Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 702
# 11
11-22-2012, 02:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by artan42 View Post
A game that has front line Constitution classes.

The refit has a few details not on the the ingame one, most notably the dividing line thing on the engineering hull, and the pylons extending much further forward.

Except the refit isnt canon. The canon Post-Nemesis Sovereign (as far as we know right now) is identical to the Sovereign depicted in Nemesis... and that is the Sovereign on which I based my specs. Realistically... the Sovereigns overall dimensions (width, beam and length-wise) did not likely change, but Nemesis establishes that the Sovereign-class has 29 decks in some fashion, and those are the specs I used.

So when I say Post-Nemesis Sovereign... I dont mean the refit that John Eaves had planned if the Big-E got to fly again, I mean the Sovereign as it existed in Nemesis and after as we know it. And the one in game does appear to be the Nemesis Sovereign.
Captain
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Posts: 2,901
# 12
11-22-2012, 12:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by amayakitsune View Post
So when I say Post-Nemesis Sovereign... I dont mean the refit that John Eaves had planned if the Big-E got to fly again, I mean the Sovereign as it existed in Nemesis and after as we know it. And the one in game does appear to be the Nemesis Sovereign.
So SF reverted the Insurrection/Nemesis mod back to the First Contact hull you mean. Ah okay.

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Captain
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# 13
11-22-2012, 01:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by artan42 View Post
So SF reverted the Insurrection/Nemesis mod back to the First Contact hull you mean. Ah okay.
No... I mean John Eaves had a refit of the Enterprise planned (incase Nemesis wasnt the last TNG) movie:

http://johneaves.files.wordpress.com...nal-small1.jpg

The top 3 ortho views are the Sovereign as it was supposed to appear, had the Enterprise left spacedock at the end of Nemesis. (See EDIT)

EDIT: Sorry, the image above shows the Enterprise-E in her 'Phase One refit" as she appeared in Nemesis. There is another image that shows the Enterprise-E as she was to have appeared after Nemesis here:

http://johneaves.files.wordpress.com...al-e-small.jpg

However, since the Enterprise-E never left spacedock at the end of Nemesis, the Sovereign-class has to have the same specs as the Enterprise did in Nemesis.

You were the one who originally said that the Sovereign depicted in game was the First Contact style... but thats counter intuitive... as Starfleet (nor any military organization) would never invest time and effort into refitting a ship 2 distinct times only to not apply it to new hulls of that class going forward... nor would they ever then just decide that the refits should be reverted back to an inferior model.

Last edited by amayakitsune; 11-22-2012 at 07:43 PM.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 612
# 14
11-22-2012, 02:00 PM
Amaya, I thought that refit was the ship shown in Nemesis. The Ent-E fires way too many torpedoes from pretty much anywhere in that last TNG movie, which was prettymuch what the refit was supposed to justify. I think there's an article about it at Ex Astris Scientia.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 702
# 15
11-22-2012, 07:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by umaeko View Post
Amaya, I thought that refit was the ship shown in Nemesis. The Ent-E fires way too many torpedoes from pretty much anywhere in that last TNG movie, which was prettymuch what the refit was supposed to justify. I think there's an article about it at Ex Astris Scientia.
The Sovereign underwent small refits between movies (or would have had to, to account for the differences between the Enterprise in all 3 movies (inreality the differences between the ship in the 3 movies was likely from the switch from miniture (in First Contact) to CG model (in Insurrection) and then a change in CG studio (in Nemesis) ).

But there was a final major refit planned for the Enterprise that was planned if Nemesis hadn't been the last of the TNG movies.

You can read about the evolution of the Enterprise-E here:

http://johneaves.wordpress.com/2010/...se-ncc-1701-e/

And here is what the Enterprise would have looked like if Nemesis hadnt been the last TNG movie:

http://johneaves.wordpress.com/2012/...tec-paint-job/

(Interestingly enough, among other things that never happened with the Sovereign was the ability to separate the saucer:

http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/3640/dee7.jpg

Id love to see that.)

Last edited by amayakitsune; 11-22-2012 at 07:57 PM.
Career Officer
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# 16
11-22-2012, 08:39 PM
It does seem to me that to start one should park a default Sovereign right next to another player's default Regent. No customizations. Visualize a rough comparison. Assuming the in-game Sovereign matches canon specs, simply guess-timate any difference between the beam, height, length and width. My suspicion that they won't be off by much.

If Regent proves smaller than Sovereign? Well. Then it's smaller than Sovereign. Or visa versa as the case may be.
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Captain
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# 17
11-22-2012, 09:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by psiameese View Post
It does seem to me that to start one should park a default Sovereign right next to another player's default Regent. No customizations. Visualize a rough comparison. Assuming the in-game Sovereign matches canon specs, simply guess-timate any difference between the beam, height, length and width. My suspicion that they won't be off by much.

If Regent proves smaller than Sovereign? Well. Then it's smaller than Sovereign. Or visa versa as the case may be.
Comparing them in the ship store (or shipyard customization) does just that, only it eliminates perspective issues caused by the camera The ships in either of the two windows are in proper scale to each other (and the ship store has a faint grid in the back)

I post a link earlier on to another forum where I did just this very procedeure and guesstimated the specs. You can see it again here:

http://www.lcarsc.com/showthread.php...ll=1#post10465

I'll post my specs here as well:

"The Post-Nemesis Sovereign's specs are:


Length: 685m
Height: 87m
Beam: 240m
Decks: 29

Looking at the Regent in comparison with the Sovereign Ive come up with these specs:

Length: 670m
Height: 69m
Beam: 240m
Decks: 23"

I looked at the images I used again just now... and the Regent may actually be about 5 meters longer than the Sovereign.

Which would put revised numbers at:

Length: 690m
Height: 69m
Beam: 240m
Decks: 23

The only number I cant really be sure about is the deck number. It looks like you lose a deck or two at the top of the ship and 4 or 5 at the bottom.
Career Officer
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Posts: 6,416
# 18
11-22-2012, 10:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by amayakitsune View Post
Well... the Regent will never have 30 decks. Its shorter and flatter than the Sovereign.

The thing about the ship store window's 3d model is the camera doesnt act differently depending on which ship skin you select... meaning if you select the Sovereign and a certain zoom level and then change the skin to the Regent (or either of the others) the zoom will not change. Makes it pretty easy to scale the Regent based ont he known dimensions of the Post-Nemesis Sovereign-class.

I honestly dont know why you're bringing up your Frontier-class. It has no bearing on the Regent's scale... you ship is nearly 315 meters longer, 160 meters wider, and 15.75 meters taller. (For the record the gives your ship 34 3-meter high decks + a bit of extra dead space). The ship is much larger than the Regent and the Sovereign on which the Regent is based and is a bad reference for any scaling guesstimations.
You don't know why I'm bringing up my Frontier? Because the Regent was based off it?

And "The Regent will never have 30 decks", yet the Sovereign (with the Nemesis refit) has 29 decks. Without definitive dimensions, what you say is just guestimation. Which is why I'm asking Cryptic for the dimensions, so I have 100% accuracy.



Look, I'm actually trying to do something positive here and just want some simple dimensions. All I ask from Cryptic is just 3 sets of numbers, that's it.

Last edited by azurianstar; 11-22-2012 at 10:20 PM.
Career Officer
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Posts: 940
# 19
11-23-2012, 12:50 AM
I now realize that the best method for comparing two starship models in the game is through The Foundry. Because our camera doesn't center over just one of the models.

Although this only works if Regent is available when the Foundry comes back up.
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Captain
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# 20
11-23-2012, 03:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by psiameese View Post

Although this only works if Regent is available when the Foundry comes back up.
Yeah right, new ships in the foundry

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