Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,680
# 11
12-10-2012, 10:41 PM
All coordinates given with /loc.
I have this bug on facility 4028 (the prison from the Cardassian chapter). I've set up a fight between targs and feds. Near the end of the fight, the mobs start vanishing, spawning back in the center of the map. They spawn at -75/0/50. Some of them try to reset (I can see the teleporter animation), but are warped back. I also added a lot of invisible walls, because targs used to jump one on top of another (it was not intended, and no, they didn't make babies that way) and jump over the wall, even the tall walls. I added several invisible walls, so even if they skip one, they can't reach the player and reset back. Dunno if it's related.
My BOFF fall to this location for no reasons.
All of them spawn half buried in the ground, one on top of another. Ever seen a pile of targs ? Because I did. And no babies again.

Also, I have some mobs getting warped away from their spawn, into a wall. They should spawn on 50/-40/-20, and spawn around 95/0/-51 (13m away from me, inside a wall)

Those bugs are new, the map was working before New Romulus, I was just correcting the typos and grammar before publishing.

I don't know if it's happening only on preview mode or also when published, and this is annoying.

Last edited by erei1; 12-11-2012 at 09:45 AM. Reason: coordinates.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,786
# 12
12-10-2012, 11:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zer0niusrex View Post
This is not new, and it is not a bug. There is no pathing information for any map before it is published. The pathing information is created as part of the publishing process.
This has nothing to do with pathing. I am familiar with how that works but this is entirely different. You can even tell as soon as you spawn an away team in the foundry that there is something seriously wrong and as well when you try to add NPC groups they vanish once you get around 150 meters from them. As a suggestion I would *suggest* that someone at Cryptic recreate this which its not hard I came across it very easily and then let us know if you still think this is the old bug because I can guarantee you this is not what you think it is.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 792
# 13
12-11-2012, 07:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zer0niusrex View Post
This is not new, and it is not a bug. There is no pathing information for any map before it is published. The pathing information is created as part of the publishing process.
With due respect, in all the developing I have done for missions I have seen my away team fall off a map but have never seen them fly hundreds of meters into the air and then slam into the ground. We all know you will find holes in maps every once in a while and report them when we do find them, but I have not seen this before. Regardless of where I have the spawn point I move with my away team in any direction and up they go.

Thanks for looking into this.
Brian
If you would like a detailed review of your mission please visit my forum posting "In depth mission reports upon request" for details. Also see Evil 70th's list of missions at "Evil 70th's Missions".
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,053
# 14
12-11-2012, 05:29 PM
Every time I preview a ground map that I'm working on, as soon as I start walking around, my away team disappears (fading away before my eyes). It's not that they get stuck and are too far away from me. They are less than 5 feet away from me as I watch them each fade to nothing until my toon is left alone on the ground map.

This doesn't seem to be map specific and it's happening on both exterior and interior Cryptic made sets.

Here is what it looks like:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsIvE...ature=youtu.be

Steps to replicate.

1. Preview a ground or interior, walk around, and watch boffs fade to nothing.

This is new, and it means that we can't test combat on ground maps prior to publishing the maps, since we have no boffs.

Last edited by kirksplat; 12-11-2012 at 06:16 PM.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 13,089
# 15
12-11-2012, 07:07 PM
I noticed that earlier and did some testing:
Quote:
Originally Posted by markhawkman View Post
I did some more testing and made pictures.

My new testing confirms my earlier hypothesis. My Boffs WERE getting relocated to the zero point on the map.(the location of 0/0/0 coordinates)

For some reason on ground exterior maps the zero point is (at least sometimes) outside the actual map.

before

Here we have a tiny wall that barely protrudes above ground.

after

But my boffs "trip" on it and warp to the zero point. Yeah, I can see the location of my boffs on the mini map. I've had this happen in at least one other exterior ground map and it was the same location then too.

Prior to season 7, this same scenario would cause my boffs to stop moving and stand there like idiots.
This seems to happen for ANY reason the Boffs would need to path around something. In the pictures I used a tiny wall that is so low you can WALK over it. (IIRC) when they reach it they warp to the zero point.... Why? The expected behavior is for them to path around it by jumping.

I have seen this in some situations where there was no objects visible that they were trying to path around. But... those were situations involving submerged objects. They were moving over something I recessed into the ground.

But.... I can't say for certain that I have a complete list of causes for this behavior. I've seen some other really flaky stuff. The map I'm using for Zelatta ground has really screwball map spawn behavior. apparently the game is trying to spawn me 20 feet under ground..... then relocates me to the actual spawn point.... My Boffs sometimes blink out on this map immediately after spawning. I've also seen them spawn dead..... that was REALLY weird.... they started in a KOed state, but at the normal spawn location.

Does your example have any objects that are currently invisible but set to appear later? Redshirt#2 looked like he was trying to run around something while disappearing. Didn't see #1, #3 and #4 appeared to disappear while bumping into the doorjamb.
HAIL HYDRA!

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
I can haz joystick!
MMOs aren't charities. Corporations are supposed to make a profit. It's what they do.

Last edited by markhawkman; 12-11-2012 at 07:13 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 844
# 16
12-11-2012, 07:19 PM
This is the same bug that's happening in space, except on the ground. Whenever NPCs need to use (nonexistent) pathing data in preview they just warp to 0,0,0 wherever that happens to be. Before they used to just make do without it and get stuck, which was better than completely disappearing.

Basically it seems like warping to 0,0,0 has been added as some sort of failsafe when the pathing fails, which it does all the time in preview.


Click here for my Foundry tutorial on Creating A Custom Interior Map.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,053
# 17
12-11-2012, 07:35 PM
I've been testing this on maps, and nearly every interior that I've tested is bugged. Your boffs quickly disappear, sometimes forever, and other times they relocate to a spot in the black of the map.

They just vanish, which means that we cannot test combat. If I knew more about the tech, I'd say for certain that there is some kind of bug that is spreading and getting worse. The exteriors, so far, seem better than the interiors, but most of the interior.s.. the boffs are just ghosts. They vanish, seemingly at random.

Sometimes they respawn briefly somewhere else but most of the time they seem to die, leaving you friendless.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,053
# 18
12-11-2012, 07:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by markhawkman View Post
apparently the game is trying to spawn me 20 feet under ground..... then relocates me to the actual spawn point.... My Boffs sometimes blink out on this map immediately after spawning. I've also seen them spawn dead..... that was REALLY weird.... they started in a KOed state, but at the normal spawn location.

This is also happening to me, on non-customized Cryptic maps. You never know what you're going to get when you hit the "Reset Map." I've seen npcs spawn as corpses. Or they don't spawn at all, or they finally spawn and then instantly become ghosts.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,053
# 19
12-11-2012, 07:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by nagorak View Post
This is the same bug that's happening in space, except on the ground. Whenever NPCs need to use (nonexistent) pathing data in preview they just warp to 0,0,0 wherever that happens to be. Before they used to just make do without it and get stuck, which was better than completely disappearing.

Basically it seems like warping to 0,0,0 has been added as some sort of failsafe when the pathing fails, which it does all the time in preview.
If this is the sign of a pathing fail, then it must fail every 3 seconds in the Foundry preview. I think your theory is wise.

I'm just not sure how I will make missions with that fail safe in preview. Basically, I'll have to use the preview to build sets and then each mission will have weeks of "Yes, this is published, but DO NOT PLAY! Testing in progress."

Meh... it's not like we can actually test combat anyway. But, it will be incredibly frustrating for new authors who have no idea how scaling and mobs work.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 13,089
# 20
12-11-2012, 08:00 PM
Oh I know what you mean there... less than a minute after starting a map my Boffs are gone....
HAIL HYDRA!

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
I can haz joystick!
MMOs aren't charities. Corporations are supposed to make a profit. It's what they do.
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