Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,425
# 131
12-05-2012, 01:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sollvax View Post
.

Even writers can't fight the curve
Er. They can and do. That's what makes writing EFFORT and not simply REPORTING. And even good journalism has this tension to it.

Writing is where you take something, you establish it as improbable, and then you make it happen. How successfully you accomplish that is one measure of how well your writing gets judged.

In ST 2009, they made the original series crew winding up on their familiar places on the Enterprise improbable. Then they made it happen. And maybe didn't do the best job on every technical detail but made it emotionally believable if you turn your brain off.

Writing, narrative, storytelling... All are about taking an event or an outcome, establishing it as improbable, then doing the work to get to that improbable outcome.

A story with a probable outcome isn't a story. It's an anecdote.

For example:

- I went to the supermarket and bought peas. Not a story. There is no incident. Nothing improbable happens. Believable. No work required to convince people.

- I went to the supermarket and bought peas and a shopping cart dented my car on the way out. Story potential. Doesn't require much work. There is an incident. How improbable the chain of events are needs to be played up. Believable but little work required to convince people.

- I went to the supermarket and bought peas and aliens stole them as soon as I left the grocery store. Definitely a story. Requires a lot more work to sell because of its improbability. There is an incident. Something improbable happens. Unbelievable and requires a lot of work.

No work to tell the story = no story.

Storytelling IS the act of fighting the curve.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,593
# 132
12-05-2012, 01:18 PM
Quote:
Er. They can and do. That's what makes writing EFFORT and not simply REPORTING. And even good journalism has this tension to it.
good journalism is 100% factual DEEPLY researched and entirely dull
you can spot a Good news report
the reporter is sitting down , indoors ,infront of a WALL , he speaks plainly and without accent
he does not pretend to interview someone , He does not cut away to an idiot stood in the way of a storm or hiding behind a burning car.
He speaks only proven fact and he does not show emotion

Quote:
Writing is where you take something, you establish it as improbable, and then you make it happen. How successfully you accomplish that is one measure of how well your writing gets judged.
"you canna change the laws of physics"
and you also can't change the curve

Man climbs tree
Man falls out of tree
Man hits ground

Story

Man climbs tree
Tree explodes
Elephants rain down

Junk


Quote:
In ST 2009, they made the original series crew winding up on their familiar places on the Enterprise improbable. Then they made it happen. And maybe didn't do the best job on every technical detail but made it emotionally believable if you turn your brain off.
The USS enterprise contains a brewery
one of the consoles is a supermarket check out on its side
theres a photocopier
the computer can't recognise a russian accent

and no they do not wind up in the right places
where is nurse chapel?
Where is Janice rand
Why is spock a perv??
Why is chekov suddenly "transporter chief"
why is sulu portrayed as incompetent merely to let spock play big boy??
Why is uhura a TART?

Quote:
Writing, narrative, storytelling... All are about taking an event or an outcome, establishing it as improbable, then doing the work to get to that improbable outcome.
Actually its "the art of the possible"

Quote:
A story with a probable outcome isn't a story. It's an anecdote.

For example:

- I went to the supermarket and bought peas. Not a story. There is no incident. Nothing improbable happens. Believable. No work required to convince people.
Hmm drama
were they TINNED? Frozen? Fresh? were they on special?
did you have a coupon ??

Quote:
- I went to the supermarket and bought peas and a shopping cart dented my car on the way out. Story potential. Doesn't require much work. There is an incident. How improbable the chain of events are needs to be played up. Believable but little work required to convince people.
-

sounds like a job for a claims firm

Quote:
I went to the supermarket and bought peas and aliens stole them as soon as I left the grocery store. Definitely a story. Requires a lot more work to sell because of its improbability. There is an incident. Something improbable happens. Unbelievable and requires a lot of work.
And number one would make a good movie
Number two a reasonable episode of CSI new york
And Number three a very bad 30 second cartoon
Quote:
No work to tell the story = no story.

Storytelling IS the act of fighting the curve.
Storytelling is following the curve in an interesting way
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,553
# 133
12-05-2012, 01:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sollvax View Post
SNIP
Argue all you want about what should be what.At the end of the day, it will be in in JJ's image. That means it will make no sense, and suck.....with explosions, and lens flare.
Just bring sunglasses to the theatre, and turn off your brain.I don't do drugs, but I bet if I smoked a ton of pot, and watch Abrams Trek, I would like it.
That redshirt, Totally got vaped!!!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 108
# 134
12-05-2012, 01:24 PM
Our clones have mistakes, however there was an episode of tng, "up the long ladder" which consisted of just 5 people having servived, as clones, for over 200 years before signs of replicative fading were taking place.

Pon Farr is Vulcan "mating season," it has nothing at all to do with the planet Vulcan.
Pon farr can happen, and be resolved, anywhere.

And just because the vulcans are few in numbers, does not mean they no longer have a voice.

Last edited by allmytee; 12-05-2012 at 01:29 PM.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,593
# 135
12-05-2012, 01:30 PM
But he can't go home to his familys land
also his "betrothed" died

Clones never work out
and never will

And look at any federation of states

Does the USA give equal weight to the state of California and Silver lake Nevada??
of course it doesn't

(if anyone here lives in or near silver lake Nevada please let me know I went there once 20 years ago)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 137
# 136
12-05-2012, 01:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sollvax View Post
Gary Mitchell died before birth (his fathers life was not saved by Kirks father)

Garth likewise never lived

its complicated but due to the destruction in the first film almost no one exists from the real universe (for example there has never been a savik a sanik a Tuvok etc)

the destiny of entire planets was erased.

Kirk has no brother (destroyed before birth) thus the intergalactic parasite destroyed countless worlds.

Spocks family is dead Vulcan no longer exists there is no Babel conference and thus the Orions are much much more powerful

the Borg probably win the battle of wolf 359 (because the federation is weaker) etc

Kirk's brother was in the movie...... Where did you get the idea that Mitchell's dad was saved by Kirks? Garth was around before the Kelvin was destroyed so once again you are incorrect. Basically nothing you just posted is true.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 108
# 137
12-05-2012, 01:40 PM
A single clone from a single dna sorce can indeed work

Spocks "betrothed" in this time line is Uhura so he'll be fine, even though you did say he wasn't Vulcan.

And the vulcans will always have a voice they are a founding member of the Federation. Trying to compare Trek to real world is fail.

Now heres some more food for you nice troll
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,593
# 138
12-05-2012, 01:42 PM
Uhura is NOT his betrothed she is someone he is harrassing

Spock is Half vulcan

and JJ is the Troll not those who oppose the attrocity
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 137
# 139
12-05-2012, 01:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sollvax View Post
He died before his second son was born
he died before he met Gary mitchells DAD and saved him
He died before he met Garth (thus garth also dies)

Garth was a captain while kirk was a cadet (so not much older ) actually the actors were even closer in age

Being slain out of time changed everything

actually somehow Kirk became 20 years younger and went a bit strange as well
William Shatner was only like 3 or 4 years older than Chris Pine when he started on Star Trek and the characters went to the Academy only a few years apart.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,593
# 140
12-05-2012, 01:44 PM
Shatner was late thirties

the new boy is still in short pants

Chekov is supposed to be "like a son" to Kirk
not like an older smarter brother
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