Lt. Commander
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 197
# 161
11-08-2012, 08:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cichicichi View Post
PH negates TBR and it is a wasted comm skill that may prove a turning point in a dog fight. Are you lazy to slot it or you dont want to change your precious "i win" build? Its funny to say that when your defending a broken "i win" abilityIt's fun to stay at the butt of a target and pop it away as a tacscort in a few seconds. It also takes a hell of a mastermind to do that. Hey, it was much easier for me to play sciscort or sci cruiser than a sci in a sci vessel!

Some of you should realize that sci captains, that don't want to fly escorts/cruisers or be limited at a single compulsory role of CC (and even that not effective), want to actually feel they have a chance to do something in pvp other than die the first. Dying in this game is an indication of skill level. The best players in this game play all different types of ship/captain combos and are extremely hard to kill. You ever try to kill yak in his sci?
Problem is, your using a CC class in a CC/support designed ship, but want to also kill people. If you want to kill people so bad and you like sci ships, why don't you put a tac in a sci ship? I see these guys put up higher damage numbers than tacscorts all the time. Why are you so desperately holding onto your sci captain if killing things is so important to you?
Ensign
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 24
# 162
11-09-2012, 03:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by upyournacelles2 View Post
Problem is, your using a CC class in a CC/support designed ship, but want to also kill people. If you want to kill people so bad and you like sci ships, why don't you put a tac in a sci ship? I see these guys put up higher damage numbers than tacscorts all the time. Why are you so desperately holding onto your sci captain if killing things is so important to you?
I play as a debuffer with my sci, usually. Running multiple copies of TykR and VM, depending on pets, opponents' tactics and so on. But i dont get who decided that sci should only be good at one thing.

I started to use TBR as i was overwhelmed with SS/AMS/graviton anchor/trics spam. Mostly, the AMS followed by multiple clusters of trics was extremely annoying. TBR proved to be a life saver, so that i studied the skill and used it in battle. People almost never use PH, that is why tacscorts are the most louder on this issue. Also they have very low kinetic resists, as they rely on shields/speed.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 12,451
# 163
11-09-2012, 03:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cichicichi View Post
But i dont get who decided that sci should only be good at one thing.
I'm not sure it's a case that anybody is explicitly saying that Sci Vessels should only be good at one thing - it's kind of obvious based on the various Sci BOFF abilities that there are several things that they are good at...

...it's a painful reminded, at that, of how much Eng Vessels/Eng BOFFs need attention...

...and how they're good at multiple things, unlike Tac which is only good for one thing.

So it's more a case of saying that a Sci shouldn't be able to do EVERYTHING extremely well - when there are things that they already do extremely well that others can't.

If that were the case, then why would anybody run anything but Sci?

Given that Tac is only good for DPS - that puts Sci and Eng into support roles. They're not going to be the DPS guy. Sci leans toward Offensive Support (making it easier for the target to die), with some Defensive Support (making it harder for the target to kill), and with some DPS. Eng's kind of broken in their Defensive Support, lacking in their Offensive Support, and the DPS debate continues akin to a discussion of cake or pie.
Maal, Klingon, Mogh - Vegar, Orion, Marauder - R'ebel, Romulan, Haakona
Willard the Rat, Reman, F.T'varo - Rave, J.Trill, Kar'Fi - Mysk, Gorn, Varanus
Kopor, Nausicaan, Guramba - Nivuh, Ferasan, B'rel - Venit, Lethean, M.Qin
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,138
# 164
11-09-2012, 04:18 PM
They say this will be fixed, but how will they be fixing this? I think the main problem is not so much Tac captain buffs since I have seen many sci captains do damage with this build, but draining aux, and stacking particle gens.

I think the draining aux thing is almost an exploit, TBR was never designed with the intention to boost TBR damage by draining aux. People are using aux2bat to make this do almost no pushing then hitting with things like grav pulse and TESS to keep you there for the full damage when TBR should push you away. Also if you are in a cloaked ship you can just run full impulse for awhile to drain your aux before decloaking and getting a cheap kill.

The fix needs to deal with the aux drain issue, TBR should push at minimum like you are running 50 aux no matter how low you drain it.
Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,627
# 165
11-09-2012, 04:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by marc8219 View Post
They say this will be fixed, but how will they be fixing this? I think the main problem is not so much Tac captain buffs since I have seen many sci captains do damage with this build, but draining aux, and stacking particle gens.

I think the draining aux thing is almost an exploit, TBR was never designed with the intention to boost TBR damage by draining aux. People are using aux2bat to make this do almost no pushing then hitting with things like grav pulse and TESS to keep you there for the full damage when TBR should push you away. Also if you are in a cloaked ship you can just run full impulse for awhile to drain your aux before decloaking and getting a cheap kill.

The fix needs to deal with the aux drain issue, TBR should push at minimum like you are running 50 aux no matter how low you drain it.
It does... its impossible to make TBR NOT push... it IS possible to reduce the push. However the repel value is still 3-4 which is still more +repel then a gravity well -repels... it is simply not a high number is all. The draw back is those people have 5 aux power for 10 seconds which means there aux heals are as good as offline.

There is nothing wrong with using a combo of aux to bat and TBR yes it is working fine and as intended.

What is not working fine is the double of the scaling of particle gen which yes boosts the dmg for everyone not just tacs... and it will be fixed hopefully by the next patch.

Also I don't know if you have ever flown a cloaked ship before... but TBR does ZERO dmg to cloaked vessels that are NOT detected. However the gfx do still pop off... which does make it easier for people to fine you... Honestly switch to full aux when your in cloak and they will never see you for there tbr to do any dmg to you.

I have used TBR to kill cloaked vessels myself however I would NOT be able to kill them if they knew how to play and use there cloak.... cloak with anything less then 70 aux isn't much better then MES. Because I have also laughed in my bop... after battle cloaking and watching peoples tbr do Zero... and then uncloak when there TBR runs out. The key is having enough aux power to go undetected.
When the messenger comes to appropriate your profits ... kill the messenger.
Ensign
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 24
# 166
11-09-2012, 04:31 PM
another use for TBR: getting away from mass siphon drones spam, which of course is a great skill and takes high IQ to perform. and is not broken at all.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,138
# 167
11-09-2012, 05:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by antoniosalieri View Post
It does... its impossible to make TBR NOT push... it IS possible to reduce the push. However the repel value is still 3-4 which is still more +repel then a gravity well -repels... it is simply not a high number is all. The draw back is those people have 5 aux power for 10 seconds which means there aux heals are as good as offline.

There is nothing wrong with using a combo of aux to bat and TBR yes it is working fine and as intended.

What is not working fine is the double of the scaling of particle gen which yes boosts the dmg for everyone not just tacs... and it will be fixed hopefully by the next patch.

Also I don't know if you have ever flown a cloaked ship before... but TBR does ZERO dmg to cloaked vessels that are NOT detected. However the gfx do still pop off... which does make it easier for people to fine you... Honestly switch to full aux when your in cloak and they will never see you for there tbr to do any dmg to you.

I have used TBR to kill cloaked vessels myself however I would NOT be able to kill them if they knew how to play and use there cloak.... cloak with anything less then 70 aux isn't much better then MES. Because I have also laughed in my bop... after battle cloaking and watching peoples tbr do Zero... and then uncloak when there TBR runs out. The key is having enough aux power to go undetected.
Well its push isn't enough to push you out of range for the entire duration if aux is drained.

Also I play B'rel BOP sometimes, TBR isn't a problem for me in that ship since my aux is always high due to not needing weapon weapon power for a torp boat. Main problem I run into is when on a ship without battle cloak like a Raptor or Torkaht, or when I occaisonaly play fed a Fleet Defiant.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 12,451
# 168
11-09-2012, 05:07 PM
It's easy to keep a target in range with EM or an Eng Batt... you move faster than the repel.
Maal, Klingon, Mogh - Vegar, Orion, Marauder - R'ebel, Romulan, Haakona
Willard the Rat, Reman, F.T'varo - Rave, J.Trill, Kar'Fi - Mysk, Gorn, Varanus
Kopor, Nausicaan, Guramba - Nivuh, Ferasan, B'rel - Venit, Lethean, M.Qin
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 633
# 169
11-09-2012, 05:55 PM
really i don't get why the damage dosen't scale with aux, wouldn't fix the issue tottally, (i hate that it has damage priod, it's a CC skill for crying out loud), as even a few ticks are nasty, and people would still be stupid with it in PVE, but it would help a lot.
Ensign
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 24
# 170
11-10-2012, 02:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by carl103 View Post
really i don't get why the damage dosen't scale with aux, wouldn't fix the issue tottally, (i hate that it has damage priod, it's a CC skill for crying out loud), as even a few ticks are nasty, and people would still be stupid with it in PVE, but it would help a lot.
The damage scales with PartGen as intended, as FBP or TykR does. Yes, TBR is a CC skill, quite a good one but which needs skillful flying. Simply popping it would do nothing but to further an enemy from your team, which may very well equal with his saving ticket. TBR is very good against AMS/trics combo as well as against cloaked trics.

Yes, as Pax said, you dont have to aim but only if you are using it with no scope just to do some blind damage or to push enemies away as a last minute action. If you do want to do something more, you need to aim.

Usually, except for the weakest players or special lockdown situation, you can give 2 pulses to 3 targets (including mines, pets, platforms, HYT etc). If you manage to charge an enemy, you can do additionally 2-3 pulses. That hardly kills anyone except those having no defenses at all.

I am ok that they intend to correct the scaling with PartGen BUT i am not ok with the fact the devs said nothing about tac buffs boosting TBR at insane levels.
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