Well I'm the same, I won't call you a coward for turning me down under any circumstances (I'm not like that).
My point is that the RA Excelsior should have something over the CMDR version to show for the extra boff skills and consoles but it doesn't in terms of shield tanking or in damage output... Strange don't you think?
It may be that there were additional factors in play, like buffs and debuffs (which are esp prevailant in stfs). I would recommend you test both ships in a sterile environment (1v1 match against a target dummy ship), and that should put the damage output question to rest.
As for the damage soak ability? Again, use a sterile environment and have someone attack you, and you just defend yourself (without shooting back, by defend, I mean use buffs and debuffs etc). Whichever of your ships takes longer to die, provided your shooter does the same thing, will prove that test.
As for shield tanking, if your ships have the same shield mod, of course they will be able to shield tank the same. But the thing with cruisers is that we hull tank. And THAT is where you WILL notice a difference between the Cmdr and RA versions.
just had an interesting infected elite run with 5 cruisers. A Galaxy X (tac captain), all beam array. an assault cruiser (science captain), a tac oddy (engi captain), Starcruiser (engi captain) and myself in an oddy starcruiser (engi)
guess what...the team blew through that infected with 2 min left at the end. And i have to say we were actually only 4 since the starcruiser came in with multiple red injuries and was dead 70% of the time.
so much for cruiser and/or beam array firepower.
PS: i would like to think it was because of me, but it wasn't. That galaxy X captain plowed through those spheres with his beams like an escort. I had the honor of tanking, but failed 2 times due to 1 invis torpedo and one phone call.
Damn, I sooo hoped this thing would finally die.
Where was I when I left? Ahhh, right:
Originally Posted by xiphenon
I had the impression it should be a general comparsion between Cruisers and Escorts. If you state, that anyone not flying the ody is not optimized, I would suggest to take the bug ship as opponent, because it is the most strongest escort in game.
You have heard of DOFs, right? On my Fleet vorcha I run only one copy of EPTS3 and EPTW1, powered by 3 blue DOFs reducing the cooldown to 15 sec of each ability. I don't see any reason, why an escort cannot do this with EPTS2 and EPTW1. Escpacially the Bug ship can put EPTW1 in his Ens Eng and run another Lt. Eng with EPTS1 and RSP.
Okay, 3x Damage Control Engineer ... so, you're down to a single BFI Shield Distribution DOff (you ARE running a Warp Core Engineer with dual EPtX cycling, do you?). You're again trading in survivability. Acceptable on the Tor'Kaht if build as a tank instead of building it as a Raptor - not a good move on an Escort, you'd be back to glass cannon. And no: trading a 1min full shield recharge for a 3min20sec one is not enough. Especially since you'd trade your Aux2SIF right along with it, making you die from bleedthrough.
Not to mention that the 3x DCE version does not have a 100% uptime on either EPtX - max is a 92.5% chance for a cooldown proc with three purple ones. 7.5% chance of running naked for 15sec.
Originally Posted by hereticknight085
Odyssey Tactical Cruiser costs 2500 zen points. [...] If you really want to compare the Excelsior to something, compare it to another tier 4 c-store ship. Don't try to compare it to a tier 5 one.
The Ody is Tier 5. Well, actually Tier 5.5, as are all the 10-console ships.
The Excelsior it Tier 5.
There are no Tier 6 ships yet, any ship of RA AND VA level is considered T5, and they come with the same total BOff slots, console slots and relative hull/shields.
Fleet ships, lockbox ships and the Ody get about a 10% boost on shields and hull plus an additional console - but that's not a full tier.
Besides, the Ody as used for examples is the 50$ version, since the Saucer Seperation console costs another 25$.
Originally Posted by adamkafei
By that logic my Excelsior should be in a similar position, I paid 20 quid for it, I don't know how that works out in $s, but it's comparatively balanced against the assault cruiser, you know... the free thing... In a P2W system my Excelsior should be nearly as good as your Oddy, but it's not, you know why it's not? Try because it was made when everything was balanced. The oddy? No, that's not a fair test, that's P2W, hell the free escorts make BOTH free cruisers look like utter rubbish that they could blow up in seconds (which they could), that's not balance balance is the oddy vs a patrol escort... "Why?" you ask? because tactical has OP career powers which combined with escorts weapons which make anything else look rubbish (I'm sorry but it's true) means the only way to stand up to them is with P2L or some horribly specialised build that is not as fun to fly.
I have suggested a way to fix this however but I know it will never happen
Actually ... can I take you up on this?
You bring the free T5 Escort, I bring the free T5 Cruiser (well, actually the mirror skin, but that shouldn't be a problem).
Last time I had the opportunity to duel an Escort, I was still using Mk X greens, and it took a PvP-build Defiant (alpha-striking from cloak, of course) usually about 5 minutes to bring me down. Two uses of all my Engi cooldowns, and then some.
While that ship still needs some work, I'd like to see how it does now - I'm pretty sure though it would be a LOT closer than you think.
Oh: I wouldn't mind either if you sent someone else and just watched, I'd really like to see the results, either way. And I can use the practice. No P2W consoles, just the free stuff. Anytime after the RSP gimp is undone next week.
We can do an ESTF or two afterwards, I'd like to see how you're doing with your cruiser.
Odd. There should be an increase of at least 50-100 damage. mk XI blue gives a 24.4% damage increase, and after you factor in the dimishing returns, at least a 10% bonus... very odd indeed... maybe your cmdr version just got luckier with the damage rolls...