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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,405
# 21
11-14-2012, 11:40 AM
I'll look at the parser link. i've downloaded it but will install it later.

makemydayfreeper: We've got an issue in this community as to what DPS really is. I looked at the 8000 dps listed in the end of his second video and it doesn't add up. In 13 minutes and 29 seconds, let's say 13.5 minutes, times 60 seconds - 810 seconds, he did 3,897,416 damage.

Well 3,897,416 / 810 = 4811 dps according to windows calculator.

This is my issue when folks claim massive DPS. I think he's using some very old plugin or something that does inaccurate calculations for dps. it's nearly double what it should be. DPS is literally damage total divided by duration of match.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,462
# 22
11-14-2012, 12:35 PM
Well, some people are using "peak DPS", i.e. what they can sustain on a stationary target just unloading all of their weapons. That's more typical of MMORPGs, where it is less important how agile you are or how quickly you can change targets, and more important how much hurt you can dish out once you get to the target. Here in STO a majority use the "mission DPS" or "strategic DPS" which is not only your firepower but how quick you are and how effectively you can handle multi-target scenarios.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,405
# 23
11-14-2012, 01:10 PM
But that's a lie... If I pop fire on my mark, tactical fleet, EPTW, red matter device, attack pattern alpha, and cannon rapid fire with torp spread thrown in for good measure I'm going to break 10,000 dps most likely. It's a lie to claim that's my DPS.

DPS is an average. It includes lulls and it includes cooldowns on your alpha strike skills. Claiming anything other than an average is misleading (intentionally IMO).

EDIT: P.S. You can't deny that whether that was his intent or not, his stats tracker was wrong. It was listing his dps as almost double what it was based on simple math.
Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 139
# 24
11-14-2012, 01:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodentmaster View Post
I'll look at the parser link. i've downloaded it but will install it later.

makemydayfreeper: We've got an issue in this community as to what DPS really is. I looked at the 8000 dps listed in the end of his second video and it doesn't add up. In 13 minutes and 29 seconds, let's say 13.5 minutes, times 60 seconds - 810 seconds, he did 3,897,416 damage.

Well 3,897,416 / 810 = 4811 dps according to windows calculator.

This is my issue when folks claim massive DPS. I think he's using some very old plugin or something that does inaccurate calculations for dps. it's nearly double what it should be. DPS is literally damage total divided by duration of match.
You mix up the start time of the mission with it's actual duration. 7:13 was the duration of the combat, if you check the length of the video, it matches perfectly. It was the fastest round of KASE I frapsed so far, thanks to the great team we had that day.

Still, ACT just counts the raw damage with the 1.1.0.0 plugin I used. I've updated to Hilbert's 1.0.7.1 and calculated it again (still shield and hull damage), the result can be viewed here: http://i.imgur.com/miyVl.jpg

And if you want further proof, just contact me in game to play a round or two: @Hellspawny

Still, comparing results with ACT data is a two sided sword since every round can be quite different. If I use a trico bomber in CSE, I can easily top 16k DPS due to >250k crits. ACT counts 250k even if the cube has just 10k. And you need to be in combat all the time, so defending the kang, probe duty etc. will most likely ruin you DPS.

Visit the German STO forum: www.sto-center.de/forum
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/user/STOHellspawny
Weapon Damage Calculator: Download

Last edited by xxxhellspawnyxxx; 11-14-2012 at 01:58 PM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,405
# 25
11-14-2012, 01:54 PM
That does explain the dps issue I latched onto. Thanks
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,462
# 26
11-14-2012, 03:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodentmaster View Post
But that's a lie... If I pop fire on my mark, tactical fleet, EPTW, red matter device, attack pattern alpha, and cannon rapid fire with torp spread thrown in for good measure I'm going to break 10,000 dps most likely. It's a lie to claim that's my DPS.
But, again, things are different in typical MMORPGs where you might have half a dozen people all clobbering the same enemy for minutes at a time. In those games, "DPS" is not a statistic so much as a role to play. For that context, damage output discounting survivability and mobility is relevant to what the player needs to do. For STO the boundaries between roles are much more vague. Every ship contributes damage, every ship needs to be able to move around, every ship needs to be able to survive a few hits. That's why we in STO-land prefer "strategic DPS" since it's an aggregate measure of several things.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,405
# 27
11-14-2012, 05:45 PM
I get it when you use DPS loosely to define a role, but when any kind of numerical stat comes into play, it's not used loosely anymore.

Stats are numbers. Numbers are culled from the logs. DPS then has only one meaning. Damage per second. It's an average over time meant to average spikes with cooldowns to come to a representative damage output that you may have.

Anyways, I have got the combatlog parser you linked up and running and will be recording some matches in my F K'Tinga R to see how it compares. I may even try to mix and match some setups to compare other weapons (i.e. all turrets aft, lose my TCD, etc) depending on what I have available in my bank and on my secondary ships.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,405
# 28
11-14-2012, 07:48 PM
I'm sorry to say it's no longer a comparison of apples to apples... Cryptic morons royally fubared the STFs we have. All borg are resisting like half the damage they normally took. My battlecruiser and another escort both with cannons took at least 10 minutes to down our gate on KASE. It was totally ludicrous! I got a 92k-freaking crit TCD mine on an unshielded sphere in the same match and it took him from half hull down to 1/4 hull!!!! WTF?!?!?!?


Meanwhile borg cubes and spheres sap your shield strength about 5x faster, or I noticed in many cases they just ignore shields entirely and do direct hull damage for no ******ned reason.


So the entire time I'm running DHCs and I did by FAR the most damage of anybody in the match with OVER 5 million damage, it says my DPS was 2800 and I believe it because all the damage resistance is totally ****ed up now on the borg side. It's through the roof. That match took half an hour! Maybe more! It was an utter nightmare!

So... yeah... Can't compare because the benchmark has totally freaking changed. Screw you, cryptic programmers!
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 670
# 29
11-14-2012, 09:22 PM
I do not know if anyone has said this, but I'm rather partial to my Fleet Tor'Kaht. This is all from memory, as I have not been able to play in a while.

3 DHC/1 Quantum Fore, 4 Turrets Aft.

KHG Shiwld
KHG Deflector
Borg Engine

4x Neutronium
Borg Console, Universal of choice. I currently have a Point Defense slotted.
4x Energy Damage

CMD Engi: EP2W, DEM, X2Damp, X2SIF
Ensign Engi: EP2S
LTC Tac: TT, CSV/CRF, TS3/HY3.
LT Tac: TT, CSV/CRF.
LT Uni: TS1/HY1, APB.

I know it may seem utterly mad to not have any Sci Powers, but this can crank out some serious damage. Oh, and my Captain is a Tac.
Constant exposure to the same opinions leads to continual reinforcement of ideas until eventually, any challenge, no matter what form it takes, is going to be met with a disproportionate sense of outrage. Room for reasoned discussion can no longer occur.

Ensign
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 7
# 30
11-15-2012, 04:49 PM
There is another definition for dps : dps for the time you were in combat -it is unreasonable to calculate dps for the entire stf since a part of it is spend in full impulse moving from target to target. What we need is a "dummy" like the ones you could get in your ship in TOR , except space based - maybe as a part of a holodeck. Actually I wonder if you can make a custom mission (foundry?) with ships and structures that do not shoot back for the express purpose of measuring dps.
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