Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,510
Some time ago I posted a thread with a suggestion of introducing a new federation hangar pet that would be able to deploy mines as a primary feature. Now, after flying Vesta a little bit, comparing it to Kar'Fi where possible, I honestly think Federation fighters are kind of lacking.

I mean, even though they do seem to serve specific roles, in the end they all seem almost the same. My biggest issue with Vesta (with bugged/nerfed hangar cooldown) is that its fighters seem to die from enemy explosions exteremely quickly and there's no good way to stop them or make them run away fast enough - especially Peregrines, which need to fly straight at the enemy to fire their cannons. But it's not much better for runabouts - which should have more HP - nor for Type 10 shuttles - which die instantly even with polarize hull active. With 40 sec - 1min non-reduceable cooldown (even at max aux) it's honestly annoying.

In addition, there's no proper frigate/raider type hangar, no fast moving craft like Slavers or Interceptors, and no support crafts or drones aside from shield repair units. And with Stalkers being usable only on Atrox, there doesn't seem to be much to choose from in the end.

inb4 carriers should be KDF only and FEDs shouldn't have them at all rawrharwhwarh!!111onemeh - I'm not asking for much. Just some more variety for different strategies. I would love to see Type 10 shuttles fly a little bit faster, so they'd be more focused on outmaneuvering enemy ships and draining shields with their beams. I'd like to see some craft which is able to lay mines. Or perhaps some other type of non-combat drone, similar to KDFs Tachyon or Power Siphon drones? Anything. Right now it's either "dps" peregrines, shield repair units or one of three beam-oriented slow moving shuttles.

So, Cryptic, any chance for an update anytime soon(tm)? Perhaps players have other suggestions for hangars that wouldn't really diminish KDFs carrier superiority, yet would introduce some variety for FEDs?
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 670
# 2
11-18-2012, 09:51 AM
Well, for Frigate/Raider/Destroyer-type pets, I believe that only full-sized Carriers should be able to carry them. Vo'Quv, Kar'Fi, Atrox, and Recluse. (so far)

I personally believe that there should be another full-size Fed Carrier, of Fed design, with the Aquarius as hangar pets, similar to BoPs. Of course I don't think the USS Mary Sue should have had a working fighter hangar anyway.

As far as pets go, why not just make the Peregrines with BoP AI, so they perform attack runs rather then attempting to swarm the target like a beam pet would.

A new pet could be a Heavy Bomber type. More sturdy and slower then Peregrines but with 2x DHCs and 1 Trico with EPtS1, CRF1 and HY1. The Advanced type could pack 2x DHC, 1 Turret, 1 Trico, and a Full-size Quantum Mine Layer, X2SIF1, EPtS2, CRF1, HY2. Restrict them to 2 per Hangar.
Constant exposure to the same opinions leads to continual reinforcement of ideas until eventually, any challenge, no matter what form it takes, is going to be met with a disproportionate sense of outrage. Room for reasoned discussion can no longer occur.

Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 318
# 3
11-18-2012, 02:35 PM
new pets, you mean ones like the scorpion fighters you get int eh romulan rep. I'm gonna be using them in my let it all burn vesta build I'm planning.

Feds do need some kind of heavy hanger pet but only ships with two hangers should be able to launch them, or a dedicated single hanger pet ship(flight deck stlye ect).

Vesta's "nurfed" hanger makes sense its basically just a slightly beefed up shuttlebay of course its going to be the worst of the hangers in the game. Really the Galaxy class ships should get a hanger bay they are larger and have more hanger space than the vesta does. So devs go put the dreadnaught in a fleet suite and add a hanger to it and the current fleet galaxy.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 670
# 4
11-18-2012, 03:15 PM
You could make the argument for any semi-large ship (IE Cruiser) to have a working hangar. I mean really, LTC Engineer slot has Boarding Party. So any ship with that much Engi slot could have a working hangar, and thats a lot of ships.

Then you'd have to put hangars on other ships, like the Intrepid-class. Afterall, Voyager did give us the Delta Flyer.
Constant exposure to the same opinions leads to continual reinforcement of ideas until eventually, any challenge, no matter what form it takes, is going to be met with a disproportionate sense of outrage. Room for reasoned discussion can no longer occur.

Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,072
# 5
11-18-2012, 04:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by baelogventure View Post
You could make the argument for any semi-large ship (IE Cruiser) to have a working hangar. I mean really, LTC Engineer slot has Boarding Party. So any ship with that much Engi slot could have a working hangar, and thats a lot of ships.

Then you'd have to put hangars on other ships, like the Intrepid-class. Afterall, Voyager did give us the Delta Flyer.
Well any ship in the game can use boarding part since its a lt skill, voyager only had one delta flyer (I don't remember other shuttles since well I haven't seen voyager since the finale), and I think the exploration cruiser could use a hanger...would help make up a bit for such a horrible boff layout.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 318
# 6
11-18-2012, 05:14 PM
An intrepid hanger is pushing it. I think it was figured out that the delta flyer got out of the shuttle bay though a good application of grease and a Teflon coating. Not exactly combat launch conditions.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,273
# 7
11-18-2012, 07:20 PM
No. No more hangar pets, there's already too much pet spam and too many additional factors to compensate for as a result.

As for the other concerns. . .you feddies stole the carriers, which used to be a KDF exclusive and one of the reasons to play the faction. You then got the danubes, which for a long time were a serious cheese move (thankfully they've been nerfed). You also have the escort-carrier, which beats the hell out of the KDF one-hangar ships in terms of mobility and usefulness.

Make do with what you've got. It's what the KDF does, so I suggest you Kirks do the same.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,603
# 8
11-18-2012, 08:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelingmaster View Post
As for the other concerns. . .you feddies stole the carriers, which used to be a KDF exclusive and one of the reasons to play the faction.
About that ...

Anyone remembers about the Klingon ... oh wait, they were never shown having any kind of fighters, let alone carriers.

Federation, yes (Federation Attack Fighter)
Romulan, yes (Scorpion)

Anyone else?

Sure, there are several Voyager entries on Memory Alpha, the closest the KDF gets a fighter is Enterprise's Orion Interceptor, that is 22th Century.

Feddies "stolen" from the KDF? no ... feddies got what they should always had, fighter craft because if anything the Federation Attack Fighter is cannon, the To'Duj is not, in fact the absence of KDF smallcraft can be found on the fact the Toron IS the only shuttle we seen the Klingons use.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5,444
# 9
11-18-2012, 08:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by f2pdrakron View Post
About that ...

Anyone remembers about the Klingon ... oh wait, they were never shown having any kind of fighters, let alone carriers.

Federation, yes (Federation Attack Fighter)
Romulan, yes (Scorpion)

Anyone else?

Sure, there are several Voyager entries on Memory Alpha, the closest the KDF gets a fighter is Enterprise's Orion Interceptor, that is 22th Century.

Feddies "stolen" from the KDF? no ... feddies got what they should always had, fighter craft because if anything the Federation Attack Fighter is cannon, the To'Duj is not, in fact the absence of KDF smallcraft can be found on the fact the Toron IS the only shuttle we seen the Klingons use.
I won't deny that the KDf was never shown with a carrier, but if you wanna play the 'canon and non-canon' card, ok then...

Vesta is technically non-canon, it only ever came from a book, so then why should it be in this game?

And nobody was ever shown, Fed, KDF, or Romulan, having a full-on carrier, ever, in a canon situation. The Scimitar held wings of Scorpion fighters, true, but we don't know how much of a 'carrier' it truly was then since it never used them in the movie.

Rihannsu
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,603
# 10
11-18-2012, 08:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mimey2 View Post
I won't deny that the KDf was never shown with a carrier, but if you wanna play the 'canon and non-canon' card, ok then...
You sure?

Quote:
Vesta is technically non-canon, it only ever came from a book, so then why should it be in this game?
Its soft cannon, also it was requested and believe it or not I rather have a soft cannon late 2370's ship that a pre-TNG era ship.

And of course if we go down that route we start to go looking at the KDF shipyards were the large majority of those ships are also very soft since they were made for this game.

I only point out you cannot go up in arms about someone "stealing" that was never yours, the fact the KDF get carriers first does not mean they should forever locked out to the KDF faction ... or are you prepared to have BoPs as your side ONLY science ships?

Quote:
And nobody was ever shown, Fed, KDF, or Romulan, having a full-on carrier, ever, in a canon situation. The Scimitar held wings of Scorpion fighters, true, but we don't know how much of a 'carrier' it truly was then since it never used them in the movie.
This is the same bankrupt argument I seen used pre-Atrox to argue against Federation having any kind of carriers, you can say we never shown anyone having a full-on carrier yet the first one was the Klingon Vo'quv (even if its called a Dreadnaught) as the Federation only have the Armitage as a carrier and its not a full-on, the Vesta hangar makes its unsuitable to operate as a carrier.

Its bankrupt because those fighters existed and so must have been based somewhere, it not difficult to make a connection to some support ship-class we never seen being their base, this is speculation true but the connection can be made.
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