Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 36
# 1 Sci Still Needs Attention
10-18-2012, 12:48 AM
Offensive sci powers are still pathetic except for Tractor Beam Repulsors, which creates very annoying game play if you are actually trying to shoot the target or use an ability on it and one of your team is repulsing away at it.

When is gravity well iii and photonic shockwave iii going to be restored?
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 735
# 2
10-18-2012, 01:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by boootz View Post
Offensive sci powers are still pathetic except for Tractor Beam Repulsors, which creates very annoying game play if you are actually trying to shoot the target or use an ability on it and one of your team is repulsing away at it.

When is gravity well iii and photonic shockwave iii going to be restored?
Now friendly TBR being used against you would indicate poor teamplay...

Working sci skills:
- Tykens
- VM with doffs
- TBR
- TB
- TSS
- HE
- PH

Poor performance sci skills:
- Scramble (only good at maxed out 3 too high opportunity cost)
- Energy Siphon (doesn't drain much but gives good return)
- PSW (too weak knock, stun resisted)
- GW (too weak max pull)
- ST (too short clearing)
- MES (well...)
- FBP (too high opportunity cost. only good for tacs)

Crap sci skills
- JS (useless in teamplay)
- Tachyon beam (does nothing because of resists)
- CPB (does nothing because of resists)
- Photonic officer (high opportunity cost, very little effect)
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 36
# 3
10-18-2012, 01:13 AM
Yea viral matrix is still useful. And our heals and drains.


I remember playing my tac before they nerfed gravity well, and I feared gravity wells. I made sure I had engine batteries to aid my escape.

Now it is a non factor. I had a noob in a public queue game TBR my targets out of my gravity well iii telling me gravity well sucks. He tBR'd everything. Everywhere. He bragged about how his damage was so high.

Our team had 1 kill.

Last edited by boootz; 10-18-2012 at 01:17 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 668
# 4
10-18-2012, 01:26 AM
Its a good list... added my thoughts in red.

Working sci skills:
- Tykens
- VM with doffs
- TBR
- TB
- TSS
- HE
- PH
- GW .... Pull is fine if you spec it proper... don't forget how many people are running AP doffs and end up with omega up 50% of the time. Its also the best spam control sci skill there is
- ST Clear is exactly as long as it should be... any longer and sci would be junk... which seems to be what we are complaining about



Poor performance sci skills:
- Scramble (only good at maxed out 3 too high opportunity cost)
- Energy Siphon (doesn't drain much but gives good return)
- PSW (too weak knock, stun resisted)... on PSW I think its the fact that it does almost no dmg to boot... at least not long ago it could be counted on for some dmg at least... now its only good for breaking Extends.
- MES (well...)
- FBP I won't disagree with this skill being junk... frankly though I think its junk on tacs to... a skill that just forces a Sub Nuke or a target switch is frankly useless. Don't see that changing.

Crap sci skills
- JS (useless in teamplay)... I agree that it has no place in PvP... still not every skill need be a PvP skill. The only way to buff this for pvp would be to kill or reduce the break on dmg... which was even worse for balance as it is now. I don't want to be under fire from people using the JS Super Enhanced Battle Cloak again.

- Tachyon beam (does nothing because of resists)
- CPB (does nothing because of resists)
I agree on both of these skills being to week due to resists... I think the easiest fix for this would be as follows. Right now the first 3 points of the resist value = 18 points each... 4-6 = 10 points each and 7-9 = 5 points each.... I say they just need to take the scales on ALL the resist skills and Invert them.... so that the first 3 points = 5 points ect....
This would mean people COULD have the exact same max resist they have now if they spend 9 points. Thing is right now is most wise specing PvP players will put 3-6 points in all the sci resist skills... If the scales where inverted 6 points in would = 45 points instead of 84 I think that would correct the issue. Some people would still be max resist... but no one would be max resist against every possible option.


- Photonic officer (high opportunity cost, very little effect)
hard to argue this one really... it would be more useful if things like Tech doffs didn't exist. Still I could see some interesting changes on this one... perhaps it needs to be more of an on demand type skill.... perhaps it should drop cool downs in a Major way ONCE on the same cool down it has now... something like PH 1 = 50% reduction every active cool PH 2 = 66% and PH 3 = 100%
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 735
# 5
10-18-2012, 01:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by husanakx View Post
- Tachyon beam (does nothing because of resists)
- CPB (does nothing because of resists)
I agree on both of these skills being to week due to resists... I think the easiest fix for this would be as follows. Right now the first 3 points of the resist value = 18 points each... 4-6 = 10 points each and 7-9 = 5 points each.... I say they just need to take the scales on ALL the resist skills and Invert them.... so that the first 3 points = 5 points ect....
This would mean people COULD have the exact same max resist they have now if they spend 9 points. Thing is right now is most wise specing PvP players will put 3-6 points in all the sci resist skills... If the scales where inverted 6 points in would = 45 points instead of 84 I think that would correct the issue. Some people would still be max resist... but no one would be max resist against every possible option.
Problem is, these skills were almost useless before the resists came. (exception: a team spamming CPB)

Even if the resists were removed completely, these skills would have a hard time finding proper use, because of the increased shield capacity healing going on. (Borg-set+BFI doffs)

Back in the days before the borg set, i used to have a Tachyon-RSV that could win 1v1 against anyone. It used 2xTachy3 and CPB3, and only projectile weapons. Doing this, I avoided any healing from RSP, and over a few minutes, the shield drain would overcome the shield heals of the opponent. Only once or twice did I meet a proper tank build and had a stalemate. This build was maxed to the absolute limit. I think this was pretty perfect balance, as the ultimate heal build was just barely able to keep up with a ultimate drain build. Today, it would take a lot to come back up to this level.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,192
# 6
10-18-2012, 02:09 AM
Cryptic should finally decide if science ships are supposed to be dangerous because of their science "magic" or these should just be used to disrupt enemy team and improve their own.

If offensive science abilities should remain toothless, then science ships itself shoud be improved.

Personally, I'm glad they removed some shared cooldown from sci skills. What I still do not like, is that science ships are toothless without some major sci powers.

I really like Photonic Officer, but it does not provide anything spectacular over tech doffs at much greater opportunity cost.

Perhaps, photonic officer ability should bypass shared cooldowns and such, to make it interesting choice.

But I'm probably not the best person to give hints, as I usually play odd combinations Tac Nebula all the way ! LOL
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,735
# 7
10-18-2012, 02:16 AM
Working sci skills:
- Tykens Tykens3 with doff, TR1 without, not so much
- VM with doffs
- TBR
- TB As always, TB1 is good, TB2, 3 are crap
- TSS
- HE
- PH

Poor performance sci skills:
- Scramble (only good at maxed out 3 too high opportunity cost)
- Energy Siphon (doesn't drain much but gives good return) agreed
- PSW (too weak knock, stun resisted)
- GW (too weak max pull)
- ST (too short clearing) Is fine, imv
- MES (well...) IS even crappier then JS, really no clue how it is on the same page as PSW
- FBP (too high opportunity cost. only good for tacs)

Crap sci skills
- JS (useless in teamplay)
- Tachyon beam (does nothing because of resists)
- CPB (does nothing because of resists)
- Photonic officer (high opportunity cost, very little effect)
Joined 06.10
PvP 2010-2011
PvP 2012-2013
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 735
# 8
10-18-2012, 03:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by havam View Post
- MES (well...) IS even crappier then JS, really no clue how it is on the same page as PSW
I admit to not having really tested MES. For a high-aux build, if some points are spent in stealth, how well does it cloak you?

Also, the lower sci stations always have hard competition, due to the value of low rank sci heals. Other skills have to be quite good to be able to compete with a second copy of TSS, HE or ST.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,192
# 9
10-18-2012, 03:32 AM
I tested it few months ago. It works much like Cloak, and there is a "positive bug" on MES, but I wont tell anyone
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,735
# 10
10-18-2012, 03:36 AM
MES needs a rethink, would love to hear about the bug though
Joined 06.10
PvP 2010-2011
PvP 2012-2013
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