Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 92
# 111
10-17-2012, 10:47 AM
I think this is a great start to a set of features that could add a lot of "casual" play to the game so I look forward to seeing how this grows...

I would also like to see similar UI in game as well though, or we are going to have two inconsistent views of the same data ...
Richard Silk, EU Liaison Officer, TOS Veterans Fleet
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 371
# 112
10-17-2012, 11:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by amayakitsune View Post
Oh... I'll check it out once to see if its actually good. But its a web app... and they are junky. So I will call this one junky.

EDIT: Also... I dont know how you guys are still making money when you keep giving players the opposite of what we want...

Players: "No more lockboxes!", Cryptic: "Here have more lockboxes!"

Players: "No more grinding!", Cryptic: "MORE GRINDING!"

Players: "Android/iOS app!", Cryptic: "Web app!"

Im seriously considering not spending any more money on a company that keeps doing the opposite of what players want.
Logical fallacy: The conclusion supporting the premise. In other words, making a foregone conclusion.

Perhaps using standard web programming worked out better than having to program proprietary apps for each different platform? Perhaps they felt that supporting any web-capable device trumped support for only a handful of mobile devices? If you make an app for iOS, you have to make one for Android, and then for Windows phones, and then for webOS, and so on, etc. Making a web-based platform caters to the most devices possible, even legacy feature phones that support web browsing.

Personally, I *never* saw a big outcry for an app, just requests for an online interface that allowed us access to our captain's stats, the DOff system, etc. I think you're basing this purely on your own perspective. In other words, don't post on behalf of the general public if you aren't steadfastly certain you speak for the majority.Your personal, securlar view doesn't necessarily represent the wishes of the majority (case in point: lockboxes).

It's obvious that your personal bias against many things implemented by Cryptic is showing through for this particular subject, by your own admission.

Quote:
Originally Posted by amayakitsune View Post
They called it a Beta. That means its working in some capacity. They could let us use it now and see what its like.
I suppose you've never heard of a "closed" beta?

I don't care how long you've been playing. I only care about how you play.
And remember to follow the rules.

Last edited by obsidiusrex; 10-17-2012 at 11:24 AM.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 371
# 113
10-17-2012, 11:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zerobang View Post
this all looks very nice

but... i don't see much "functionality" ...yet

how about support for:
- Mails (we had this before and it was very useful)
- Exchange
- Dilithium Exchange
- live Chat (a live chat XMPP client, should be possible to be implement in a web ui like that?)
- Foundry, let me tag missions i find on the web and add them to my active mission list so i don't forget to play them later! (maybe even with a link so that for example starbase ugc can direct link the missions they talk about.)
- DOffs -> no brainer
Agreed, but I think they're aware that more things will need to come. In it's current form, it's simply a recreation / upgrade of the old Captains' Database. Hopefully, if things work right and the new system doesn't cause too much network overhead, etc., we'll start to see additional features rolled out after this initial launch.

That being said, I remember when CoH announced a similar offline feature during one of their M&Gs, and it actually never happened because it was too detrimental to server overhead and game stability. So I'll be happy if this launches at all

I don't care how long you've been playing. I only care about how you play.
And remember to follow the rules.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 702
# 114
10-17-2012, 12:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by obsidiusrex View Post
Logical fallacy: The conclusion supporting the premise. In other words, making a foregone conclusion.

Perhaps using standard web programming worked out better than having to program proprietary apps for each different platform? Perhaps they felt that supporting any web-capable device trumped support for only a handful of mobile devices? If you make an app for iOS, you have to make one for Android, and then for Windows phones, and then for webOS, and so on, etc. Making a web-based platform caters to the most devices possible, even legacy feature phones that support web browsing.

Personally, I *never* saw a big outcry for an app, just requests for an online interface that allowed us access to our captain's stats, the DOff system, etc. I think you're basing this purely on your own perspective. In other words, don't post on behalf of the general public if you aren't steadfastly certain you speak for the majority.Your personal, securlar view doesn't necessarily represent the wishes of the majority (case in point: lockboxes).

It's obvious that your personal bias against many things implemented by Cryptic is showing through for this particular subject, by your own admission.
Using standard web programming doesnt work out better over native programming when it comes to mobile devices. It saves time, and maybe money. Its a cop out to not have to invest extra time and money into native development.

And heres what you would "have" to make apps for: iOS, Android, Windows Phone, (those 3 make up the majority of the smartphone market) and if you feel nice, the desktop. But I havent seen a webOS phone in years and honestly I dont know if there are any devices that run it on the market. And quite frankly, access this site is likely to be bad on "feature" phones that have web access, but not a full web browser.

"Personal" bias? Judging by the amount of topics I've seen against grinding STFs/missions/fleets and against lockboxes, there really isnt anything personal about it. Fact is, I dont care if there are lockboxes in the game... I space them and move on. I do think that grinding STFs/fleets is a poor way to have to get the top end gear, but I can live with that too. I play the game with a group of friends and we have fun and that usually all that matters...

But dont tell me I'm making a foregone conclusions. Topics on the forums cry for less grindy missions, less in the way of lockboxes and Cryptic introduces more of them. (Heck were getting an entire new "Reputation" system, which will likely be a grind system like the fleet system is... and the Romulan Colony adventure zone will probably be just like the other two in the game...)

http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/sh...d.php?t=413771

http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/sh...d.php?t=270485

That two topics I could find just by casually glancing through the forums. (Unfortunately, searching for 'app' doesnt work because its too short of a term... but there have been several topics that have asked for an app (usually for DOffs in particular.)) There were a few people who wanted a web app to support their BlackBerry or other phone in those topics, but by in large every time I've seen it brought up its asking for an ios/android/wp7 app.

Quote:
Originally Posted by obsidiusrex View Post
I suppose you've never heard of a "closed" beta?
Then you say closed beta. As of writing this, theres no reference to it being a "closed" beta. Just a beta. Which means it works and we should be able to use it and test it. (Which is another thing Cryptic is bad at... BTW.)
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 40
# 115
10-17-2012, 05:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by amayakitsune View Post
There were a few people who wanted a web app to support their BlackBerry or other phone in those topics, but by in large every time I've seen it brought up its asking for an ios/android/wp7 app.
So really what you're thinking is that it must be totally cheap to develop three or more apps? Then spend the enormous amount of continued overhead not just to develop them, but to pay for the constant upkeep/coding, etc. on more than 3 separate apps? TBH I'd rather they spend the salaries on people who can actually make Featured Episodes.

Personally, I like the idea that I won't have to BUY and app for my iPad AND my laptop AND my Android phone AND my DS - Now I'll be able to use whatever tool is easiest FOR ME and not have to think about schlepping along the device I chose to buy the app on.

So - it's cheaper, yes. It's cheaper for Crytpic and SHOCK it'll be cheaper for us.

I'm thrilled with the idea - as long as I can access the web, I'll be able to access this gateway. I'm really looking forward to seeing what new stuff will come over the course of the game!
Ensign
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 16
# 116
10-17-2012, 06:25 PM
My only question about this features is: how do I turn it off? I really, deeply hate "features" like this, or the WoW armory. Especially since they're almost always set to public by default. (Assuming that there's even an *option* to turn it off - the WoW Armory doesn't have a "private" setting.) If I don't know you, then you have ZERO business pawing through my characters and gawking at their inventory.
Ensign
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 10
I didn't read the 11 pages of posts and this probably has been posted because there are very smart people who think of these things but I hope that the events calendar and the hourly events are available via the web. i don't know how many times I've wondered if a tour the galaxy or crafting event is coming up only to miss it because I didn't have time to launch and log into the game. This would be a great help and I would definitely access via my phone.

Thanks!
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 702
# 118
10-17-2012, 07:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by terilynns View Post
So really what you're thinking is that it must be totally cheap to develop three or more apps? Then spend the enormous amount of continued overhead not just to develop them, but to pay for the constant upkeep/coding, etc. on more than 3 separate apps? TBH I'd rather they spend the salaries on people who can actually make Featured Episodes.

Personally, I like the idea that I won't have to BUY and app for my iPad AND my laptop AND my Android phone AND my DS - Now I'll be able to use whatever tool is easiest FOR ME and not have to think about schlepping along the device I chose to buy the app on.

So - it's cheaper, yes. It's cheaper for Crytpic and SHOCK it'll be cheaper for us.

I'm thrilled with the idea - as long as I can access the web, I'll be able to access this gateway. I'm really looking forward to seeing what new stuff will come over the course of the game!
I never said it was cheaper to develop native apps. I never even insinuated that it would be cheaper to do such a thing. I understand it would cost more.

But just because the app is native doesn't mean it will automatically cost money. In fact if it did cost money I doubt many people would buy it.

What making a native app gets you is better performance, and an expanded amount of APIs to use in the app. Where as a web app is constrained by the web browser that it runs in. Thats not so much of a problem with desktops (also... why do you need this on the desktop? Log into the game...), but mobile browsers, even though capable of rendering most of the web perfectly fine, are still junky compared to a desktop browser. Most of them either have poor javascript performance, or dont support flash, or other such stupid nonsense.

A web apps is both easier to develop for the lazy dev, and cheaper. And yes its easier for the user from a device stand point... (as you said, you'll be able to access on your DS or whatever other internet-enabled gizmo you are carrying.) But it will be janky to use and will never be as good as a native app. Native apps also have the ability to cache themselves so you can access information that has been pulled from the web to allow access when theres no internet connection, which to my knowledge web apps (on mobile devices) can not do. This would be helpful, for instance, to keep track of DOff mission timers when out of the range of a WiFi connection (or in low coverage cellphone areas).

Native App > Web App. Always.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,512
# 119
10-17-2012, 09:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by calstraven View Post
I didn't read the 11 pages of posts and this probably has been posted because there are very smart people who think of these things but I hope that the events calendar and the hourly events are available via the web. i don't know how many times I've wondered if a tour the galaxy or crafting event is coming up only to miss it because I didn't have time to launch and log into the game. This would be a great help and I would definitely access via my phone.

Thanks!
Whoa this is actually a really good idea that everyone else has overlooked
Ensign
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 2
# 120
10-17-2012, 09:46 PM
I saw a complaint that there was any focus on desktop users.

Why have this for the desktop? Lets see. I often watch TV with the wife on the couch. I will grab her laptop and read during downtime/commercials in the show. My gaming PC is downstairs. This would be nice and allow me to check on my character, progress, etc. Even better, if at some point I can check on doffs.

I guess one could argue that I can just go downstairs and login to the game. I could use the same logic though and say that phone users can wait til they get home and login too.

Neither argument works because I am telling others what to do and how to experience their game and they would be doing the same. Seriously, any option is great compared to what we have now.

One of the things I like about LOTRO is the character log options at mylotro. It doesn't offer near the functionality being hinted at with this announcement. Yet, even something as basic as that would be an improvement over what is available now. Currently there is no out of game content/experience. There are the forums here but no way to check on/manage any part of your character.

So, if we are going to get functionality along with the out of game experience, sounds good to me.

Another option I would like to see is a blog option here or with this new system. I get a lot of pleasure reading the blogs and travels of other players in LOTRO.

Finally, I also agree with the suggestions already made that there should be a way to 'opt out' of this. There should be a check box somewhere to allow players to decide how much info they want to share with others.
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