Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 298
# 121
12-11-2012, 05:49 PM
I think Cruisers are underpowered in the following ways:
  1. Turn rate is abysmal
  2. Real DPS is too low (how can you maintain broadside when the 'scort or even sci has maneuvered away in 3 seconds)
  3. Miracle Worker isn't performing miracles since S5
  4. Engineer Capt Skills in general are one offs and not multiplicative (as Tac Cpt's are for dps, for example), in other words very little synergy with each other
  5. Give us more aggro/tanking skills; 'scorts still tank even with S7
  6. In a good PvP team we heal/support; in PvE everyone is out for themselves so it's almost impossible to be an effective healer/supporter
  7. Allow us to change BOFF officers/skills between tanking and support w/o screwing up our space skill trays.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,764
# 122
12-12-2012, 07:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by momaw View Post
The point was made that the KDF doesn't complain about their cruisers being useless. And I told you why. They turn better and they have, at minimum, +5 more power to everything. I didn't suggest anything beyond that.
They only have that +5 to everything if they use the Plasmonic leech and not every KDF player uses it all the time. Thats why I asked as the Devils Advocate.

So they DA question remains, Why buff Cruisers for an option that the KDF may not be using or may not remain KDF exclusive in the future?
Richard Hamilton (1975-2014)
goodbye good friend. We will see you in the DMZ in the sky oneday, save a shot for us.
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Posts: 6,764
# 123
12-12-2012, 07:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericphail View Post
How about giving cruisers an inherent 10 - 20 degree boost to the fire arc of beams (and MAYBE torps) meaning broadsides are on target more often and creating a small arc where DBBs and aft arrays overlap (the super broadside sweet spot).

Allows a bit more punch, reduces the pain of bad turn rate, (and offers a new concept 4DBB 4 Array sweet spot hunting)

Or tweak BO and FAW to be a bit better than they currently are.
Quote:
Originally Posted by celillarnon View Post
I like this idea. Honestly I think beams have more problems than cruisers, since nothing at all synergies with broadside firing.
Beam Arrays have a 270 degree firing arc. They overlap for the Broadside just fine.
The only limit is the fore mounted Beam arrays can not fire backwards down the ship and the aft can not fire forward if the ship is facing its target head-on.
Richard Hamilton (1975-2014)
goodbye good friend. We will see you in the DMZ in the sky oneday, save a shot for us.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,764
# 124
12-12-2012, 07:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by theonerussian762 View Post
what if cruisers were able to carry a better hull/hull repair rate? while cruisers have the most crew, it still takes a long time for a cruiser to repair especially when that crew somehow gets blown up...
This I can agree with as the large crew on Cruiser seem to die faster and regen slower than small crews on escorts. I think that mechanic should be reversed.
Richard Hamilton (1975-2014)
goodbye good friend. We will see you in the DMZ in the sky oneday, save a shot for us.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,764
# 125
12-12-2012, 07:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by momaw View Post
I actually came here to underscore this point.

Normally on my D'kora I was using 3 dual beams with FAW3 and a torpedo spread. Pretty effective. I recently read about how unbelievably abso-freakalutely amazing Auxiliary To Battery was, and I wanted to try something new on the ol' space crab so I went for 6 beam arrays in a classic broadside cruiser arrangement.

Now let's consider:
* Power level set to 100, and my actual power is at least 125
* Switch to Battle Mode, +10 additional power
* Use Emergency Power to Weapons, +22 additional power
* Use Auxiliary to Battery, +17 additional power

For those playing at home, this means my effective weapon power level should be at least 174... And this still wasn't enough power to fire off a Fire At Will 3 broadside without my power level dropping in the middle of the salvo. The only ways to use beam broadsiding at full power are to use either Nadion Inversion, or use Directed Energy Modulation with the doff that adds drain resist while DEM is active. Both of these have a stupidly long cooldown. There's batteries too I guess, and you know what? Stupidly long cooldown.

Cruisers are typified as being all about the beam broadsides, and in reality, this mode of combat has so many limitations and support prerequisites just to reach any kind of parity with cannons that it's hard to justify it.

Sounds as if the Devs have removed the overclock concept/ability that one could use to both boost damage and keep power levels high for a duration of firing an attack. If so, thats sad as it was one way a Cruiser could be competitive.
Richard Hamilton (1975-2014)
goodbye good friend. We will see you in the DMZ in the sky oneday, save a shot for us.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 617
# 126
12-12-2012, 07:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bitemepwe View Post
Sounds as if the Devs have removed the overclock concept/ability that one could use to both boost damage and keep power levels high for a duration of firing an attack. If so, thats sad as it was one way a Cruiser could be competitive.
I've heard about this a lot, but even when people were swearing by it I never saw it work. I even tried the exact builds they were touting as making it awesome (EPTW III, EPS Transfer, Nadion Inversion, and Weapons Battery all going at the same time and I was still seeing my power levels hovering at between 75-90 depending on how staggered the beams were firing).
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,764
# 127
12-12-2012, 09:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by canis36 View Post
I've heard about this a lot, but even when people were swearing by it I never saw it work. I even tried the exact builds they were touting as making it awesome (EPTW III, EPS Transfer, Nadion Inversion, and Weapons Battery all going at the same time and I was still seeing my power levels hovering at between 75-90 depending on how staggered the beams were firing).
It has worked for me in the past based off the same build ideas as you most likely found in the forums. Here is the player who I believe pioneered the research,
Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
If theres a topic you have a question on, and you don't see anything addressing it, feel free to ask about it.
I say take him on the offer and see if they have changed it.
Richard Hamilton (1975-2014)
goodbye good friend. We will see you in the DMZ in the sky oneday, save a shot for us.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 267
# 128 B A M !!!
12-14-2012, 11:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hereticknight085 View Post
Basically I am asking you guys to keep it clean, and just put your thoughts out there. Engage!
Ok..there is a big Cruiser controversy...here's the fix to make everyone happy. Some players hate the snails pace turn rate, others think all Cruisers do is heal, and others simply say Cruisers cannot deal enough DPS. Well, there's a simple, elementary, solution to make everyone happy.

Listen up Devs

For all Fed Cruisers (and their KDF counterparts), make 3 "Slide Bars" similar to the engine speed bar. Yes I'm well aware that there are different "profiles" you can set your ship to already present in the game. For Cruisers only, remove those options completely. Replace them with 3 bars. One for DPS, one for Turn Rate, and one for Healing. Based on your opponent (say a Borg cube) you would want to "jack up" your heal/DPS and wouldn't care so much about your turn. You could "borrow" from your turn rate bar to make your ship perform better. Lets say your ship is a Galor and you crank up your DPS/HEAL bars and drain the turn rate. Perhaps it decreases your turn rate to that of say,...a Galaxy Class but increases DPS significantly. Does anyone follow me on this. 3 bars, all of which can be barrowed from each other and used to increase power significantly in one of the 3 major areas (turn, heal/damage).

It's so simple an elementary school kid could figure it out. The amount of time to transfer your bars over to another area would be as fast as your hand can do so with your mouse. Your powers will still be recharging at their same spees anyway.

And this would only apply to Cruisers. If your ship turns at a snails pace of 7, maybe you can make it a 10 for the time it takes to fight your enemy at the cost of heals/DPS. If you need DPS and turning really doesn't matter, jack up your DPS bar and it will give your ship enough juice to really do some inflicting damage (but keep in mind) more DPS would reduce the effectiveness of the other 2 categories. Of course whatever Cryptic designs a ship "by default" would be the base stats of the ship but how/when a player used their 3 slide bars would be up to them. Turn faster? OK More damage to actually kill off that escort? OK Enough time to heal your hull fast enough? No problem. Give and take. Distribute and re-distribute accordingly. It's that simple. Nothing more, nothing less.

In the worlds of Emeril Lagasse...BAM! be done with it!!!!


(and hopefully this will end the darn Cruiser threads
http://media.photobucket.com/image/dofftrader/yoreantiques/DOFFtrader.gif

Last edited by paragon92518; 12-14-2012 at 11:07 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,048
# 129
12-14-2012, 11:13 AM
I'll go along with this if I retain the option to use the current version
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,553
# 130
12-14-2012, 02:29 PM
I think I feel like throwing up...
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
Tired of Wasting EC and Time trying to get Superior Romulan Operative BOffs? Here's a cheap and easy way to get them, with an almost 100% chance of success.
Why the Devs can't make PvE content harder.
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