Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 725
# 121
10-31-2012, 11:46 PM
Oh what the crap.... now I'll have to make three new toons for these ... well maybe just two. Tac in a sci variant or engi healboat in a whatever varient... time to start some theory crafting posts mav?
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Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,192
# 122
11-01-2012, 12:05 AM
People who are here since the launch know exactly, that ships stats rarely change, and what's on tribble, even with bugs usually ships on holododeck week after.

There was only one time, when even Geko did need to admit he was wrong and he created T6 ship, at time when there werent even retrofits around.

The OP Excelsor with:

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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,019
# 123
11-01-2012, 12:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pwebranflakes View Post
The major concern I have is opening up those players to the "PvP" that goes on in this forum lol. It's like a warzone in here; there is so much rule-breaking going on and players are constantly are being trolled and harassed -- it's really unfortunate that a few individuals are ruining it for the rest of those who like to use this forum and provide constructive (positive or negative), civil feedback. I've been working on a thread that I've been wanting to post in here that comes from the heart as a fellow player, as well as the Community Manager. I'm hoping to have it posted soon. Basically, the trolling and harassing has to stop -- it's not good for the community, and it really doesn't help the cause.
Honestly, Brandon... I think you guys seem to be perceiving a rise in negativity and hostility and I don't think it's entirely real. That's not to say that you don't feel pressure or that there aren't bursts of panic. I think a big factor that drives that is that however much Cryptic does or doesn't communicate, they don't communicate intent.

We can't test content without knowing intent. We often can't form play strategies without knowing intent. In lieu of stated intent, the community absolutely has to start building assumptions regarding design intent and this leads to some meticulous (if very flawed) theories that genuinely fit the facts we have from the outside. And the emotional outbursts here come from a mix of brusque communication and our attempts to create a working theory of intent.

It's bizarre to me because other developers in the industry are tighter with everything else but incredibly open regarding design philosophy and design intent. Cryptic is big on the what, the how, the when, and the wishlist but treats the "why" like some kind of guarded trade secret.

But beyond that, I'd say the general tenor of the forums is about on par with what I'd call a "Sunny Summer Sunday Dinner with Grandma" level of hostility and I genuinely don't get the touchiness. I don't know if its text or that a wall of text somehow gets equated with an attack or what but I guarantee you if I expressed some of the same points that I'm sure have rankled people here over a cup of coffee, you'd think I was polite and reasonable. But if I type it up as a thorough 7 paragraph post, where I try to anticipate criticism, it becomes "forum PvP" or a "rant."

I see that as a siege mentality. You guys are maybe a bit too close to eachother and the work and a bit too far from some of your most passionate players.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,192
# 124
11-01-2012, 12:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pwebranflakes View Post
The major concern I have is opening up those players to the "PvP" that goes on in this forum lol. It's like a warzone in here; there is so much rule-breaking going on and players are constantly are being trolled and harassed -- it's really unfortunate that a few individuals are ruining it for the rest of those who like to use this forum and provide constructive (positive or negative), civil feedback. I've been working on a thread that I've been wanting to post in here that comes from the heart as a fellow player, as well as the Community Manager. I'm hoping to have it posted soon. Basically, the trolling and harassing has to stop -- it's not good for the community, and it really doesn't help the cause.
It's really simple. The more you moderate here, the more emotions you rise. For your and Cryptic's sake, it would be better to leave this section unmoderated and visit it just as a fellow pvper, not a mod.

PvP = emotions, Emotions need to get out, and people release steam on forums.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 598
# 125
11-01-2012, 12:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pwebranflakes View Post
There's absolutely some room

As for your Boot Camp post, it's something I read this morning and have been thinking about. I really, really want to help out and support it. I think it could be really fun and I have some great ideas that I'd like to share to add to it, too.

The major concern I have is opening up those players to the "PvP" that goes on in this forum lol. It's like a warzone in here; there is so much rule-breaking going on and players are constantly are being trolled and harassed -- it's really unfortunate that a few individuals are ruining it for the rest of those who like to use this forum and provide constructive (positive or negative), civil feedback. I've been working on a thread that I've been wanting to post in here that comes from the heart as a fellow player, as well as the Community Manager. I'm hoping to have it posted soon. Basically, the trolling and harassing has to stop -- it's not good for the community, and it really doesn't help the cause.

Personally, I really enjoy PvPing -- I have played with a few of the best teams out there and always have a great time. They also share feedback and I pass it along often. I also read the threads and posts in this forum and know the feelings of the community towards the current state of PvP. We (the players, the STO team, Cryptic and Perfect World) want it to be a great experience. We've got some ways to go, but if we all work together, I think we can get to a point where PvP is something we'll see more players wanting to participate in. We won't get there overnight, but I hope that the increased Dev involvement in this sub-forum is a sign and a starting point.



There's a great discussion going on right now about the Runabouts with those who are testing the Vesta. Some REALLY good feedback coming in that may even help bring a couple changes to how they work. Everything is still in discussion, so I won't say anything further than that.

Cheers,

Brandon =/\=
Thanks for the response again, Brandon.

I don't want to sidetrack this Vesta post, so perhaps we can continue this conversation either in the "Boot Camp" forum (http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/sh...d.php?t=429771) or you can contact me at my P1 email so that we can work out some details:

sargon.priorityone@gmail.com

But let me say one thing:

The idea of bringing fresh blood and helping them break through the intimidation factor that keeps them from PvP is a completely separate issue from the trolling nonsense that sometimes goes on here (but also in many other forums). Please don't let the good die because of the ugly.

There is an opportunity here for a grass-roots, education based revivification of PvP. This has already begun with groups like Pandas, Hilbert's guides, and the many other intro-to-PvP guides out there (sorry cant give credit to all of you for your hard work!) who see education and training as the key to bringing in new players. Small tastes of success are the bait that will bring in new players.

While the new players we recruit may, inadvertently, find their way into the forum-pvp-arena, they may also find their way to things like:
- The Jedi Council: Acc vs. Deffense post
- The Hilbert Guide to PvP
- Basic Tips from Survivor
- and the list could go on.

Surely access to these resources outweighs players having to read the occasional flame-post.

So please, you and I have more common ground on this issue than, prima facie, it migth seem.

My inbox is waiting . . . =)

@gradstudent1
PvP Boot Camp Project Leader Emeritus

Last edited by gradstudent1; 11-01-2012 at 12:48 AM.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,283
# 126
11-01-2012, 12:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by virusdancer View Post
Zilant, Talon, Slavemaster? Non-dread battleships...eh?

Then again, that might have to wait for the Typhoon, eh?

Maybe one "sooner" and then two with the Typhoon?
Ooooh *drools*...

Yeah only thing I'd want to see besides what I'm drooling over is a Negh'var retrofit with a LC universal so you can make it go Tactical or Sci there instead of engineering but for those who still like that LC engineering can still keep it. I'd rather see them remove the fleet negh'var like they did with sovy than having a ensign universal which is about worthless because most people would just make it engineering anyways which is what the negh'var already has.

I would go on about my idea I'll put it in Klingon Fleetyards since this is about the vesta thread but I'm glad the fed side finally got this vesta coming because its been an issue that most every player wanted it in game.

I just hope players that are mostly fed only would extend the same token on KDF getting some these long awaited ships as well that we haven't recieved either. Being Star Trek was mostly about the federation though I can see where more ships would be available to make I would just like to see the KDF not completely ignored. I guess this is a nicer way to try to explain my view on the matter.

Here's hopes that everyone enjoys their Vesta
Former PWE Community Team Lead
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 9,047
# 127
11-01-2012, 12:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gradstudent1 View Post
snip
I'll be in contact

Quote:
Originally Posted by stoleviathan99 View Post
snip
I'm primarily talking about how some individuals are treating other individuals in this forum. As you can see from the threads that are still available to post in, there are many, many threads that include "negativity" or "hostility" towards changes, additions, design decisions etc. -- after all, this is a feedback forum where all types of feedback are welcome. It's the objectionable and vulgar material/ content, the harassing comments, the name calling, and the flaming and trolling that's the problem. The moment the feedback crosses into those lines, it's not okay.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dalnar83 View Post
It's really simple. The more you moderate here, the more emotions you rise. For your and Cryptic's sake, it would be better to leave this section unmoderated and visit it just as a fellow pvper, not a mod.

PvP = emotions, Emotions need to get out, and people release steam on forums.
Unfortunately, this is not an option We want to maintain an environment where players can come to leave feedback and participate in discussion without having to be worried about what I posted above. Unfortunately, players who repeatedly break the rules will not be welcome to participate.

EDIT: We can continue this discussion in this thread if you'd like to quote this post there. Let's leave this thread for feedback regarding the "Vesta in PvP".

Cheers,

Brandon =/\=
Brandon "BranFlakes" Felczer | Former Community Team Lead for Perfect World Entertainment

Last edited by pwebranflakes; 11-01-2012 at 12:58 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 822
# 128
11-01-2012, 01:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post

or nerf runabouts. i actually would prefer this. cur thier hit points in half, and give them tractor beam 0.5 and they would mearly be as op as kdf siphon drones and advanced interceptors. if this is done, it can keep its hanger, it wont single handily double a vesta's threat and control capability anymore.
This.

Having owned an Armitage since release, I haven't once used Danubes in PvP due to a desire for fair play (not that it stopped other players from using them).
Previously Alendiak
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Former PWE Community Team Lead
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 9,047
# 129
11-01-2012, 01:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by orondis View Post
This.

Having owned an Armitage since release, I haven't once used Danubes in PvP due to a desire for fair play (not that it stopped other players from using them).
Reposting for visibility:

There's a great discussion going on right now about the Runabouts with those who are testing the Vesta. Some REALLY good feedback coming in that may even help bring a couple changes to how they work. Everything is still in discussion, so I won't say anything further than that.

Cheers,

Brandon =/\=
Brandon "BranFlakes" Felczer | Former Community Team Lead for Perfect World Entertainment
Lieutenant
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 39
# 130
11-01-2012, 01:19 AM
When it's S7 coming? can't wait to get this ship 3-pack
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