Captain
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 663
# 41
11-13-2012, 05:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kylephoenix3 View Post
You dont need p2w consoles. get a tactical, max your tractor beam repulsors and youre good to go. simple isnt?
If it only was....
Co-founder of The Spanish Inquisition TSI - Cause no one expects it!

PaxOttomana: gawd mirror event is like fighting a tsi premade, they keep comin and comin!
Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 363
# 42
11-13-2012, 06:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dalnar83 View Post
But killing them without any P2W is much much more sweatier.
Sweatier?

Deodorant Mk XII [NoSweat]x3 will solve that problem. I use it, I kinda wish a lot of others did too.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,192
# 43
11-13-2012, 06:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxottoman View Post
Sweatier?

Deodorant Mk XII [NoSweat]x3 will solve that problem. I use it, I kinda wish a lot of others did too.
Pfff sweeter. But nothing compared to Pammukale I visited this summer. That place was HELL and I swear I sweat like never in my whole life when that evil yellow eye burned on my back.
Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 363
# 44
11-13-2012, 06:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dalnar83 View Post
I sweat like never in my whole life when that evil yellow eye burned on my back.
Sauron's eye was at Pammukkale? lol.

You should of took a dip in the hot springs at the top of the mountain. It's like paradise up there. I've only been up there once, loved it. I went to Bodrum on the same trip, 24/hr party down there.

Before we get rage banned, I have to say something on topic.

That's the Vesta will be very worth while on a tactical/maco set stand point. I tested the Heavy Graviton beam at full aux and the damage is significant. The set will also be buffed is what I am understanding.

Stay away from Sauron's eye.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 298
# 45
11-13-2012, 07:46 AM
P2W- It sucks, but sadly it is the way of the game now, any single person logging into STO for the first time will immediately notice that this game is P2W, why? cuz it is. That being said... EVERYONE <pvpr base> uses some form of p2w, be it snb doffs, ap doffs, other types of doffs,etc they bought, consoles, ships they bought, 50 mill ec Mk XII Accx3 weapons or Mk XII items they bought by selling items they acquired by using there credit card etc.

The list goes on and on and on, its the cool thing right now to use it and then deny that you do, or to have it and say that you dont, but just enter the queues with some of these ppl and you will see <quite quickly I might add> that they are full of bull ****.

Everone wants to win..noone likes to lose.. THAT is a fact and it is engrained in every single human being out there. I can honestly say this... if you fight a fleet or a dedicated group or w/e and you beat them.. the cheese is on and will come out.. they have it,, and have spent good money on it. It is there and will be brought out if any egos are bruised, this is the same across the board.

P2W is here to stay.. Cryptic has realized ppl will do anything to win <no really? lol> and so they are cashing in on it, I use it myself, although I cant afford most of it, I use what I can. Snb doffs and other expesive stuff like that, that I cant afford aside.

I readily admit to using it, why? Because EVERYONE else does.
I dont care how ardently they deny it. AND I am obv. not the only one who notices this since Cryptic increases the P2W in this game every other month or so.. <Some one must be buying it for them to keep cranking it out like they do. FACT.>

Now some people arent going like what I just said.. but its the plain ole simple truth and you know it... Cryptic does too and that is why it just keeps coming and coming. Srry bro..truth hurts, grab an Advil.



Yeah, that's right.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,990
# 46
11-13-2012, 08:05 AM
"The game is P2W" would imply that you simply cannot win with a reasonable chance against anyone who uses P2W gear if you don't.

And that is, in my opinion, simply not the case in STO space combat.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Promote what you love, instead of bashing what you hate.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 298
# 47
11-13-2012, 08:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sophlogimo View Post
"The game is P2W" would imply that you simply cannot win with a reasonable chance against anyone who uses P2W gear if you don't.

And that is, in my opinion, simply not the case in STO space combat.
That.........wasn't what I was saying... all I was saying was that p2w is here to stay and that everyone uses it in one form or another. I was merely using descriptive license to fully iterate my point. Sorry if I lost you there.



Yeah, that's right.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 351
# 48
11-13-2012, 08:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adon333 View Post
P2W- It sucks, but sadly it is the way of the game now, any single person logging into STO for the first time will immediately notice that this game is P2W, why? cuz it is. That being said... EVERYONE <pvpr base> uses some form of p2w, be it snb doffs, ap doffs, other types of doffs,etc they bought, consoles, ships they bought, 50 mill ec Mk XII Accx3 weapons or Mk XII items they bought by selling items they acquired by using there credit card etc.
That is true. People are so fixed on consoles that they tend to ignore other stuff. Can you afford purple doffs, or do you have only blue ones? Do you have [acc]x3 weapons? Do you have MK XI or MK XII stuff? The difference between blue MK XI dmg consoles and purple MK XII is about 4% I think. With 4 tac consoles that would be about 16% which is about half a console.
Also there are the ships. Even a simple defiant is either a vet reward or you have to buy it from the shop. So where does p2w start? If you say you do not use it, does that mean you run only free ships and no item that costs more than 10m ec since it is the free acc credit limit?


Quote:
Originally Posted by adon333 View Post
Everone wants to win..noone likes to lose.. THAT is a fact and it is engrained in every single human being out there. I can honestly say this... if you fight a fleet or a dedicated group or w/e and you beat them.. the cheese is on and will come out.. they have it,, and have spent good money on it. It is there and will be brought out if any egos are bruised, this is the same across the board.
That is not entirely true. Yes everyone wants to win but honestly, if I have a truly amazing game of two equal teams I don't care that much. Yes a victory is what makes such a match perfect but loosing won't bruise my ego. In a really good match even loosing can be fun, especially if you have a good relation with your opponents.
Also I might add I have my own sense of honor or whatever you like to call it. There are some things I won't use, like a drain carrier for example. I do not use everything I own, I consider carefully what I use in pvp. Like I use a leech because I have one, it's awesome and I see no reason not to. If they break it again and it stacks I will unequip it and the moment they fix it use it again.
I will not hide what i use, some of it is p2w stuff. But I do care up to a certain point about my enemies. I usually go with something like "I only use what I would not mind others using against me".
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 853
# 49
11-13-2012, 08:32 AM
I refuse to use P2W consoles, broken abilities and SNB doffs in PvP as those things are what reduces the fun for everyone involved (unless you're the type who like ROFLSTOMPs)

I want to win with skill and brains, not because I hit my SNB area-effect console and trick myself into thinking that it's my skills that got the kill.

If I die to a fair player then there's a good chance it was an enjoyable fight. If I die because someone hit me with AMS, SNB-console and drain my power to 0 with power siphons then I will have not enjoyed the "fight".

At the end of the day I PvP for enjoyment, being able to fight players who fight with skill and/or good builds. I've been defeated by some of you continually and I've enjoyed it. If I'm being killed by P2W then that'll be just as unfun as the 1 hit kills isometric as the prior-to-nerf diamond in Hive onslaught (actually that was atleast some fun).

In find no enjoyment in ROFL easy kills, in fact I generally avoid them and seek out harder fights. Which is why some of you may find me searching for you in C&H. It's not because I have any dislike for you, it's probably because you're the only skilled player on your team.
Previously Alendiak
Daizen - Lvl 50 Engineer - Fleet Avenger
Selia - Lvl 50 Tactical - Fleet Avenger
Toval - Lvl 50 Tactical - Fleet Mogai

Last edited by orondis; 11-13-2012 at 08:45 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,295
# 50
11-13-2012, 08:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adon333 View Post
P2W- It sucks, but sadly it is the way of the game now, any single person logging into STO for the first time will immediately notice that this game is P2W, why? cuz it is. That being said... EVERYONE <pvpr base> uses some form of p2w, be it snb doffs, ap doffs, other types of doffs,etc they bought, consoles, ships they bought, 50 mill ec Mk XII Accx3 weapons or Mk XII items they bought by selling items they acquired by using there credit card etc.

The list goes on and on and on, its the cool thing right now to use it and then deny that you do, or to have it and say that you dont, but just enter the queues with some of these ppl and you will see <quite quickly I might add> that they are full of bull ****.

Everone wants to win..noone likes to lose.. THAT is a fact and it is engrained in every single human being out there. I can honestly say this... if you fight a fleet or a dedicated group or w/e and you beat them.. the cheese is on and will come out.. they have it,, and have spent good money on it. It is there and will be brought out if any egos are bruised, this is the same across the board.

P2W is here to stay.. Cryptic has realized ppl will do anything to win <no really? lol> and so they are cashing in on it, I use it myself, although I cant afford most of it, I use what I can. Snb doffs and other expesive stuff like that, that I cant afford aside.

I readily admit to using it, why? Because EVERYONE else does.
I dont care how ardently they deny it. AND I am obv. not the only one who notices this since Cryptic increases the P2W in this game every other month or so.. <Some one must be buying it for them to keep cranking it out like they do. FACT.>

Now some people arent going like what I just said.. but its the plain ole simple truth and you know it... Cryptic does too and that is why it just keeps coming and coming. Srry bro..truth hurts, grab an Advil.
I do understand your frustration, but I personally disagree with some of the things you mention to be P2W. I believe that when most of us say that we don't use P2W, it is because we don't use the things we personally believe to be P2W. For example, things like purple Mk XII equipment don't seem cheesy to me, as they are not obviously irritating when used.

Lockbox ships are borderline cases for me. I personally use some of them, as I painstakingly ground EC for them for at least a month each. I do recognise that the average player may not necessarily have time to do this. However, I think that lockbox ships do not perform that much better than the stock ships.

Things like SNB doffs, on the other hand, I usually stay away from. This is because using them feels cheesy to me, despite the fact that I can afford them. To some people, it is not necessarily the winning that counts. It is more of the effort that you put into proving that your skills exceed that of your opponent. Here, I use an analogy of chess. It feels much more satisfying having beaten your opponent in a normal game, as opposed to having won after a queen handicap. However, I do recognise the fact that there are those whose minds are set on winning at any cost, and so use P2W/broken equipment. I do get a little vindictive at times, and bring out the broken stuff (e.g. Grav. Pulse/AMS) if I find them being used on me, but I try my best to beat them without the additional crutch first. After a fashion, I am guilty, given that I store these in my inventory.

Except for TBR, though. I find it very useful to clear pet spam/mines despite being unbuffed on a sci/sci. I would still have used it even if it wasn't broken, however, and I will still use it after it's fixed.

In a nutshell, my approach is:
1. I have a personal idea of what I believe is P2W/broken, besides that in general consensus.
2. I try my best to win without using them, as I have a greater sense of accomplishment doing so.
3. However, if I find myself very obviously on the losing end of a battle involving such abilities being used on me (e.g. 7 to 0), then, depending on my mood, I just might mount that P2W and give whoever's been using them on me a taste of his own medicine. Of course, this comeback doesn't always work.

Just my personal opinion.
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