Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,669
# 31
12-24-2012, 02:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wunjee View Post
Tor'Kaht's also a 4-module ship, which means for most people it'll cost $20.00, since Klingons don't get the benefit of a tier 5 ship they can buy to get the fleet discount.

Tor'Kaht, in the setup I proposed, would have an infinitely better BOFF layout, better consoles, better shields, better hull..

The K'Vort would be a free tier 5 ship that's only slightly better then the tier 4s, adding an aft weapon, and the Free Bortas' BOFF layout.

It'd be a free ship that was relatively fun, but wouldn't be pathfinding and wouldn't obsolete anything..
as I said, it's redundant. Making a Cruiser that looks like a BoP is even MORE redundant. One of the fundamental advantages of the KDF having so few hulls, is that there's room-you don't have to go with "Similar but looks different" the way you do with the Fed side-we actually have existing gaps that need filling in the roster, and unlike what you're asking after, my proposal doesn't cut into existing cashy-money business. The KDF don't have an equivalent even including the Fleet items. what you're asking after is as GOOD as a Tor'kaht, but won't cost what it costs if your model is followed-which cuts into the funding that might support keeping KDF material in the pipeline.

What I'm going after is a Have/don't have balance-we HAVE good cruisers already, in fact we have EXCELLENT cruisers, even on the 'free scale'. what we LACK is a Vesta-equivalent...including in that lack, all of the Fleet ships and C-store ships. Hell, we don't have a proper Tier 4 SCIENCE ship PERIOD, much less a T5 equivalent-the closest is a carrier with a turn rate of...what, 3? an atrociously designed Dreadnought??

You want to go over and just add *Yawn* another good cruiser to a lineup that is, minus one exception, ALL good-to-excellent Cruisers already.

We don't NEED a Cruiser, adding one that looks like a BoP won't address existing problems and won't, I guarantee, spur additional interest or excitement beyond "Hey, it looks like a Bop, but it's a CRUISER" , a bit like saying Innovation is defined as 'Hey, New Wallpaper!' and expecting it to drive interest and excitement.

Newsflash: it won't, because another good cruiser isn't needed. We have good cruisers, we also have one really BAD one that very likely hammered new content for the faction by not selling well enough to justify the cost of making it.

yet-another-cruiser isn't going to cut it, it's not going to address long standing issues and it's probably not going to generate the sales that would justify the investment in time, manpower and bandwidth used to create it and bring it to market.

The Market WOULD respond positively to a KDF ship with the following:

1) Good shields
2) decent hull
3)good manueverability
4) a full suite of Science ship abilities
5)Battle-Cloak.

Those five elements put together and you'll generate sales. The pattern for a Fed science ship at T4/5 is 3 weps front, 3weps back, six weapons. KDF have a chassis with 6 weapons, it's called "Bird of Prey", and the K'vort, other than the size, looks JUST LIKE ONE.

I'd suggest they wouldn't even need to give it a Universal Console power-just a BoP, slightly slower turn, but still fast, with a decent hull (30K or thereabouts) and good shields (.99 to 1.2 range) with four Sci consoles and a suite of science-ship powers would probably be POPULAR, charge 15 to 20 bucks and it'll sell, and it will play differently enough from Fed Sci ships to maintain that elusive "Factional differences"-four weps front, 2 rear, 2 item slots, done-a Vesta equivalent whose abilities aren't a copy/paste of another ship from the other side.

and a BoP-with-sci is probably a LOT less work than assigning all the different officer stations to fixed careers while maintaining some semblance of difference between ship classes. Means less work for the programmers and less work for the developers.
"when you're out of Birds of Prey, you're out of ships."
Career Officer
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 298
# 32
12-24-2012, 02:49 AM
I kind of like the idea of a zoom and boom strike cruiser.

5/3 or 6/2 on the weapon load out but average/poor agility, but with a battle cloak.

The reason is when we see them attack in Yesterday's Enterprise is a straight run in firing then an over pass.

This could give us a new attack style, no dogfighting or close combat, like the America pilots in the pacific in WW2, zoom in, shoot get the hell out again.

Any good?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 245
# 33
12-24-2012, 03:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by patrickngo View Post
Lots of stuff

You're not even listening at this point. You want a free ship that everyone's going to get after a 10 minute mission to be the solution to all that ails the KDF, and it's not going to happen. Nor should it.

It's free, it should be a toy, it shouldn't really be a ship that's taken seriously or it'll be the only thing anyone uses anymore because everyone's going to have one..
Ensign
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 18
# 34
12-24-2012, 04:15 AM
IMO K'vort would fit as a big destroyer more then an big cruiser or an sized-up raider. I know K'vort was said to be a "battlecruiser" but I don't see the use of BoP-looking cruiser other then just for looks for some peeps. Personally, would love to see 4/3 weapon slots, 4 tac/3 eng/3 sci consoles and universal boff slots so it makes a solid ship for all captains - with 30k or slightly bit more hull points and 0.9 shield modifier with a very good manuverability for it's size. This would make a good heavy destroyer or a flavor of escort I suppose. I also see in this sense an standard cloak because battle one would be slightly op. This is all of course imho.

I'll be honest and say I'd be happy to get any kind of new ship on KDF - free or otherwise at this point.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,382
# 35
12-24-2012, 04:38 AM
As much as I would love to see another KDF ship that could contend with the new fed ships shouldn't we have more story content as there is no point in getting a new ship and having nothing to do with it.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,669
# 36
12-24-2012, 10:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wunjee View Post
You're not even listening at this point. You want a free ship that everyone's going to get after a 10 minute mission to be the solution to all that ails the KDF, and it's not going to happen. Nor should it.

It's free, it should be a toy, it shouldn't really be a ship that's taken seriously or it'll be the only thing anyone uses anymore because everyone's going to have one..
and YOU are asking Cryptic to GIVE you a better cruiser than the ones you have to pay for, while complaining about the cost of the Fleet Ship modules.

this thread is all speculation anyway, for all the furor over the Dev tweets in another thread, fact is we don't have anything solid or official saying we're going to get anything at all, much less anything discussed here. We both have "Should have" lists, and "Should Be" lists. You want another BC when we already HAVE good BC's, I want something we don't have five copies of already.

I sincerely doubt either of our lists are going to be looked at seriously, but I also suspect that the 'anniversary ship' is going to be a pre-release of something they want to sell, and frankly, my idea's more likely to sell than yours, esp. if the c-store version has the traditional universal console item, but the anniversary version does not.

As for "curing all the ills" I'm afraid you have the wrong number there-a new ship isn't going to, by itself, generate twenty levels' worth of new content, add costume items, change the UI colour to whatever suits a user, add thirty or so levels of faction-specific filler between the converted Feddie missions, resolve the Fel'Khri storyline, resolve the Undine in a satisfying and intelligent way, grant decent mission content in the Tau Dewa sector that a Klingon warrior WOULD be doing at Lt. General, repair the lag at Qo'Nos, flesh out the races in the Klingon Empire, provide storyline to the Gorn rebellion (so that "Rebel Gorn" actually make sense) or insight into the Orions, or story material for the Letheans, Ferasans...

savvy me? the thread headline asks a question, I answer it based on what I think would sell AFTER the anniversary. Re-Dressed cruisers probably aren't it, but given the long-standing demand for a decent, non-carrier, KLINGON, Sci-ship type (one people will actually PLAY, as opposed to buying for the console as most often happens re: the two Gorn ships), I'm fairly sure a full-on Science-ship based on the BoP will sell. Hell, one based on a Raptor chassis would sell (probably better), but the K'Vort already LOOKS like a Bird of Prey, people already make the association, TNG episode or not, and the conversion wouldn't be as hard or un-balanced in terms of game mechanics.

The Vet reward ship was a Destroyer-but that Destroyer is pretty much everything a Raptor SHOULD have been, and isn't. Following the pattern, a K'Vort SHOULD be some kind of Sci ship/BoP, not Cruiser-because it's filling a space in the roster and there's an intent to sell a BETTER one later-meaning you shouldn't be looking at a ship equivalent to ANY of the pay-version Vor'Cha(s? Pl?), the Negh'Var, or any of the Fleet vessels out the gate, esp. in the one area the devs gave us a (small) advantage-Cruisers.

For ALL WE KNOW (for certain) the ship we're talking about won't even be available-your ten minute mission COULD end up dropping another Lock-Box you have to buy keys for, with a 1-5% chance of getting a ship-maybe.
"when you're out of Birds of Prey, you're out of ships."
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 245
# 37
12-24-2012, 02:44 PM
Quote:
and YOU are asking Cryptic to GIVE you a better cruiser than the ones you have to pay for, while complaining about the cost of the Fleet Ship modules.
Did you even see my proposal? Or are you just making stuff up now? Because the K'Vort I proposed isn't better than any tier 5 C-store ship..It'd basically be the free Bortas from the last event with a bit more maneuverability, less hull and shields a cloak and a worse console layout..
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,669
# 38
12-24-2012, 03:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wunjee View Post
Did you even see my proposal? Or are you just making stuff up now? Because the K'Vort I proposed isn't better than any tier 5 C-store ship..It'd basically be the free Bortas from the last event with a bit more maneuverability, less hull and shields a cloak and a worse console layout..
Let's see...a Dreadnought's seating arrangement and console layout, A vor'cha's manueverability and a Negh'var's hull is what I read off your proposal.

Which would be...well..? If it wasn't BETTER you would not WANT it.
"when you're out of Birds of Prey, you're out of ships."
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 245
# 39
12-24-2012, 06:57 PM
That "dreadnought" BOFF layout is one of the biggest things wrong with the free Bortas.

My proposal, since you apparently didn't read it, was..

Battlecruiser
4 fore
4 aft
10 base turning
0.15 impulse modifier
1.0-1.05 shield modifier
30,000 hull
900 crew
+10 Weapons

BOFFs:

Lt.Cmdr Uni
Lt Tac
Cmdr Eng
Ens Eng
Lt Sci

Consoles:

4 eng
1 sci
4 tac

Could alternatively do:

4 eng
2 sci
3 tac

It'd basically be a Bortas, that we got free last year, with much worse defenses, much less crew, and better maneuverability. It'd have the defensive capabilities of the tier 4 Vor'Cha, with the weapons, consoles and BOFFs of the tier 5 ships.

It'd be a stand-in battlecruiser, just like the K'Vort was supposed to be.

It's not going to have the effectiveness of the Fleet Vor'Cha/Tor'Kaht due to only being a 9 console boat, having less shields, hull and crew. It'd also lack the Flor'Kaht'Cha's +10 engine power.

It's not going to be as tanky as the Negh'Var or Bortas because it has much less hull, shields and crew, but it has better maneuverability. It also lacks the Bortas' +15 weapons power bonus.

I could also argue that the KDF has no intermediate battlecruiser.

You're either stuck with the garbage default Negh'Var, staying with a tier 4 ship, buying the terrible Bortasque, or getting a fleet ship. This could make a good, solid tier 5 ship, without replacing anything else, and without introducing capabilities that no other KDF ship can match.

Because no free ship should do that.

Quote:
Which would be...well..? If it wasn't BETTER you would not WANT it.
I'd want it because it's a neat ship that's available for a limited amount of time, for free, "celebrating" one of the best episodes of TNG.

A ship doesn't have to replace anything I've already got for me to want it..

I'd want the Ambassador even if it was nothing more then a reskin for the tier 4 Galaxy...I'd still want it..
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 103
# 40
12-24-2012, 07:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by drkfrontiers View Post
The K'Vort needs to be a the first true escort class Bird of Prey in its class

Hull: 29500
Turn Rate: 18
Impulse Modifier: 0.21
Inertia rating: 70

BOFFS:

Universal CMDR,
Universal LT CMDR,
LT. Sci,
Lt. ENG,
Universal/ TAC Ensign

Weapons: 4x fore 3x AFT

ENG: 3
SCI: 3
TAC: 4

or

ENG: 2
SCI: 3
TAC: 5

Special Ability: Battle Cloak
Bonus Power:+15 weapons power

It's time.
I WANT this so baaad
Quote:
Originally Posted by zer0niusrex:
[*]All Warbird descriptions have been updated, typoes removed, and gramer corrected.
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