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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,474
# 21
01-02-2013, 09:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by fourxgamer View Post
I agree that better players are gonna shine wherever you put them, and that's not a problem. I remember the days of leveling up my Klingon through PvP and those were good times that I miss. I don't mind getting beat by people with the same tool box of gear/ships/doffs. I have no excuse if they beat me and would be inspired to work harder. When I know I will never have the same gear as you, that's not inspiring.
When gear I could buy from the PvP store went away and people were wearing things from STF's and then later using gear from the zen stores, I stopped joining queues.


The incentive for better players not to hang around in vanilla matches with low level gear is that their personal PvP score would not progress past 25 there. Eventually one's ego would drive a person to go do some elite matches and progress/maintain their high scores. If you're willing to make yourself more beatable with lower level gear and just want a clean match, you're welcome to do the normal vanilla stuff for fun also.
You seem to have missed my point. I could care less about rankings. I'd much rather have all commons and avoid the crappy unbalanced 1/2 the time broken power creep gear.

I don't like that I needed to stop flying raiders and use KDF Fleet/Vet ships to be in the same ballpark as all the lotto-fleet-zen crap that's come out the last year. I don't like that I have AMS in my inventory to respond in kind fashion should I get hit w/it or other annoying console crap. I don't like the degree of power coming out of the reputation system including the 3% critH. I don't like how some Doffs (Techs) can make 1/2 dozen others basically redundant lesser choices. Do you get my point now or should I go on?
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,393
# 22
01-02-2013, 11:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by p2wsucks View Post
You seem to have missed my point. I could care less about rankings. I'd much rather have all commons and avoid the crappy unbalanced 1/2 the time broken power creep gear.

I don't like that I needed to stop flying raiders and use KDF Fleet/Vet ships to be in the same ballpark as all the lotto-fleet-zen crap that's come out the last year. I don't like that I have AMS in my inventory to respond in kind fashion should I get hit w/it or other annoying console crap. I don't like the degree of power coming out of the reputation system including the 3% critH. I don't like how some Doffs (Techs) can make 1/2 dozen others basically redundant lesser choices. Do you get my point now or should I go on?
First off I want to be up front and say I don't agree with you. At least for the bit I highlighted. I'd also like to say that the Vet ship is the best battlecloaking ship the KDF has. It is. Really. Be happy flying it, I'm amazed more players don't.

I am curious though as to exactly what ship it was that you were flying, how you were flying it, and what you thought you gained by switching. And I'm not here to troll you and say your reasoning was faulty or any crap like that I really just want to know what your experiences with the system were.

I just went from a heavy bop to a norgh myself. I'm not entirely sure if that counts as an upgrade. It certainly looks cooler. Just tossed that out there so you'd know what ship I was flying (or captaining if sophies looking). I've PVP'd a bit in both of them. And I'm IN that ship because of the same things you mentioned. And that's why I'm curious. I'd like to know how given what seems to be the same circumstance, we had different outcomes.

Cheers and happy flying!!
If I don't respond to posts on this forum don't be offended. I don't sub or follow any of them.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,474
# 23
01-02-2013, 03:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thissler View Post
First off I want to be up front and say I don't agree with you. At least for the bit I highlighted. I'd also like to say that the Vet ship is the best battlecloaking ship the KDF has. It is. Really. Be happy flying it, I'm amazed more players don't.

I am curious though as to exactly what ship it was that you were flying, how you were flying it, and what you thought you gained by switching. And I'm not here to troll you and say your reasoning was faulty or any crap like that I really just want to know what your experiences with the system were.

I just went from a heavy bop to a norgh myself. I'm not entirely sure if that counts as an upgrade. It certainly looks cooler. Just tossed that out there so you'd know what ship I was flying (or captaining if sophies looking). I've PVP'd a bit in both of them. And I'm IN that ship because of the same things you mentioned. And that's why I'm curious. I'd like to know how given what seems to be the same circumstance, we had different outcomes.

Cheers and happy flying!!
I'd mainly fly arenas. I used Heavy BoP for my Tac and B'rel for my Sci. This means there's less of a luxary to sit around cloaked waiting for a perfect time to fight b/c you leave your teammates down 1 or more players unlike C&H and Rat space. It also means vs a decent team you'll need serious consistant pressure dps or you'd never break through their defenses.

This past year's steep power creep on the ships (among other things) has meant vs a decent team in these newer ships I'd be lucky to get a 2nd volley off before having to retreat, it also meant there was a far shorter window if any at all vs quality players to apply damage. It also meant more Boffs et al were spent on surviving the retreat and less on CC/Debuffs. I've had pets w/more hull than my Raiders. W/all the added defenses CC/Debuffs are very much needed.

This past year's power creep also puts it on the players to self police, so I'd have to weigh what build I felt was too OP or if I felt is was OP to use it to demonstrate it. This meant swapping things like Tet Glider, Plas Leech, later AMS, various Doffs in and out. There were the many Doff issues throughout the year more recently aux2batt, but also 15 sec evasive cooldowns, ALL teams on mininum cooldowns, sbc doffs, shield distro doffs, etc. I've heard some interesting rumors involving ground Romulan Reputation Doffs and cooldowns.

The KDF Vet ship is the best BC option for KDF. But, it has its own power creep issues and isn't the same in terms of nimbleness or Boff variety particularly for Sci Captains. Also, the Sci Consoles leave it a lacking option for Sci Captains.

The Sci Brel used to be 1 sci console behind Fed Sci ships, it's now 2. It used to have a DHC fit advantage it doesn't anymore. Sci Boff powers have been diminishing in powers vs misc console/ship/doff abilities (eg Time ship, weaver web, ams, vet ship shield drain, pet spam etc).
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,393
# 24
01-02-2013, 04:23 PM
TY for the reply!
If I don't respond to posts on this forum don't be offended. I don't sub or follow any of them.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 223
# 25
01-02-2013, 05:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by p2wsucks View Post
You seem to have missed my point. I could care less about rankings. I'd much rather have all commons and avoid the crappy unbalanced 1/2 the time broken power creep gear.

I don't like that I needed to stop flying raiders and use KDF Fleet/Vet ships to be in the same ballpark as all the lotto-fleet-zen crap that's come out the last year. I don't like that I have AMS in my inventory to respond in kind fashion should I get hit w/it or other annoying console crap. I don't like the degree of power coming out of the reputation system including the 3% critH. I don't like how some Doffs (Techs) can make 1/2 dozen others basically redundant lesser choices. Do you get my point now or should I go on?
My idea for two queues would give you just that opportunity, right? If you never stepped into elite matches again, that's up to you. I don't think elite matches would be abandoned by the entire community though. The only affect to you is your pvp score would not exceed the arbitrary number of 25 i suggested if you stay in the lower queue.

The free-for-all weekly fights would have everybody together and that'd be the only time you'd have to see console spam or lock box ships or w/e. It would be a demolition derby type event.
Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 366
# 26
01-03-2013, 12:50 AM
Queue without consoles/lockbox ships/DOFFs/C-Store items means, that less people will buy them. It means less money for Cryptic. So - it won't happen. EVER.

You can argue that in long term they will benefit as more people will PvP and more people will be willing to spend money. But the "long term" is the key. There is no such sentence in Cryptic vocabulary. So - forget about it.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,702
# 27
01-03-2013, 02:59 AM
I like you idea, since it lowers the curve at endgame, and saves Cryptic money by firing their useless QnA department, and gives us something to do without all the broken releases while someone in their free time at cryptic comes up with another "fix" for something that should have never existed in the first place.

Persitent PvP has been requested since release, and it can't be stressed enough, how much it would add to the game at any level.
Joined 06.10
PvP 2010-2011
PvP 2012-2013
Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,416
# 28
01-03-2013, 03:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by havam View Post
I like you idea, since it lowers the curve at endgame, and saves Cryptic money by firing their useless QnA department, and gives us something to do without all the broken releases while someone in their free time at cryptic comes up with another "fix" for something that should have never existed in the first place.

Persitent PvP has been requested since release, and it can't be stressed enough, how much it would add to the game at any level.
not only has it been requested but it was actually included in the "sales" pitch since before the game launched.


-rolls eyes-
Quote:
Originally Posted by mancom View Post
Frankly, I think the only sound advice that one can give new players at this time is to stay away from PVP in STO.
Science pvp at its best-http://www.youtube.com/user/matteo716
Do you even Science Bro?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 223
# 29
01-03-2013, 07:48 AM
Thanks everybody for posting thoughts.

I really feel like the Pvp players deserve some kind of recognition when they're out among the Pve crowd. You all have to do fleet mark events, reputation pve etc. and are grouped with pve players. I think you deserve some position of honor during these events. If not having your score visible, maybe team leader should go to the highest rated player. Setting you apart visually or giving you a spot of honor might entice more people to aim for that.

A fun thought I had today was if the PvP crowd could queue up and when there was enough ready to go, they would create a red alert just like the borg. This would allow the PvE types to get some dil or accolades while causing them to engage in PvP without really thinking about it.

So maybe have an NPC Admiral/General surrounded by 20 captains from the PvP queues. Let in twice as many random pve type captains. Don't let the ships that originated from the pvp queue respawn. If the responders to the alert kill the npc boss, either by elimnating all the pvp'ers first or just getting a lucky strike on the capital ship, they win. Everybody gets dil for participating, winners get accolade. If the Pvp camp holds out against two to one odds surviving the 12-15 minute timer, they get the accolade of "Sirius Sector Raider" or "Omega Leonis Infiltrator".

This would be a fun additional use for the Red Alert channel.
It would allow the better PvP players to get recognition beyond their quarantined areas, like this subforum lol. They would become notorious enemies server-wide like a true war ace should be.

Wouldn't it be fun if you were the one pilot that kept all the PvE players from winning?

Would this be easy to implement?
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 726
# 30
01-03-2013, 01:39 PM
To the OP. Making a Vanilla and Elite Queue would do nothing but further frustrate many. Because if you take a PvP veteran that knows how things interact and put him in a Vanilla match with say T4 ship and MKX white gear and he still stomps a mud hole into a newcomer that new comer is going to stay out of the "kiddie" pool. If you do not think that will happen challenge any 5 guys in the OPvP channel with a Tier Handicap you get your best PvE buddies and loadout in all the good gear you have and then let the "Vets" come in T4 ships with MKX whites and I guarantee it will be a 15-0 or 15-1 skunking. They need a ladder system that is tied into kills and wins and other stats for healers and CC guys so that you end up teamed will similarly skilled players. And also make the matches a minimum of 3 v 3.
Hey I Used to be Captain Data, well I guess I still am in game but the account link really screwed everything up
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