Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 73
# 481
10-26-2012, 11:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by levi3 View Post
Perhaps English is not your first language - look up the term "Hypocrite"

If I were telling people not to grind purples, but instead was doing it myself - then I would be a "Hypocrite"
Quote:
Originally Posted by levi3 View Post
the grinder is being used by people to PROFITEER - by supplying the market with toons cheap to produce blues and purples...
HYPOCRITE -- "a person who acts in contradiction to his or her stated beliefs or feelings."

It's not much of a distinction. Selling Blues/Purples for a profit is profiteering, but selling whites for even greater profit is perfectly acceptable. Method of acquisition is not really relevant to the issue that you are just as "guilty" of profiteering as people selling Blues/Purples.

Quote:
Originally Posted by levi3 View Post
Instead what i am doing is providing a item to the market which is in HIGH demand, thereby keeping the price from rising - which most people want.

By grinding purples, which are a LOW demand item, and placing them on the market this drives down the price - which most people don't want(including Cryptic from my understanding)

Example I can place 100 commons at 74k and have them sold in a few minutes - this is because there is a massive demand for them.
I find it funny that you believe most people want the price of Common DOFFs to stay low, but also want the price of Purple DOFFs to rise. The average player would love to see Purple DOFFs go lower. That way, they might actually be able to afford one. The number of players with hundreds of millions of EC is quite small. Most players are happy to have 2 million EC. There is a large demand for Purple DOFFs. Most players just don't have the resources to actually purchase them in large quantities.

Quote:
Originally Posted by levi3 View Post
On top of that we are also due for another high end doff pack promo which guarentees a high end doff - do you think Cryptic wants to have the prices of high end doffs depressed on the exchange for this coming doff pack sale? It is almost certain that there will be one next month. This is just one of the reasons for the grinder changes in my mind.
Now that actually has some logic to it. Though you're conceding that the entire purpose to raising the dilithium cost is greed and has nothing to do with balance. Which is exactly what this entire thread has been about.

Quote:
Originally Posted by levi3 View Post
I will say 1 last time - don't waste your time focasing on getting changes to the blues and purples - it's not going to happen. Focus on the common to green conversion.
They're brilliant when it comes to the other conversions, but when it comes to the White--->Green grinder, they're wrong. Everyone who is unhappy about the Green--->Blue or Blue--->Purple grinder are playing the game wrong, but the White--->Green is totally different. Great logic there.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 633
# 482
10-27-2012, 05:32 AM
Quote:
My doffs manufacture a wide variety of equipment items for me. They also acquire an array of various commodities for me. you can also get fleet marks if you know what you're doing. (and I do those regularly)

Beleive it or not, you aren't the average doffer. You have very specific goals in doffing, mainly the acquisition of dilithium.
Lets see.

Equipment. MkXII consles aside i don;t know of anything i can't get as a drop or buy from vendors for chump change. And M<KXIII Consles need, guess what, a good roster.

Commodditties. Only useful to feed back into the doff system or, (assuming your not just talking about the gamma ones), starbases, so yeah, back to point 1.

FM's good point, but you need a good roster to do that, without a good roster you just can't aquire the 100K XP in thing in any resonable time frame. I aquired 20K Sci XP in maybe 6 months of doffing on my sci. Then after converting her 100 or so greens to 20 odd blues, (i had some saved in the mail), that suddenlly began exploding, in 3 weeks it's shot to 65K.

Fact is nothing in the doff system worth aquiring can be aquirred without good crity chances, and that can only be aquirred with a solid roster.

I also wasn't suggesting everyone takes their entire doff rewards and up-converts them. I figure they did what i did. Coverted the recruitnment missions rewards to greens till they hit the 100 cap then converted their leveling pack reward whites to grees. Kept converting to greens til they get a full roster and ropeeat the procwess for blues. It was around this point i finnially got able to finish the colonial chains and embassy's, (really bad fabrication and technition drop rates but got a bunch of blues), now i convert what i can through the embassy's et al and put the spares through the grinder for the last week or so.

I'm also not saying tha you can't get decent rewards from the embassies. But like you said, you need traits, and even then a fair percebntage will be greens you'll have to upconvert agains, and getting blue to purples sans grinder is damm near imposibble on a reliable basis.

I'm also not asking for instant gratification. I'm asking for a grind thats appropriatte to the rewards. With thjis chang anw player or anew character faces the single longest solo grind in the game to get aces to the decent rewards. None of which are very spectacular. For a grind thats going to be even longer than anything bar a solo starbase i expect sutibale rewards. I.e. som,thin that makes the rep systems look laughable. If i have to put that kind of grind in only to be told the very best reward i cna get is a chance at a random MkXII consle i'm just going to go. "scre you". And so is the rest of the player base. Why bother with such a god awfully long grind for rewards that are so so at best, (and it looks like the fleet system may well make that assignment worthless as well soon).
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,642
# 483
10-27-2012, 06:00 AM
Let's forget all this banter as it is getting no-where and no-one at Cryptic is responding.

In my opinion this is why they are raising the costs, and if I am correct then they plan to keep them intact.

1)There is a new doff pack coming that will offer high quality doff(s) in it next month or at latest Dec - perhaps a Christmas pack - which will also offer the Jem Bug as a Special prize.

Having higher quality doffs cost more at the grinder and more at the exchange makes Cryptic believe they will sell lots of packs.

2)Yet another dilth sink - they are the way the game is going and Cryptic seems hell bent on putting them everywhere despite player dislike.

Therefore they are unlikely to modify the doff grinding costs

3)Data - prior to season 6 - very fee people used the grinder - it was like a ghost town at SFA every time I did the lore - every day. Now the place is like the DMV(getting your drivers stuff)

They want to change his and make doff aquisition return to the doff system and pack. Plus they want people to start burning off fleet credits and the higher quality doffs cost a lot of fleet credits.

4)an additional time gate - whether the gate is for starbase construction/embassey construction/rep system/doff system- the increased costs will significantly slow down the process of going through "content"

There you go - the answers that you want - why they are doing this. Of course this is only my opinion but I can tell you I am fairly confident that it is accurate.

But let's face it - you don't really want to know the reasons why - you just don't want them to do it. Sorry i don't think you will get that demand.
Career Officer
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 953
# 484
10-27-2012, 08:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by levi3 View Post
Let's forget all this banter as it is getting no-where and no-one at Cryptic is responding.

In my opinion this is why they are raising the costs, and if I am correct then they plan to keep them intact.

1)There is a new doff pack coming that will offer high quality doff(s) in it next month or at latest Dec - perhaps a Christmas pack - which will also offer the Jem Bug as a Special prize.

Having higher quality doffs cost more at the grinder and more at the exchange makes Cryptic believe they will sell lots of packs.

2)Yet another dilth sink - they are the way the game is going and Cryptic seems hell bent on putting them everywhere despite player dislike.

Therefore they are unlikely to modify the doff grinding costs

3)Data - prior to season 6 - very fee people used the grinder - it was like a ghost town at SFA every time I did the lore - every day. Now the place is like the DMV(getting your drivers stuff)

They want to change his and make doff aquisition return to the doff system and pack. Plus they want people to start burning off fleet credits and the higher quality doffs cost a lot of fleet credits.

4)an additional time gate - whether the gate is for starbase construction/embassey construction/rep system/doff system- the increased costs will significantly slow down the process of going through "content"

There you go - the answers that you want - why they are doing this. Of course this is only my opinion but I can tell you I am fairly confident that it is accurate.

But let's face it - you don't really want to know the reasons why - you just don't want them to do it. Sorry i don't think you will get that demand.
I think most of pretty much think 2 & 4 are definite motives, certainly point 1 is also probable. But I would like Cryptic to admit to this, if I'm going to be screwed and pay for the pleasure of it I would at least like to know the reason,
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,642
# 485
10-27-2012, 10:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thisisoverlord View Post
I think most of pretty much think 2 & 4 are definite motives, certainly point 1 is also probable. But I would like Cryptic to admit to this, if I'm going to be screwed and pay for the pleasure of it I would at least like to know the reason,
The Last 2 high-end doff packs were months ago with the re-do gamma and the the reienforcements pack - both offered a special prize either the tuffli freighter or the Jem Bug

It's getting over do for another 1 - A new Romulan/Borg themed pack - perhaps 2 packs - more money there - buy a romulan one and a borg one separate

I am almost 100% positive that this is what they intend - and I was wrong in my blog I was 2 and 1 with Mr stahl - the one thing he would not answer - even though he gave in to me on the hard ones - was what will happen with the Borg Duty officers you can now buy with EDC's

The more I ponder the more I think you will see lots of purple and blue Borg and Romulan doffs hitting very soon in brand new doff packs.

If the grinder cost so much + prices on the exchange are high - those c-store prices will look pretty good for these new unique doffs

Edit: all I can say is that collecting doffs the way I do - I will be buying hundreds of these packs for special Romulan and Borg Duty officers.

Last edited by levi3; 10-27-2012 at 10:38 AM.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 74
# 486
10-27-2012, 02:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by levi3 View Post
I think you got your "begone peons" answer by this thread and others going this far without response.
That's a two way street, push me too far and this game will be un-installed.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 455
# 487
10-27-2012, 04:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rajathomas View Post
That's a two way street, push me too far and this game will be un-installed.
^ THIS

They're pushing it. Once I start hitting an insurmountable wall from all the taxes and nerfs, STO gets deleted.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 266
# 488
10-27-2012, 05:23 PM
Wow. Simply wow dear Cryptic. First monetizing game content and then even this.

What happened to your philosophy of offering players content for free and utilizing the store to support the game to grow at F2P launch? And when I read any comment of any dev on twitter or somewhere else lamenting about how other games are set up unfair if there was a perfect other way (- the Cryptic way) I can only laugh right now.

What comes next? Flying to Sector Space cost Dilithium too, because your engines need fuel? ... utterly disappointed.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 74
# 489
10-27-2012, 05:42 PM
Yep, I've spent more on this game than any other...with these new costs they're basically saying no, it's still not enough. So I suggest whoever is making these decisions dial back a notch or two on the greed. This conversation, all 50 pages, is a perfect example of what I would characterize as fair warning...

And the message is loud and clear, tone it down or risk loosing a lot of dedicated STO people.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 14
# 490
10-27-2012, 07:53 PM
It's getting harder and harder to find the motivation to log into this game.
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