sucker with more money than sense.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,712
# 44
10-10-2012, 08:40 AM
Here's how I look at it, there are two different things at work here.

One is the Lifetimer promotion.

Once you're a lifetime subscriber that's it, you're it for life. Doesn't matter when you bought it, the fact that you bought it makes you one. And all lifetimers should be treated the same, whether they bought it today or two years ago. If one Lifetimer gets a new perk, they should all get them. You pays your money, you gets your stuff, simple as that.

This is Cryptic's top-dollar item, why shouldn't they continue to incentivise it?

And then there's the entirely separate issue of Gold Subs.

If you've been a gold for 1,000 days you get the ships, period, end of story.

I don't see anything wrong with any of it. I've been here since open beta. I've taken breaks and gone silver, so I have about 830 days, but I've really played far more than that. This promotion has made me think about getting a lifetime. Not sure where I'll end up.
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"I would rather take a chance on getting a change made to the game through positive engagement than know for sure that I got a change made by complaining" -drogyn1701, May 14, 2014.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 759
# 45
10-10-2012, 08:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by weylandjuarez View Post
Back when the game launched, we didn't even know there'd be a veteran rewards program.

All the LTS guaranteed you was to be able to play, for as long as the game was running. None of us knew how long that would be.
That is not even close to true. We knew STO would have veteran rewards at launch. CO had them for months before STO launched and the developers were clear that STO would have them as well. We did not know what they would be until the 100-day reward grew close, but we did know they would be coming in 100-day increments.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 142
# 46
10-10-2012, 08:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by weylandjuarez View Post
Honestly, those of you that are buying LTS' now, I have to ask 'why?'. Even with the ship, you're not getting that much that you can get through Dilithium.

I'm ticked because 1000 days ago, I gave a not inconsiderable sum of money for the only benefit of not having to pay-to-play. In those 1000 days, the game has broadened in scope but become far removed from what it could have been. And there's no going back now.
We simply see it differently. The game is very good right now, and is constantly getting better in my opinion. I'm excited about the changes I have seen in Seasons 5 and 6, and I'm excited about Season 7.

The month before Season 6 went to Tribble SWTOR was released and STO was dead, nobody was playing STO and there was no evidence the game was healthy. Since Season 6 lauched the active, in game community is very active, and there is no question PWE had a huge payday with the Temporal lock box and has a steady revenue model for the game in place.

By every metric we can evaluate, the game is thriving and the future is bright. So unlike the risk early lifetime members took investing in their lifetime sub, today all signs suggest such an investment is low risk, because the games future today is much brighter than it was back then.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,020
# 47
10-10-2012, 08:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stf65 View Post
That is not even close to true. We knew STO would have veteran rewards at launch. CO had them for months before STO launched and the developers were clear that STO would have them as well. We did not know what they would be until the 100-day reward grew close, but we did know they would be coming in 100-day increments.
Speak for yourself (as, presumably a Champions player) - I was unfamiliar with Champions and Cryptic prior to getting into the STO closed beta. No veteran rewards were promised at that time - only 'expected' and nothing official was published about what they'd be and when (even if) we'd get them (although there was much speculation).

*Edit* the game was launched in February 2010, the vet rewards scheme was announced in April 2010.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 315
# 48
10-10-2012, 08:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by stf65 View Post
That is not even close to true. We knew STO would have veteran rewards at launch. CO had them for months before STO launched and the developers were clear that STO would have them as well. We did not know what they would be until the 100-day reward grew close, but we did know they would be coming in 100-day increments.
Your statement is not true. It was being suggested at the time, but there was no official word on it until close to 100 days.
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Join Date: Sept 2008


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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,427
# 49
10-10-2012, 08:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by weylandjuarez View Post
Back then, Cryptics life-blood was the box-sales and the subscriptions and yes - the LTS.
You don't even know if Cryptic got any of that. Given their bonus structure with Atari, my guess is they didn't but would get bonuses as long as Atari was happy with what they looted from the treasure chest.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,712
# 50
10-10-2012, 09:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by echodarksided View Post
The month before Season 6 went to Tribble SWTOR was released and STO was dead, nobody was playing STO and there was no evidence the game was healthy.
Your timeline is a little off. Measuring from the release of Starbases for testing, season 6 stuff began going up on Tribble in June of 2012. SWTOR was released in December of 2011.

Your point may still be valid though.
The Foundry Roundtable live Wednesdays at 7:30PM EST/4:30PM PST on twitch.tv/thefoundryroundtable
"I would rather take a chance on getting a change made to the game through positive engagement than know for sure that I got a change made by complaining" -drogyn1701, May 14, 2014.
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