Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,203
# 11
12-26-2012, 08:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zahinder View Post
Can the breen ship fit cannons?
Yes, THIS is the battlecruiser I've been waiting for. I'll be imagining it with a D7 body and might buy a bridge pack just so it has a cool interior. There's NOTHING bad about this ship !!!
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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 891
# 12
12-26-2012, 08:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by flash525 View Post
.

Sure do. It's a valid point though. If this Federation ever wanted to win another war, they'd have to rely on alien starships and help from the future. Considering how reluctant CBS are about implementation of some items, I can't see their logic (save it being hypocrisy) in allowing this.
This is a video game, and the power of individual ships in a video game in no way affects CBS or canon.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,231
# 13
12-26-2012, 08:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by xantris View Post
This is a video game, and the power of individual ships in a video game in no way affects CBS or canon.
Actually, I'd have thought it would.

Just as CBS have allowed the Constitution, but they wont allow a Fleet Constitution ~ they have decided at what 'level' the Constitution is allowed to be. If this in no way affects CBS, then Cryptic should be able to do what they want with the Constitution. It is CBS that wont allow it.

...not to rain on your parade or anything, but you've not quite thought that logic through.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,937
# 14
12-26-2012, 08:54 AM
The way things are going...

We may just see a T-5 Connine in some form by this time next year.

<shrug>
...... DaveyNY ...STO Forum Member since February - 2009
..............Star Trek Fan since Thursday Sept. 8th, 1966
There are No Longer any STO Veterans... We're Just People who have Played the Game for the last 4.5 years.
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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 238
# 15
12-26-2012, 09:07 AM
it is great ship but it is not better dps then fleet escorts they have 5 consoles while he have 4 and 5 weapon power less to ,my antiproton canons will do 100+ less dps per canon on full power lvl on breen ship then they do on my fleet defiant or fleet prometheus ,and dont forget defiant have stealth and prometheus is hard to kill as breen ship is
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,016
# 16
12-26-2012, 09:19 AM
Breen ship only has +10 weapon power. Escorts have +15. If you are specced for escorts as efficiently as possible, you may not have enough points in weapon performance to get you to +125 in the Breen ship, and you'll have to rely on some gear to get you there. Even a purple XII Plasma Distribution manifold will get you only +4 weapon power, not quite enough to make up the difference - which means you'll need 2 of them. It will be especially important to have max weapon power given the number of weapon slots it has, as the power drain will be significant if using cannons.

Most of my toons are specced and gear so that I can run a weapon power of 125/95 with extra 5 placed into shield power. With the Breen ship, I will have to run 125/100. Might be worth the trade off, but not completely sure about that.
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 339
# 17
12-26-2012, 10:46 PM
She's not a bad ship by any means. It turns about as well as an Excelsior-R. Toss an RCS console in there and it's quite nice.

I've been thinking about using the Jem Ha'daar set in it, once I get enough Dilithium together to get some decent Polaron DHC's and Turrets.

One think I'd like to suggest to Cryptic is to include the Chel Grett among the JHAS and Galor that benefit from 'Victory Is Life' bonus from the Jem Set.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,435
# 18
12-26-2012, 11:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by flash525 View Post
Actually, I'd have thought it would.

Just as CBS have allowed the Constitution, but they wont allow a Fleet Constitution ~ they have decided at what 'level' the Constitution is allowed to be. If this in no way affects CBS, then Cryptic should be able to do what they want with the Constitution. It is CBS that wont allow it.

...not to rain on your parade or anything, but you've not quite thought that logic through.
I think people overestimate CBS as "Keepers of the Faith" and underestimate CBS as "Keepers of the Licensing Machine."

While the chronology issue is a partial rationale... and I recall hearing that they weren't necessarily happy with how common lockbox ships were... And had cold feet about a Connie at all.

I'd urge people to consider this from another perspective.

Cryptic is, from CBS' perspective, the "post-TNG online Star Trek game."

As long as Cryptic sticks to that, CBS is more free to license OTHER online Star Trek games.

I think that was part of the rationale behind them also licensing Infinite Space. This is the post-TNG game. That is the DS9 game.

They're fine with homages to anything within the Star Trek brand here, a position that Decipher more or less pushed them and Paramount to as a licensee. (Decipher argued... in negotiations that I believe required lawyers on both sides... that "Trials on Tribble-ations" meant things like a TOS Connie were included with a DS9 license without having to acquire a TOS license. Paramount ultimately relented but insisted that the presence be minimal and restricted to what was seen in "Trials and Tribbleations." Effectively, a DS9 licensee could use Kirk but only as that guy Sisko met and talked about a few times.)

A T5 Connie would cut into potential additional revenue from a TOS online game which could be licensed to another studio. An original Breen design would cut into prospects for another game licensee much less.

The less it cuts in, the more tolerable it is. From that point, what becomes important is that it has a story rationale of SOME kind, to reinforce the value of the IP's lore and avoid confusion in branding. (Ie. CBS probably doesn't care so much that player Starfleet Captains have a Breen ship so much as that it's clearly identified as a non-Starfleet ship, which makes things like toy branding easier, by maintaining design standards that reinforce product labeling. They want consumers to recognize it as a ship which is not a standard Starfleet ship and which has Breen origins.)
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 867
# 19
12-27-2012, 12:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by flash525 View Post
Sure do. It's a valid point though. If this Federation ever wanted to win another war, they'd have to rely on alien starships and help from the future. Considering how reluctant CBS are about implementation of some items, I can't see their logic (save it being hypocrisy) in allowing this.
Here is my hypothesis. I freely admit I have no actual evidence to back it up, so take it for what it is worth.
Once upon a time there was a company named Cryptic that got the license to rush a MMO based upon Star Trek into a commercial product. They hired a bunch of game devlopers, many who were die hard Star Trek nerds. The die hard Star Trek nerds at Cryptic worked with the die hard Star Trek nerds at CBS (keepers of the canon if you wish) to develop this into a product that "made sense" to trekkies.

Then one day Cryptic was bought by this gaming company from China. They wanted to figure out how to make this game as profitable as possible, so they adopted a model that worked well in the East, a real money lottery for rare in-game items. Cryptic talked to CBS and they both agreed that a few Jem'Hadar ships would not hurt canon, after All Sisko flew one.

Cryptic did not tell people that the odds were less than 1%. They did not tell players that the average cost of the ship was nearly $150. They did not tell players that on the order of 1 out of every 100 players could spend nearly $1000 and not win the lottery, because PWE had been running these lotteries in the East, and they knew better.

The vast majority of players who logged on bought at least a few lottery tickets. Some spent over a thousand dollars in vain trying to aquire the ship. Some paid hundreds of dollars on paypal to trade with players who had won them. Cryptic probably made more money in that one month that it had in the past six.

Cryptic was ecstatic. CBS was ecstatic. Does it make canon sense that half of starfleet will be flying around in a Breen ship or that you are doing STFs with Starfleet captains piloting ships designed for non-humanoid races? Of course not! But the money is way more important than canon.

It is fait accompli and does not bother me anymore. I just don't see how Cryptic can use canon as an excuse anymore to disallow a T-5 constitution class ship. After all, it would make them a ton of cash and makes about as much sense as half of Starfleet being Tholian web weavers and Breen warships.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,535
# 20
12-27-2012, 02:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by flash525 View Post
I knew they were superior to the normal Tier 5 vessels, but I had always thought that the Fleet Ships were superior to the Lock Box ships.
Some can be on par , but the superior bit can be debated , as there is also the user playstyle & equipment that's in question .

Quote:
As we now have it, it seems that Starfleets most powerful vessels are all of alien (or future) design. How did this ever get passed off by CBS?
Actually that's a bit incorrect .
The Jem'Hadar Bug ship is at least 30+ years old design
Same w/the Galor .
I have no idea what the time-stamp / date is on this version of the Chel Garrett -- but per canon it could also be a 30+ year old ship .

But if you think that's ridiculous , consider that in the first 2 years of the game , the King of Cruisers was the Excelsior ... , a ship from the 23rd century and something that was at least 100 years old .
The same ship is soon to be a "contender" once more when it's T5 version gets released .

Now tell me if that makes any sense ?

As to CBS ... yeah , right , whatever , they are soooo involved .... .

But ... having said all that , from a player POV , I am glad that some of the "old molds" (Excelsior , Galaxy and others) get a "refit" in their T5 Fleet version to make them viable again (even as the poor Galaxy get's gimped again w/weak fire power) .

In the end , STO stopped making sense on many fronts long ago .
STO will be out of Beta in another 2-4 years ???
... you know after another 3 story arc remasters, crafting revamp, skills revamp, PVP upgrade ...
*note : the 2-4 year guesstimate came out of comparing Cryptic's Dev speed and that of a snail . Sadly the snail won .
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