Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,658
# 21
01-02-2013, 12:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoge00f View Post


Here we go with the whining about nerfs. Placating away expensive powers randomly is just a brilliant design decision.


No 12 seconds is not enough. 12 seconds of immunity is a joke when it can put an expensive 30 to 45 second cooldown power immediately into cooldown.
Is switching from expensive spike powers to less costly maintaned damage even an option when you consider the ridiculous healing present in PvP?

I only ask because the passives are only going to get worse as more and more are introduced. I don't imagine they will get nerfed to any considerable degree since they do involve a bit of grinding and why upset most of the playerbase?

Who knows with luck the metagame may be able to shift to a less spike focused game if they reduce healing but improve NPC AI and we can all play in a nicely balanced less spikey/less uber heal world..... yeah, yeah, pie in the sky and all that.
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 259
# 22
01-02-2013, 01:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bareel View Post
Provided it doesn't push people into negative resists and removes a % of their current resist instead of a flat amount (ie reduce enemy shield resist by 50%) that is a pure gold idea.
Yes it would need to be kept positive so teams don't add 5 versions of the same debuff to the same target to make them glass, it would be ideal if further instances of the debuff on the same target deminshed for every extra copy added aswell. I had in mind that it would take a certain percentage of shield resist (so basically a counter to Emergency Power to Shields and similear) that scaled with aux power if that is what you meant (pretty sure it is).

Starfleet M.A.C.O. KDF Honour Guard
Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,409
# 23
01-02-2013, 05:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by afree100 View Post
Yes it would need to be kept positive so teams don't add 5 versions of the same debuff to the same target to make them glass, it would be ideal if further instances of the debuff on the same target deminshed for every extra copy added aswell. I had in mind that it would take a certain percentage of shield resist (so basically a counter to Emergency Power to Shields and similear) that scaled with aux power if that is what you meant (pretty sure it is).
or they could make it like target subsystems power drain- only the highest applies.

so if several hit the target at different numbers, only the best would apply, if theyre all the same only one would apply.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mancom View Post
Frankly, I think the only sound advice that one can give new players at this time is to stay away from PVP in STO.
Science pvp at its best-http://www.youtube.com/user/matteo716
Do you even Science Bro?
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 597
# 24
01-03-2013, 04:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by p2wsucks View Post
Not to defend the KHG placate, but there's a huge difference between the two. Against the KHG the attacker has the option of not shooting and just spamming Sci abilities the OP mentions including TBing a target and debuffing it further. Then switching to another target while the TB remains up and allies attack the debuffed target. I had found this to be more of an annoyance than anything.

Now you have builds w/~20% CritH chance which basically means all they need to do is attack you and you're going to get placated. They now have greater control over who gets placated when. So, you can't count on using TB to get a positional advantage even if you aren't firing. This hurts not just offensive output, but defensive positioning.

The KDF Vet ship kept me around for awhile, but it's getting harder and harder to log on anymore. (FYI, can't remember the last time I used KHG shields, I prefer the Omega set).
well you dont need to shoot at me. just tb me and watch me placate you with fed klink sheilds. its super bs and it was back then as well. with double placate i can tank even better now against premades. i ranted this when the new stf sets came out. was jumped on by many "top" pvp'ers. but this is not the only op setup. im rolling a new pvp tact. this time i have space passives. (jem is wasted on my main tact) i want to try the sheild passives with full mk12 borg set. the hit points of mk12 borg sheild comes out to mk12 maco sheild but with awesome regen added by the passive. i bet it will tank even better then standed maco.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 698
# 25
01-03-2013, 07:39 AM
The placate affects cannon escorts the most. I was going against a defiant and besides trying to get the defiant in a cannon arc long enough to do damage I spend half the fight switching targets because well because the defiant kept disappearing. I can't wait til I can get it along with KHG I am going to annoy the hell out out of the "have everything" feds.
Hey I Used to be Captain Data, well I guess I still am in game but the account link really screwed everything up
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,405
# 26
01-03-2013, 08:35 AM
The problem isn't the fact that they bring out effects like the Placate passive, or the KHG shield.

The problem is that they work fine in PVE. And that is how the development of new powers get passed. It works in PVE? Good. Then after weeks to months to sometimes years of complaining, that the power works in bad ways in PVP, does it get changed.

This is not a good way to design powers.

Now I'm not saying that PVP should be the only way to look at powers, skills, and so on. Just that it hurts more then it helps when you don't keep PVP in mind and make sure that the power is balanced well enough for both PVE and PVP.

A placate skill that placates when ever you Crit? And it can't be broken? Not good.

Perhaps changing it from a Passive to an Activation based power might help resolve the situation. Then it can be Subnuced off, and it will only last as long as it's duration. Say it lasts 30 seconds with a 2 minute cool down. Sure it's still going to be annoying, but at least it will be better balanced with PVP in mind.
For even more balance, make it a "Toggle" power that can be turned off with a stun instead.
And if that isn't the desire of the way the ability is supposed to work, then increase the duration of the resistance, and/or reduce the duration of the Placate.

Just my thoughts on both it and other things in general.
You think that your beta test was bad?
Think about this:
American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,409
# 27
01-03-2013, 08:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by webdeath View Post
The problem isn't the fact that they bring out effects like the Placate passive, or the KHG shield.

The problem is that they work fine in PVE. And that is how the development of new powers get passed. It works in PVE? Good. Then after weeks to months to sometimes years of complaining, that the power works in bad ways in PVP, does it get changed.

This is not a good way to design powers.

Now I'm not saying that PVP should be the only way to look at powers, skills, and so on. Just that it hurts more then it helps when you don't keep PVP in mind and make sure that the power is balanced well enough for both PVE and PVP.

A placate skill that placates when ever you Crit? And it can't be broken? Not good.

Perhaps changing it from a Passive to an Activation based power might help resolve the situation. Then it can be Subnuced off, and it will only last as long as it's duration. Say it lasts 30 seconds with a 2 minute cool down. Sure it's still going to be annoying, but at least it will be better balanced with PVP in mind.
For even more balance, make it a "Toggle" power that can be turned off with a stun instead.
And if that isn't the desire of the way the ability is supposed to work, then increase the duration of the resistance, and/or reduce the duration of the Placate.

Just my thoughts on both it and other things in general.
i think thats a great idea! also consider that people like to "activate" things themselves because it makes them feel like theyre doing something.

so.. bring on the more clicky!
Quote:
Originally Posted by mancom View Post
Frankly, I think the only sound advice that one can give new players at this time is to stay away from PVP in STO.
Science pvp at its best-http://www.youtube.com/user/matteo716
Do you even Science Bro?
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,622
# 28
01-03-2013, 09:05 AM
Just increase the immunity and you'll make it less annoying and stupid.

Make it 45 seconds or so.


Click here and here if you are interested in learning more about PvP.
Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 363
# 29
01-03-2013, 08:37 PM
I think people are missing the point about this T4 passive.

The placate activates when YOU as the owner of the passive, critical hits something or someone. On a cannon rapid fire, you're most likely going to be placating your current target. At best, that target will be interrupted from doing the aforementioned abilities. Key word, the target that has been crit will be placated.

However, if the owner of the passive uses an AOE delivery of their criticals, then it is possible that the entire team will be placated. But, the player has pretty much sacrificed so much directed DPS that their damage will only be effective in destroying anything small or low in HP.

To conclude, if anyone does use the AOE tactic with the T4, they really aren't a threat... They're just annoying at best...

I personally do not have the passive employed on any of my ships currently, and I am debating if I even should.
Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,409
# 30
01-04-2013, 03:00 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by paxottoman View Post
I think people are missing the point about this T4 passive.

The placate activates when YOU as the owner of the passive, critical hits something or someone. On a cannon rapid fire, you're most likely going to be placating your current target. At best, that target will be interrupted from doing the aforementioned abilities. Key word, the target that has been crit will be placated.

However, if the owner of the passive uses an AOE delivery of their criticals, then it is possible that the entire team will be placated. But, the player has pretty much sacrificed so much directed DPS that their damage will only be effective in destroying anything small or low in HP.

To conclude, if anyone does use the AOE tactic with the T4, they really aren't a threat... They're just annoying at best...

I personally do not have the passive employed on any of my ships currently, and I am debating if I even should.
i dont think was mentioned in any of the issues....
Quote:
Originally Posted by mancom View Post
Frankly, I think the only sound advice that one can give new players at this time is to stay away from PVP in STO.
Science pvp at its best-http://www.youtube.com/user/matteo716
Do you even Science Bro?
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