Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,977
# 31
11-10-2012, 04:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shimmerless View Post
I don't mean to be too blunt or cruel, but I honestly don't think this game's ship designers know or play enough PvP to tell us what we should think or feel about any of their ship concepts.

Whether they think the Vesta is too strong or too weak is immaterial, the real problem (and what ultimately rubs) is that they just don't have the experience to hold such an opinion one way or the other.
describes everyone in this thread defending the vesta.

i saw branflakes pvp a few times in a bug the other day pvping, that was encouraging. he kinda stunk, and didn't respond to my first hi there pm, so i didn't want to pester him if he just wants to play without getting celebrity attention. out of all the 'devs' he is proboly the best pvper among them unfortunately.
gateway links-->Norvo Tigan, Telis Latto Ruwon, Sochie Heim, Solana Soleus
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 658
# 32
11-10-2012, 05:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
sci captain uber build

3 non aux DHC, 2 crono mines, or tric mines, 1 beam array for subsytem targeting.

TT1, CRF1
EPtS1, AtB1, EWP1
EPtA1, AtB1

TSS1, HE2, ST3, VM3
TB1

runabouts
3 tech doffs, 2 vm doffs

every one of these abilities can be used at their global cooldown. never ending VM, never ending tractor hold from pets and yourself, never ending plasma hold, global TT and CRF. the only question is how long it will take for you to die, wile you are rendered completely helpless. don't for get SA, the longer you take a pounding, the more damage it will deal.

this is just the most uber thing i can think of, there are proboly at least 5-10 other builds that could completely dominate as well.
Wow, now you're just being nasty, trying to make any credulous newbs reading this thread use a completely worthless build. First, the 3 tech doffs aren't going to push many of these abilities to global, it's only a total of 30%, so TT, ST, CRF, and TB won't be at global. I don't know about VM, because it's the most useless ability in the game, shutting down totally random systems not including shields for just a few seconds. I used it for a few months when I had just started the game before realizing that it's simply a waste of an ability slot. And of course, an AtB build that relies so heavily on Aux for its heals will surely struggle to survive under heavy fire.

Here's the build I'll be using, not optimized I'm sure, but quite potent and a good deal of fun in ESTFs:

2 aux DHC 1 quantum torp, 3 phaser turrets

TT1, CSV1
TS1

EPtS1, EPtS2
HE1, TSS2, TR2, GW3
ST1, CPB1, PSW1

runabouts (subject to change, I may choose a higher damage pet)
1 GW doff, 1 Warp Core Engineer doff, others as you like

For large targets, head in at top speed all weapons firing, hit TR immediately, CSV at 7 km, CPB at 5, and TS for your next torpedo (when the shields may be down). A GW when TR runs out will keep heavy plasma torps in check. Frigates can have GW first and be dead before it runs out. Wait for probes/BoPs to come to you, and use GW when they're fairly close to maximize your firepower. CPB is a utility power: emergency torp killer, tractor beam breaker, or simply extra kinetic damage. TT is primarily for clearing Assimilate Ship, although it can also be used for shield redistribution.

I've pushed this build (minus runabouts and with single cannons) to 4k DPS on my Fleet Recon, I'm very hopeful to do better with the Vesta.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,395
# 33
11-10-2012, 06:29 PM
I'm sorry dude but I lost the ability to finish reading your post right about the point you said VM was a worthless skill.

vids and guides and stuff

[9:52] [Zone #11] Neal@trapper1532: im a omega force shadow oprative and a maoc elite camander and here i am taking water samples
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,977
# 34
11-10-2012, 06:39 PM
^ i didn't know it was this possible to be wrong about so many things at once. to say i don't know what im talking about, and then to post that useless combination of powers.

CPB? a skill that literally does nothing? TBR and GW? make up your mind to you want them held or pushed? and PSW1, an ability that is useful at cancelling someones ES and EWP, and does nothing else. and you say VM is useless? well its not the best thing there is without doffs, but with it can shut down 3 subsystems for quite a wile very reliably. its sci's best tool right now with doffs.

theres only a handful of people that know the power of 2 AtB, and your clearly not one of them. how does slashing all running cooldowns every 10 seconds sound to you? how does a 10 second power bonus to all other subsystems, every 10 seconds, sound to you? and it absoultly does result in every ability cut down to about its global.

the information in your post is so backward it would be considered trolling, whether thats what your trying to do or not.
gateway links-->Norvo Tigan, Telis Latto Ruwon, Sochie Heim, Solana Soleus
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,746
# 35
11-10-2012, 07:10 PM
PvEers check out my siglink if you want to learn more about the game.


Click here and here if you are interested in learning more about PvP.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,746
# 36
11-10-2012, 07:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ravin View Post
95% of ignorant PvEers will tell you that STO has no meaningful PvP at all, because they got destroyed in a queue the one time they braved the queues. And because they lack the courage to improve themselves and become a better player.
Fixed.

If anyone here wants to get better at the game, read my siglink. It's a treasure trove of information about PVP from people who have played it a high level for years.


Click here and here if you are interested in learning more about PvP.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 658
# 37
11-10-2012, 08:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
^ i didn't know it was this possible to be wrong about so many things at once. to say i don't know what im talking about, and then to post that useless combination of powers.
I've been feeling the same way about you for a while now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
CPB? a skill that literally does nothing?
No, CPB, the most powerful shield drain sci has, particularly since it's multi target. Maybe it is weak in PvP where your targets have resistance to it, but with only moderate Aux it can take down half a facing on an ESTF cube.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
TBR and GW? make up your mind to you want them held or pushed?
I did not say TBR, one of the riskiest powers to carry into an STF, I said TR, Tyken's Rift, the AoE power drain/torp killer which, with the high Aux the Vesta will allow, might just take down a target's shields for a full 10 seconds. Maybe not quite as good at single target as Energy Siphon, but the torp killing and emergency probe/BoP slowing make up the difference and make it a valuable way to protect your team.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
and PSW1, an ability that is useful at cancelling someones ES and EWP, and does nothing else.
I posted a full sentence on the many ways to use PSW, and I skipped a few too, for example it can also be useful if you can get in front of the probes in KASE and use it on them just before they reach you, giving you an extra 15 seconds or so to kill them and causing ~10% hull damage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
and you say VM is useless? well its not the best thing there is without doffs, but with it can shut down 3 subsystems for quite a wile very reliably. its sci's best tool right now with doffs.
Maybe in PvP, although I find it hard to believe, but in PvE the delay, randomness, single target nature, and short duration make it one of the most useless powers there is. I suppose it's better than Mask Energy Signature, and AFKing is of course better than a poorly used TBR, but that's about all that can be said for it. Using VM is definitely wasting a boff slot that has better uses.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
theres only a handful of people that know the power of 2 AtB, and your clearly not one of them. how does slashing all running cooldowns every 10 seconds sound to you? how does a 10 second power bonus to all other subsystems, every 10 seconds, sound to you? and it absoultly does result in every ability cut down to about its global.
I'm perfectly willing to believe that AtB builds can be powerful, and it's true that I haven't tried one myself, I'm just not a cruiser person. But my math was accurate, and the fact that it's going to be nerfing almost all of the heals you posted severely is also accurate. If you want to do that you need heals that aren't going to be affected by the fact that your Aux power is constantly near or at nothing. Now, it does seem that the wiki was wrong and AtB does not currently share a global with EPtS, so you might get close to full uptime on that by this method, and that is certainly powerful, but it only goes so far, and when pressed you will find yourself without significant healing that can be used at a moment's notice. Worse, you're now running a ship without a real role: its healing is too weak to tank effectively, it of course cannot approach the firepower of an escort (all the more since you have neglected all sci damage), and it lacks the good controls and debuffs like GW and the energy drains, leaving only a random single target control/firepower debuff, another single target control, and the captain abilities that could be used to better advantage on a stronger ship and build.

To sum up: the information in your post is so backward it could be considered trolling, whether that's what you're trying to do or not.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,977
# 38
11-10-2012, 09:38 PM
its not worth it. if you got things so figured out, try the pvp ques next time. you talk of how things work so well in pve, well thats just fine for pve, were even the most elite stf is absolute child's play. at the very least, a few pvp matches should give you a hint that you don't know even 1/10 of what you think you know about this game.
gateway links-->Norvo Tigan, Telis Latto Ruwon, Sochie Heim, Solana Soleus
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,192
# 39
11-10-2012, 09:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jadensecura View Post
Wow, now you're just being nasty, trying to make any credulous newbs reading this thread use a completely worthless build. First, the 3 tech doffs aren't going to push many of these abilities to global, it's only a total of 30%, so TT, ST, CRF, and TB won't be at global. I don't know about VM, because it's the most useless ability in the game, shutting down totally random systems not including shields for just a few seconds. I used it for a few months when I had just started the game before realizing that it's simply a waste of an ability slot. And of course, an AtB build that relies so heavily on Aux for its heals will surely struggle to survive under heavy fire.

Here's the build I'll be using, not optimized I'm sure, but quite potent and a good deal of fun in ESTFs:

2 aux DHC 1 quantum torp, 3 phaser turrets

TT1, CSV1
TS1

EPtS1, EPtS2
HE1, TSS2, TR2, GW3
ST1, CPB1, PSW1

runabouts (subject to change, I may choose a higher damage pet)
1 GW doff, 1 Warp Core Engineer doff, others as you like

For large targets, head in at top speed all weapons firing, hit TR immediately, CSV at 7 km, CPB at 5, and TS for your next torpedo (when the shields may be down). A GW when TR runs out will keep heavy plasma torps in check. Frigates can have GW first and be dead before it runs out. Wait for probes/BoPs to come to you, and use GW when they're fairly close to maximize your firepower. CPB is a utility power: emergency torp killer, tractor beam breaker, or simply extra kinetic damage. TT is primarily for clearing Assimilate Ship, although it can also be used for shield redistribution.

I've pushed this build (minus runabouts and with single cannons) to 4k DPS on my Fleet Recon, I'm very hopeful to do better with the Vesta.
LOL, Are we playing the same game ?
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,015
# 40
11-10-2012, 10:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jadensecura View Post
Wow, now you're just being nasty, trying to make any credulous newbs reading this thread use a completely worthless build. First, the 3 tech doffs aren't going to push many of these abilities to global, it's only a total of 30%, so TT, ST, CRF, and TB won't be at global. I don't know about VM, because it's the most useless ability in the game, shutting down totally random systems not including shields for just a few seconds. I used it for a few months when I had just started the game before realizing that it's simply a waste of an ability slot. And of course, an AtB build that relies so heavily on Aux for its heals will surely struggle to survive under heavy fire.

Here's the build I'll be using, not optimized I'm sure, but quite potent and a good deal of fun in ESTFs:

2 aux DHC 1 quantum torp, 3 phaser turrets

TT1, CSV1
TS1

EPtS1, EPtS2
HE1, TSS2, TR2, GW3
ST1, CPB1, PSW1

runabouts (subject to change, I may choose a higher damage pet)
1 GW doff, 1 Warp Core Engineer doff, others as you like

For large targets, head in at top speed all weapons firing, hit TR immediately, CSV at 7 km, CPB at 5, and TS for your next torpedo (when the shields may be down). A GW when TR runs out will keep heavy plasma torps in check. Frigates can have GW first and be dead before it runs out. Wait for probes/BoPs to come to you, and use GW when they're fairly close to maximize your firepower. CPB is a utility power: emergency torp killer, tractor beam breaker, or simply extra kinetic damage. TT is primarily for clearing Assimilate Ship, although it can also be used for shield redistribution.

I've pushed this build (minus runabouts and with single cannons) to 4k DPS on my Fleet Recon, I'm very hopeful to do better with the Vesta.
You are mistaken regarding A2B. 2 copies slams everything to global. It's not surprising that you don't understand this because not many people have caught on. I was a fan of Tech doffs but drunk blew my mind when he posted what you can do with doubling them up.

CSV at 7 km is a turd sandwich hold the bread. Here's why.

CPB is terribad. VM is the first thing I want to throw at an escort with a hot stick. TT loaded for shield distribution, so much so that "it can also be used for shield distribution" is so far out of touch I'm not really sure we're playing the same game.

dontdrunkimshoot is one of the most knowledgeable players around. You are posting misinformation regarding the value of abilities because you have a shallow understanding of them. Respecs aren't free, and the one doing a disservice to "credulous newbs" is you.
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