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Ensign
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 18
# 21
12-05-2012, 07:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelingmaster View Post
Also, on the 360 degree maneuverability: Even if the starships in Star Trek didn't appear to obey some principle of gravity, we still wouldn't have that sort of maneuvering in this game. . .and for two good reasons. One, the game engine isn't designed for that. Two, human beings aren't designed for that. Do people have any idea how disorienting 360 degree combat mechanics would be through a 2D screen of limited capabilities?
Not that bad, actually. Ever played Decent? I would love six degrees of freedom space combat, in this game.
Ensign
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 23
# 22
12-05-2012, 07:35 AM
I've read the above posts but I am not in total agreement. And isn't that what Star Trek really was getting at?

I always get the impression there are many stories in the ST Universe (role playing in the game allows for this). TOS was one story about one Exploration Ship on a five year mission. But that doesn't mean it had to be a rigid template for the story of every ship and crew in every sector of space. TOS was flavored with conflict with Roms and Klingons and awkward first contacts.

Star Trek's story was never about machines, hardware etc like the clueless Studio Corporate Execs thought it should have been. It was character driven, tackling issues that normally would not get aired on TV, but Sci Fiction allowed social commentary to be explored, to question our prejudices, our hates. To debate where is the balance of individualism vs collectivism. "Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations"

The crew showed us the Stodgy rules of Star Fleet could be bent as we considered the context of every new encounter in a grand, diverse universe. As the crew grew and developed, we did likewise as our perspectives broadened.

The options in the game for role playing are still developing, as they do for any game. The best thing people can do is express what story they want to explore with their toons and Bridge Crew and communicate that to the developers. Some times a development will be a hit like TOS or ST:TWoK, or it could be a dud like ST V:The Final Frontier.

Exuberant joy and incredible disappointment both have been a part of ST over 6 decades, but one thing remains constant: Hope that things will get better.

Last edited by nalberta; 12-05-2012 at 07:48 AM.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,502
# 23
12-05-2012, 07:41 AM
I've been thinking about this and kinda agree.

Even cannon based ships never seemed to spam cannon fire like most people do, in their little zippy escorts.

Too late to revamp it so completely, but i wouldn't have tied the damage numbers to a gazillion weapon ports on any given ship and give the most untreklike weapon (DHC) the biggest punch.
Spike damage should be in Torpedos and energy weapons type should be purely visual with stats defined by weapon components.
Commander
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 405
# 24
12-07-2012, 03:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by innuwarrior View Post
The only problem I have with space combat is thats its not full 360 degree motion.
Exactly. With all motion bound to the horizontal axis, this is more like air combat! Take Escorts for example. They should be able to roll over their own axis as they fly forward. The Defiant was able to do that?!?!

Another problem is the angle. A lot of PvP Space Battles are located in some higher regions on the map. Why should it be necessary for a Spaceship to fly up in circles like in a parking deck, to get up there.
Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 394
# 25
12-07-2012, 03:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelingmaster View Post
Also, on the 360 degree maneuverability: Even if the starships in Star Trek didn't appear to obey some principle of gravity, we still wouldn't have that sort of maneuvering in this game. . .and for two good reasons. One, the game engine isn't designed for that. Two, human beings aren't designed for that. Do people have any idea how disorienting 360 degree combat mechanics would be through a 2D screen of limited capabilities?
Umm, with a bit of practise, it's not difficult at all?

How many space combat games are there out there that do allow free 360 degree movement? How many of those space combat games keep being mentioned among gamer's top lists of games? Hell, TIE Fighter is still considered by IGN and other places to be one of the world's greatest games, and that is almost 20 years old.

Also, as far as the principles of gravity go on Star Trek... What principles of gravity? All of their ships have inertial dampeners and artificial gravity, so maneuvering really shouldn't be a problem, no matter what axis its on.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,050
# 26
12-07-2012, 06:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelingmaster View Post
Also, on the 360 degree maneuverability: Even if the starships in Star Trek didn't appear to obey some principle of gravity, we still wouldn't have that sort of maneuvering in this game. . .and for two good reasons. One, the game engine isn't designed for that. Two, human beings aren't designed for that. Do people have any idea how disorienting 360 degree combat mechanics would be through a 2D screen of limited capabilities?
The engine is not designed for that.
For some reason this horrendous nonsense keeps being brought up time and again.
It is not possible to design a 3-d engine the does not allow 3-d movement.
Besides this is the same engine as in Champions online.
Champions online HAS complete 3-d movement so claiming the engine does not allow it make no sense at all.

*EDIT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBEvD5c2tU4

you can fly and do backflips (look at 5mins in).*

Last edited by misterde3; 12-07-2012 at 06:18 AM.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 157
# 27
12-07-2012, 07:53 AM
I was barking up the "fewer NPCs with player parity instead of repetitive sequences of cannon fodder" tree for 2.5 years (starting about middle of CB). It's a lost cause.
SQUIRREL!
-----------------------------------------
Quote:
Originally Posted by dstahl View Post
Sarcastic Venom Award!!!!
Bitter old mollusc since before the forum change.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,248
# 28
12-07-2012, 10:04 PM
360 Space: Honestly to me trek didn't really seem to emphasis the 3d nature of space all that much. Even in the big dominion war battles all the ships just formed into 'lines' and shoot one another, even the weapon systems are designed with that in mind for the most part. So no I think the current engine works well enough for a star trek feel albeit at the cost of a flight sim feel.

Pacing: I'd have to say the pacing felt perfect between levels 20 and 30, even up to 40 for the most part. At those levels your shields didn't fall to a single shot without three abilities active and you had to ration your abilities instead of simply spamming them. In addition you had the time to change your shield facings and reinforce them in combat instead of relying or nearly requiring tac team like you do at end game. I blame poor scaling in how much your ability to increase your resistances and heal increasing dramatically while your overall total shield and hull amounts don't really go up by much. All just IMHO.
Commander
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 405
# 29
12-08-2012, 03:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bareel View Post
360 Space: Honestly to me trek didn't really seem to emphasis the 3d nature of space all that much. Even in the big dominion war battles all the ships just formed into 'lines' and shoot one another, even the weapon systems are designed with that in mind for the most part. So no I think the current engine works well enough for a star trek feel albeit at the cost of a flight sim feel.
There were small crafts in ST using all the bandwith of 3-dimensional space. Additionally it was shown that the Defiant can roll-over.

BoP as well, used a more steep argument a couple of times, than it is possible in STO.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 126
# 30
12-08-2012, 07:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by misterde3 View Post
you can fly and do backflips (look at 5mins in).*
You can do them in STO too, well 360 flip's in the air at least, not quite flying.

http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/a...6-23-54-13.jpg

Yes, I'm aware that the image has an unfortunate angle but the animation's quite fast and it's hard to get an upside down character shot. I'll try it with trouser's next time.
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