Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 633
# 51
11-06-2012, 02:17 PM
Quote:
All the way up until that Voyager episode where Paris turns into a fishman, "transwarp" basically meant "Going Really Really Fast", so fast you were everywhere at once. Theoretically, you could make ANYTHING go to transwarp if you glued a fat enough engine to its ass.
Err no, right from the moment it was introduced back in TNG it involved them going elsewhere. Notrmal warp moves you through space time using a subspace feild. Transwarp actually drops you into subspace.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,333
# 52
11-06-2012, 03:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by keppabar42 View Post
I guess I'm odd in actually liking the look of the Excelsior class. It always kind of made me think of what happened when starfleet designers tried to make a Hotrod starship!
Huge low profile engineer hull, oversized nacelles, all it needs is the chrome trim! My main wish for it, apart from a possible fleet version, would just be an authentic bridge for it. The one from the Voyager flashback episode ideally, as I think that was its best looking iterration.
Not all hot-rods need chrome trim. Please don't bring the Excel' down to the low levels of the low-level Miranda captains that have equipped their ships with;

- 22"Chrome spinner deflector array Mk III
- "Racer-X" stick on graphics Mk IV [Tacky]
-Tinted observation deck windows MK II [Delaminating]

As far as a "Fleet Excelsior", I know that I am not impressed with the other "Fleet Cruisers" but I am not sure that the Excel' should be the next platform when we could introduce ships like the Ambassador as another "Fleet Cruiser"instead.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 406
# 53
11-08-2012, 10:11 AM
Long read alert:

This is just my own justification here, and feel free to take it or leave it.

I always rationalized the way STO Transwarp engines work as enhanced warp field dynamics that actually create wormholes, similar to what happened accidentally in the first ST Movie to the Enterprise. Any ship can send their engines into a controlled imbalance that produces transwarp spacetime wormholing, but controlling the other end and making it stable enough to transit safely is the trouble.

The way Starfleet and the Empire solved this were transwarp beacons, very large subspace units that ships using transwarp distortions could 'lock onto' and make stable exit-points. With the power and tech requirements, however, such beacons require the kind of powerplant only found on the largest of starbases. Thus, all KDF and Starfleet ships are programmed to be able to transwarp to the strongest beacons, the ones in each of their HQ stations (the highest priority, since the Borg assault on Terra in 'First Contact' made clear the need to be able to bring every ship to the HQ in the event they attempt it again). Other, weaker beacons throughout space can become usable as commanders' crews become proficient with doing transwarp imbalances.

Only the Excelsior has a true Transwarp Drive engine, able to produce its own entry and exit points through subspace wormholes. Built around the drives, these ships don't need beacons (though they can use them), and their drives include special computer systems needed to compensate for subspace currents. However, the calculations needed for such real-time flux are enormous, and so only transwarps to areas carefully scouted and catalogued on a regular basis are safe to use this system for. Which is why the Excelsior's drives only transwarp to areas the Federation has substantial influence and forces within.

Needless to say, true Transwarp Drive engines are the ultimate in stardrives, able to instantly take a ship anywhere, and such drives are also hideously expensive in resources to build. This is why Excelsior-class ships remain single-project builds and not regular forces in Starfleet. For duties not requiring very quick reactions to situations a far distance away, the conventional warp driven classes of assault cruiser do the job as well for considerably less effort to build. The advances in slipstream drives also have lightened the need for this class of ship.


Sorry for the long read, but thought others might find this helpful in accepting the way Transwarp is handled in STO, even if it's just one player's attempt at justification.

Last edited by danqueller; 11-08-2012 at 11:37 AM.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5,429
# 54
11-08-2012, 09:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by danqueller View Post
Long read alert:

This is just my own justification here, and feel free to take it or leave it.

I always rationalized the way STO Transwarp engines work as enhanced warp field dynamics that actually create wormholes, similar to what happened accidentally in the first ST Movie to the Enterprise. Any ship can send their engines into a controlled imbalance that produces transwarp spacetime wormholing, but controlling the other end and making it stable enough to transit safely is the trouble.

The way Starfleet and the Empire solved this were transwarp beacons, very large subspace units that ships using transwarp distortions could 'lock onto' and make stable exit-points. With the power and tech requirements, however, such beacons require the kind of powerplant only found on the largest of starbases. Thus, all KDF and Starfleet ships are programmed to be able to transwarp to the strongest beacons, the ones in each of their HQ stations (the highest priority, since the Borg assault on Terra in 'First Contact' made clear the need to be able to bring every ship to the HQ in the event they attempt it again). Other, weaker beacons throughout space can become usable as commanders' crews become proficient with doing transwarp imbalances.

Only the Excelsior has a true Transwarp Drive engine, able to produce its own entry and exit points through subspace wormholes. Built around the drives, these ships don't need beacons (though they can use them), and their drives include special computer systems needed to compensate for subspace currents. However, the calculations needed for such real-time flux are enormous, and so only transwarps to areas carefully scouted and catalogued on a regular basis are safe to use this system for. Which is why the Excelsior's drives only transwarp to areas the Federation has substantial influence and forces within.

Needless to say, true Transwarp Drive engines are the ultimate in stardrives, able to instantly take a ship anywhere, and such drives are also hideously expensive in resources to build. This is why Excelsior-class ships remain single-project builds and not regular forces in Starfleet. For duties not requiring very quick reactions to situations a far distance away, the conventional warp driven classes of assault cruiser do the job as well for considerably less effort to build. The advances in slipstream drives also have lightened the need for this class of ship.


Sorry for the long read, but thought others might find this helpful in accepting the way Transwarp is handled in STO, even if it's just one player's attempt at justification.
I really like your post, I still feel even now the Excelsior has a lot of potential.

Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 979
# 55
11-08-2012, 09:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by danqueller View Post
Long read alert:
Schranswarp is a big deal.
Great post, and it illustrates just how attractive the ship would be for fleet modifications. As THE premier response ship in star fleet it should get the fleet treatment because of how volatile and unpredictable such emergencies are.
The Somraw, K'tinga, D'Kyr, D7, Kumari, Xindi carrier, Xindi escort, and the T'Varo are all older than the Constitution Refit and yet they are tier 5. The rule needs to change.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 960
# 56
11-08-2012, 10:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by carl103 View Post
Err no, right from the moment it was introduced back in TNG it involved them going elsewhere. Notrmal warp moves you through space time using a subspace feild. Transwarp actually drops you into subspace.
Not according to Memory Alpha:

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Transwarp_drive

In this article it makes a distinction between Feddie transwarp drives and Borg transwarp drives. It doesn't describe Starfleet's specific methods for attempting to enter transwarp, but implies that their attempts were different from the Borg method of constructing transwarp conduits. It wasn't until the Paris-fishman Voyager episode that it mentions using whatever method to enter subspace directly.

And since there's an apparent distinction between "transwarp space" and "subspace" when referring to the Borg method.

In any case, my theory stands and doesn't necessarily conflict with yours. The way they're described, Feddie attempts have been to use whatever method to break an acceleration barrier, while Borg methods have involved creating permanent shortcuts with specific entrances and exits.

With the Starbase gates, Gamma Orionis, and fixed-point transwarp exits, Starfleet seems to have picked the Borg version as the workable one, though the ability for any ship to enter transwarp from anywhere to reach a fixed exit seems to imply that a hybrid method may be in use.
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