Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 442
# 51
12-05-2012, 08:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoge00f View Post
I'm sure TRH needed a failtastic carebear who runs awful and selfish builds in their fleet.
Haha! Yeah that dude has quite an imagination lol. Maybe we invited him to our teamspeak or something in order to straighten out his build...

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Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 363
# 52
12-05-2012, 11:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoge00f View Post
I'm sure TRH needed a failtastic carebear who runs awful and selfish builds in their fleet.
We actually only invited him to play on our TS and see how it goes. He called this a fleet invite lol.

Here's proof:

Quote:
Originally Posted by paxottoman View Post
If you think you're ready to move on then do so. However, if you have the slightest chance to work things out one last time then do so.

Otherwise, Turkish RP Heroes extends its hospitality to have you play with us. If you like the way we do things, then by all means you can ASK for a fleet invite.
See? I said that. No fleet invite there for him to "turn down" lol.

Making him a popular tric bomber has made other fleets make him primary kill target... He better talk to Talon about run builds, he's gonna need it or a /logout keybind

Last edited by paxottoman; 12-05-2012 at 11:11 PM.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 151
# 53 Happy to work with you...
12-06-2012, 01:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by webdeath View Post
"Force People"? You make it sound like the fleet I belong to are bullies. Where we grumply growl and use harsh language to get our way. We simply have fleet rules, like everyone has their own set of them. One of the Fleet rules is No Universal Grief to win consoles in PVP Ques. The reasons for are also explained as to how we've run into those consoles and feel they are not necessary in order to win, and can eaisly, in the hand of a skilled 5 man team, cause harm to the value of fun during such a match.
How ever, considering the Latest Reign of Season 7, and the continue lack of interest from the Development Staff in PVP, I can't guarentee (since I'm not personally a fleet leader as far as I am aware) what the rest of the fleet does. You want that sort of information, talk with the leaders that still play Startrek Online (if any).

I personally have nothing against fleets and their own set of codes, rules or what not. It also doesn't bother me if one fleet is more strict then another. If I don't agree with their ways I won't join up with them. It's that simple. But what I do have a problem with, is seeming double talk. Where there's a claim of fair play yet only on your terms. Terms that can change on a whim from what I have witnessed. Now I could be wrong.. Which I'll get into later.



My words, dear Tripwire, don't come from a misunerstanding, but from experience of the past. I am against the Ideals of any who feels that using any and every griefable effect in STO PVP does not cause any harm. And is willing to use such grief tactics in order to ruin the fun of anyone else who trys to PVP. I have been in the Queues time and again in the past up until Season 7 where I have run into the Nova Core. And each and every time they ran the consoles that cause the most Grief: Anti-matter spread and Vent Theta Radiation in some form or fashion. In addition to that almost any other console, ship ability, or Lobi store combination they could get their hands on, despite how often the words of "This is an Overpowered, or grief causing effect, it shouldn't be used." gets placed on the forums, in Organized PVP, or any other form of media tied to the PVP in this game. Perhaps one or two individuals may have not used as much of the Griefable aspects of those items, but has been my experience that if you see Nova Core, you can expect such tactics. Same for S.O.B.

How ever, I am not an unfriendly indivudal. Despite the taunts, or other mocking words I may use in general channels during PVP matches, Ker'rat, or Organized PVP. I do enjoy Fair play and a good time in the PVP Ques. IF going to your Team speak, talking with your members, and reading your Charter could bring about some form of enlightnment, I'm sure I could be all for it. Not that I expect a friendly atmosphere towards me while being there, I'd be willing to do that since you offered. Because I have yet to have anyone in Nova Core make such an offer to me in the past.



Very well, I will mail you, how ever I do not understand how that would be me "Backing up my words." Unless there is something that you got from what I said that you feel I need to prove. Which I couldn't possibly understand what it could be. Because I haven't said that Nova Core is a group full of.. Rude, and unintelegent trolls who resort to grief tactics to win, for example.. And nor have I here in this statement as such that was an example, not me stating a fact or even an opinion, because it would be false. I'm afraid how ever I do not recall your @ handle in order to do so, so if you would be so kind as to provide it (Incase you haven't already and I've just missed it while scrolling through most of the previous responses) I will be sure to respond soon.
@u.s.s.bloodmage I look forward to hearing from you.

Let no other player discourage you from what you believe you can achieve in PvP. Though you may walk alone through looming shadows of doubt cast upon you by your enemies. Forge your heart with iron casting its shape out of only your pure will to push forward. You will not be denied eventually.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 151
# 54 fantastic.
12-06-2012, 02:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by edalgo View Post
I agree with you 100% Trip. I look forward to speaking with you on the alliance TS. I'm from 32ND Vipers.
Agreed. Lets make it so.

Let no other player discourage you from what you believe you can achieve in PvP. Though you may walk alone through looming shadows of doubt cast upon you by your enemies. Forge your heart with iron casting its shape out of only your pure will to push forward. You will not be denied eventually.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 321
# 55
12-06-2012, 07:23 AM
Intrepid and defiant are not free. At least not for me, the silver player. So its p2w from my perspective.
[10:49] [Combat (Self)] Your Proton Barrage deals 96581 (43411) Proton(Critical) to Seto.
Poor soul didnt have time to log out.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 741
# 56
12-06-2012, 08:24 AM
This post is a little dumb, his argument for defend the use of the p2w consoles is ridiculous, ur made your reputation, now deal with it, or if u want to "clean" your name, start to play like a man, good pvp'ers don't use that crap.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ivantomdisplay View Post
Intrepid and defiant are not free. At least not for me, the silver player. So its p2w from my perspective.
Then ur perpective is limited. End-game ships area aviable via zen (or buy zen with dilithium, or buy the ship/modules in exchange that someone payed with zen), with that "perspective" the entire game is P2W, so go to fly a free tier3-4 ship...

The point here is that a console can break the game balance and ruin players experience, a ship don't. A little more of hull or a slighty better boff layout, or a little more of turn rate won't harm the game as a theta vent or a graviton pulse do. I prefer have a game vs 5 jem'hadar that vs 5 graviton pulse, u can slow down/disable/debuff a jem'hadar an remove that turn rate advantage that they have over other escorts, but there is nothing u can do against a team spamming theta vent, o using graviton pulse with maxed decompiler.
John Sheridan@playhard88 - FED Tactical
Vin Naftero@playhard88 - FED Sciencie
K'tan@playhard88 - KDF Tactical
Argento@playhard88 - RRF Tactical (FED)
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,745
# 57
12-06-2012, 08:32 AM
I wouldn't put Theta on the same level as Grav pulse.

HE can easily deal with Theta. Grav pulse is a little more annoying since not all builds slot Eng Team.


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Captain
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 663
# 58
12-06-2012, 08:54 AM
I`ll crosspost from another thread what i had to say about p2w:

Gah, ive learned alot in the past days regarding anything which has to do with payed consoles, and have come to one easy conclusion. P2W is the same as ones morality.
Player A finds X console to be OP, while Player B finds X console to be oki, but not console Y. On the other hand Player A finds console Y to be perfectly legit, and thinks Player B is stupit for beliving Y console is OP. And hence the forum pvp starts.


So comes the questions: Who is more correct? Who has the last say?

In essence none. No one is more correct or wrong than the other. Its hard to say which console is OP and which is not. Certainly there are some obvious ones which can be deemed OP by the majority, but how will that stop the minority from using it? Nothing, since we cannot enforce said "ban" properly without fighting among ourselves. And that to say is counterproductive. Heck there are even non-purchasable consoles/mods which all can aquire when you start the game, which is FAR more OP then the ones you pay for (read; Tric mines combined with DPB2/3). How will one grade them by OPness?

I myself have always been a proponent for everyone to use whatever they please, no matter how cheesey cause it helps them win. Why on earth other players wants to enforce SUBJECTIVE rules and regulations is beyond me, since said rules are hampering growth, tinkering with new strategies and tactics as well as creating an athmosphere there the old vets are always the "correct" ones. Maybe it too can be because other players doesnt know how to overcome said problem and hence invent rules to deal with them, hell I dont know. Now how arrogant is that? Who are we to enforce rules on players? Sure ive made complaints on certain payed consoles, but I overcome and adapt. I too know perfectly well that players who use cheese stuff is only capable of doing that to win, so that just tells me how crappy they are. Once we overcome that cheese the victory is just SO much sweeter, cause said cheese player(s) will have a hard time developing something new.

But in light of my last mess I will still be diplomatic and try to work out some deal with the rest of the community, so everyones wishes and concerns are brought to the table. Which console can we in consensus agree upon is a tad OP, and which is not. After we can try to enforce them socially and as respectful human beings as good as we can.


Yes, my 2 cents on the issue.
Co-founder of The Spanish Inquisition TSI - Cause no one expects it!

PaxOttomana: gawd mirror event is like fighting a tsi premade, they keep comin and comin!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 151
# 59 Such Anger....
12-06-2012, 09:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by playhard88 View Post
This post is a little dumb, his argument for defend the use of the p2w consoles is ridiculous, ur made your reputation, now deal with it, or if u want to "clean" your name, start to play like a man, good pvp'ers don't use that crap.

Ahh. Another belligerent response. I am not defending p2w consoles. I am saying that players regardless of what fleet they are from or how good they are have no control over what other players choose to equip or refrain from equipping on their starship. Fleet leaders can work honestly and sincerely to create a culture of what is in good taste and what is not. But this is a game. Our members are not on our payroll. And we cannot force the way you decide to play on to them. Also you assume everytime a Nova Core team runs into the queue we have each ship stacked 5 high with the same console. But that simply is not true. At one point a decision was made to run AMS to counter all the other AMS from everyone else running it. This is where the trouble started. I cannot change that. All I can do is ensure that moving forward things are done in the best possible way to perform exceptionally in combat while still leaving room for fun gameplay on both sides of the battlefield.


Then ur perpective is limited. End-game ships area aviable via zen (or buy zen with dilithium, or buy the ship/modules in exchange that someone payed with zen), with that "perspective" the entire game is P2W, so go to fly a free tier3-4 ship...

His perspective is fine. Your perspective only has one point of view. In your eyes everyone else is wrong. But that is simply not true. Everyone is pay to win. You either pay in time or grinding "tokens" and in the end still are required to purchase a product either with dilithium or cash.

The point here is that a console can break the game balance and ruin players experience, a ship don't. A little more of hull or a slighty better boff layout, or a little more of turn rate won't harm the game as a theta vent or a graviton pulse do. I prefer have a game vs 5 jem'hadar that vs 5 graviton pulse, u can slow down/disable/debuff a jem'hadar an remove that turn rate advantage that they have over other escorts, but there is nothing u can do against a team spamming theta vent, o using graviton pulse with maxed decompiler.

You are correct. A console can break game balance. A ship can break game balance. Players only equip and fly the ships provided. This is not a player issue. This is a design issue. So you want to bash players and fleets for using what has been intentionally designed because you don't like the fact that it's out of line of how the games mechanics should actually work according to who? You? me? us? everyone? You have no control over that. You can't blame another player for that? You can't dictacte to that player that they spent their money on the wrong console or tell them to dock their ship until its fair to fly it. But Cryptic can. And until they do the jungle will be the jungle... There is a council of fleets that are meeting tommorow to discuss what larger well known fleets and premade teams can do to alleviate the problem. But I assure you the best we can do is create atmosphere. We can create a culture within this "council" that will adhere to standards. But this council still will not control the fleets and players in the public queue who don't adhere to or are not of aware of such culture. We can try and educate them on why it is beneficial but if they refuse? What would you do? Bash them? Berate them? Tell them they are less than you? Players don't have power over the public queue. Get it through your head.
Again your assumption is that whatever fleet team you come across in question is knowingly stacking whatever consoles 5 high everytime you see them on the other side of a match. This is a perfect example of why in fact it is your logic that is at fault. Has it ever occured to you that in fact a fleet team may only have one or two of the said "cheese" consoles in question? Then what? What if they use one or two of those consoles with extreme effectiveness? Are they still a bunch of mindless spammers? Or is there more at work here? You act like these consoles are press one button and the other players respawn. It doesn't work like that. Even the cheesiest consoles still require a setup and an execution at the right time on the right target. Some fleets do this better than others both with and without whatever console is in question.

Again, I am not defending consoles, skills, ships, weapons, or whatever is clearly overpowered or not working as we the player would believe is intended. What I am saying however is that neither you nor anyone else on this forum or in this or any other game can regulate the use of such things in a public queue system. Private queues and tournaments are completely different. And for that very reason support the enforcement of strict regulation of whatever kind for the purpose of the match or in game event.

Let no other player discourage you from what you believe you can achieve in PvP. Though you may walk alone through looming shadows of doubt cast upon you by your enemies. Forge your heart with iron casting its shape out of only your pure will to push forward. You will not be denied eventually.

Last edited by tripwire690; 12-06-2012 at 09:19 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,395
# 60
12-06-2012, 09:16 AM
Dropping the phrase "Pay2Win" would help a lot. It doesn't really describe the phenomenon that people mean when they say it any more. (STO is heavily monetized, but many of the worst culprits are "free" and many expensive items are middling clunkers... Gal-X anyone)

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