Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,508
# 31
11-16-2012, 03:00 AM
If we are projecting on how long it would take personally I'd say never, I can't promise I will last months with nothing to do now stf is gone.

But the exact number for the rep system remains 58.02875 days.

Add to that, the average user supposedly spends more than 7 hours in-game per week.
That's a lot more fuel that the reputation system needs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by neoakiraii View Post
I use the STF's to get MACO stuff, not dilithium.

I like the new system, I don't have to burn myself out if I want mark 12 MACO gear for my alts now...I don't have to carry players who are bad, and watch them get the tech drop....it's not a perfect system, but it's better than the old system.
So you do want the gear ? Well make up your mind, you are reverting yourself everytime you post.
Gear goes on the c-store, since you so happy being dilithium for it.
Grinders get to continue working on stf as they used to without you being involved.

Same question again what would be the problem ? What would the difference be between dishing out 120.000 dil in the rep window or doing it the c-store window ?
You do realize you are paying for the sets now, right
Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,093
# 32
11-16-2012, 03:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vestereng View Post



So you do want the gear ? Well make up your mind, you are reverting yourself everytime you post.
Gear goes on the c-store, since you so happy being dilithium for it.
Grinders get to continue working on stf as they used to without you being involved.

Same question again what would be the problem ? What would the difference be between dishing out 120.000 dil in the rep window or doing it the c-store window ?
You do realize you are paying for the sets now, right
Yeah lets put the gear on the C store...yeah pretty sure STFs would drop and people would buy the sets and not bother doing the mission.

When did I say I don't want gear? 5 of my characters has Mark 12, and now more of my Alts will. What i don't want is random drops of guessing games of when will I get my tech drop, and now its gone and I am Happy!!! Soo happy I feel like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBTRp80Q64U


Lieutenant
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 45
# 33
11-16-2012, 03:32 AM
Ok in a nutshell.. My maths is not necessarily solid..

It can be done alot sooner, provided you dont sleep, eat, work, or do anything BUT play STO and grind the STF's 24/7, timing your mission clocks to run in perfect consecutive order (aka the second it finishes the 1day 16hour countdown, you re-start it).

So yep.. in about 3-4 days you can get to Tier 1, about 18 days to Tier 3 and just under 2 months for Tier 5.

Of course.. Normal humans dont operate like that.

So even devoting 8 hours a day (excluding sleep and work), but still timing everything to perfection.. well it equates to about 1 month to Tier 3 and 2-3 Months for Tier 5.

But again, not many people are likely to do this even, or be able to time everything to perfection for the timer countdowns.

So hours will be lost, extra time added etc etc. It is quite plausable that for a casual player (esp when combined with Fleet building and Embassy Building - both GREAT additions to the game)... it is quite feasable for it to take people anywhere from 6-12 months to get to tier 5.

Honestly, if someone hasnt found at least one full set of MK XII equipment in that time in playing the missions at the same rate as would be required too now (I do feel sorry because they must be the unluckiest person in the world), then hmmm...

We can make all the excuses we want, BUT in a Marketing/Customer service aspect, it is not a good system. It discourages the majority (who are casual players). I have no issue with F2P people. I dont think just because a person pays to play they are automatically entitled to special rewards that others cant get. BUT to survive, the game needs people to pay to play.

Setting a system that requires you to spend 2-3 hours (depending on how lucky you get with other players) in order to obtain a measly 5 rep points when you require 5,000 or 32,500 or 100,000... or to sit here and press a few buttons, wait 1.7 days... press a few buttons, wait 1.7 days... repeat for 2-8 months (which I think is what it will average out too).. Not a great way to encourage people to pay subscription fees for a service that fundamentally is good, but simply too much.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,508
# 34
11-16-2012, 03:37 AM
I don't know what you are saying, that's what I've been asking the whole time.
My first reply to you was "make a point"

Now for example, you are saying if people could just buy the stf sets - and didn't have to grind them out on stf, they wouldn't play stf.

Well what's going to happen in 2 months then ? The whole server leaves stf then according to you.

Most of the stuff you say is incoherent and self-contradictory to me like that.

Let me ask you this, did selling lockbox ships for cash prevent people from grinding their way to them in the past ?
What about c-store items, did everyone suddenly stop earning dilithium and buy everything for cash ?

You are really arguing my point based on a false argument, I don't know if you can top yourself and pull a tripple in your next reply
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 347
# 35
11-16-2012, 03:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by neoakiraii View Post
Yeah lets put the gear on the C store...yeah pretty sure STFs would drop and people would buy the sets and not bother doing the mission.

When did I say I don't want gear? 5 of my characters has Mark 12, and now more of my Alts will. What i don't want is random drops of guessing games of when will I get my tech drop, and now its gone and I am Happy!!! Soo happy I feel like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBTRp80Q64U
That's basically what they did, and added a time-gate to it. Ya KNOW people are gonna pay cash for the dilithium to craft the sets at the end.

Now, as far as the system goes.. its. well. OK.. but.. thats it just OK.

1) The cooldowns on the missions of 40 hrs is a little silly, especially at tier 1
2) Ground and Space gear should have been split up, with the new system, you don't have
to do a singe ground elite. ever.
-Borg Neuroprocessors should have been a ground-only elite drop, and transferrable to the new system for ground elite "premium" set gear (MACO/OMEGA/Adapted), or like, a few of them for NON-set ground gear (like what we used to turn salvage in for in the past.. mk x/xi/xii items with the BORG proc)

-Proto salvage should have been repurposed to be a space-only elite drop, and transferrable to the new system for space elite "premium" set gear(MACO/OMEGA/Adapted), or redeemable as stated above, for non-set space gear (.. mk x/xi/xii with the BORG proc)

To both of the above, obviously the mk x/xi/xii set and non-set gear stores being unlockable as they are now at various tiers.

This I think should have been a necessary compromise, simply because now ground STFs are going to be more deserted than they were before (it was tough to get a ground match going sometimes even in EliteSTF). If it WAS done this way, it would mean those truly dedicated to getting the ground gear, would have to play the ground missions. As it stands I think it's been dumbed down a little TOO much to allow anybody to get the best gear in the game, simply by paying up dil for it and a little bit of time every day. Which by proxy, means it was made more available so more people would sucker into buying Zen, as oppose to reserving the defineably best gear in the game to those that want to go through the rigamarole of earning it by doing the ground assignments.

Last edited by fiberteksyfir; 11-16-2012 at 03:44 AM.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 71
# 36
11-16-2012, 03:52 AM
How anyone can defend this personal starbase crap is beyond me.

Its all very well saying that you are guranteed the mk 12 stuff in the end. But its how you get to that stage. It is BORING and it is tedious having to grind STF's just to plough the "rewards" from them into a stupid time gate just to be "rewarded" the ability to "buy" the real reward that you wanted in the first place. And how do you buy your real reward? Either grind yet more dilithium or cough up some real cash.

It is not fun at all, it is time wasting and its too darn expensive.

My solution? Increase the drop rate for the prototypes.
Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 262
# 37
11-16-2012, 04:03 AM
i, too, miss the old system. i probably wouldn't have such a large bone to pick with the rep system if they didn't have the 40 hour project timer. whoever decided to implement that deserves to be shot.

Last edited by xsharpex; 11-16-2012 at 04:09 AM.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 45
# 38
11-16-2012, 02:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vestereng View Post
I don't know what you are saying, that's what I've been asking the whole time.
My first reply to you was "make a point"

Now for example, you are saying if people could just buy the stf sets - and didn't have to grind them out on stf, they wouldn't play stf.

Well what's going to happen in 2 months then ? The whole server leaves stf then according to you.

Most of the stuff you say is incoherent and self-contradictory to me like that.

Let me ask you this, did selling lockbox ships for cash prevent people from grinding their way to them in the past ?
What about c-store items, did everyone suddenly stop earning dilithium and buy everything for cash ?

You are really arguing my point based on a false argument, I don't know if you can top yourself and pull a tripple in your next reply
My point is.. I like many others I know, feel that offering a measly 1 point of rep per STF mssion is too low vs the need to reach 32500 to open your conversion Omega Box or 100,000 to be able to reach Tier 5.

If the total rep for obtaining 5 Nural Processors was say 500 or even just 250 Rep, it would be far more encouraging for people too WANT to play. People who WANT to play also end up wanting to PAY... its a core business decision that makes money.

I have never said anything about lockbox's or C-store items. Nor have I said anything about the costs of whatever rewards you will be able to purchase at various tiers because I either see no problem with it (at this time)..

My argument, is based purely on what I have experienced and encountered. Fleet Members who have all decided to cancel their subscriptions and play alternative games instead of STO based solely on this new system, with the mentality being, Its not worth it.

As for the time it takes, well in simple terms... My 1st countdown timers will complete sometime around lunchtime tommorrow. It would be fine if I am here to watch them hit 0 and award me my earned Rep.. I have stockpiled enough goods and amassed over 1000 marks so re-starting them no probs. But nope, like most people I will be at work. So I can add another 6-8 hours on top of this (assuming I "rush home to play STO"). A problem that will just be repeated in a few days.

So a 40 hour wait will be more like a 4-5 day wait... That is what it comes down too.

I do consider myself a die hard and semi serious sto player. and will play on occassions up to 12 hours straight (doing nothing but STF's). It would be better to increase the 5 rep reward to reward that dedication and commitment rather than make it pointless and meaningless. It is because of these sessions, why I subscribe... and why I considered a lifetime subscription. But this new system, I wont bother. Just log in once every two days, start a timer and log out... Thats where I see this issue leading.
Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,093
# 39
11-16-2012, 03:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by intrepiduk View Post
How anyone can defend this personal starbase crap is beyond me.

Its all very well saying that you are guranteed the mk 12 stuff in the end. But its how you get to that stage. It is BORING and it is tedious having to grind STF's just to plough the "rewards" from them into a stupid time gate just to be "rewarded" the ability to "buy" the real reward that you wanted in the first place. And how do you buy your real reward? Either grind yet more dilithium or cough up some real cash.

It is not fun at all, it is time wasting and its too darn expensive.

My solution? Increase the drop rate for the prototypes.
compared to grinding them before....but not having a time limit and you could be there till the end of time.


Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,203
# 40
11-16-2012, 03:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by azurianstar View Post
Yeah, I still have to roll my eyes at the new system in how it supposed to "help" players get their Mk12 sets.

This system supposed to help those who been working hard (literally) for months and never got any Prototype Tech Drops, but when they are finally about to get them, they change the system where now they have to work again in unlocking Tier 5 Reputation, camping BNPs, and paying 34,000 Dilithium PER set piece.

IMHO, what PW did was more like kicking a person when they are down then helping them. Because there was a ton of other ways Cryptic could've helped those people out like trading # of Rares for Prototype or having accolades have a hand in making it easier.

Really, I'm starting to doubt they really understand things. And that will lead to the end of STO.
Look on the bright side, just about the time we learn this new system S8 will be here with a new system. I'm just hoping they'll grab my omega and rommie marks and convert them to something I will actually use.
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