Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 145
# 1 Reputation Tier Advancement
01-03-2013, 05:47 PM
You know I made Omega Tier 5 today. I went in to get ready to start preparing the unlocking of the MkXII Omega Ground set and SPace Sets and nearly died from a massive coronary infarction. The material cost for a MkXII to that of a MkXI is really steep. This lead me to compare the costs of a MkX to MkXI. Well same thing here.
When you compare the stat increase from MkX to MkXI and MkXI to MkXII the cost in material isn't justified when you compare the minor increase in the equipment's abilities. This is the case even with the MACO and Omega Space Sets. SO I am assuming that this is the same for the Reman MkXII very rare when compared to the Reman MkXII rare Space Set.

I feel that for the slight increase in abilities that is given, the material cost for each item is to steep. Either a more aggressive increase in ability scores needs to be presence when compared to the steep increase in material cost between a MkX to MkXI or MkXI to MkXII. Or the material costs needs to be lower to justify the minor increase in each ability score.

The Romulan Plasma energy weapons was also a big disappointment when I compared them to my Advanced Fleet plasma energy weapons. I use Damage x 3, Accuracy Advanced Fleet weapons. For the material costs that I used to unlock these weapons and the additional cost in purchasing them I expected a powerful weapon when I compared it to my Advanced Fleet weapons. NOPE! Big disappointment. And I am lead to understand that the difference between an Advanced Fleet weapon and an Elite Fleet weapon is so minor, but the cost is greatly increased.

The whole point of this is this. If you are going to require such a large amount of material to unlock items and to scale up your base to get such items. Such items needs to be worth the cost and time it took to get them.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,787
# 2
01-03-2013, 10:07 PM
For most people getting Mk X Space Sets is enough. IMO the only reason to get any Omega Mk XII gear is for purely aesthetic reasons with the ground sets. Of course, if you are a minmaxer, then you need to get Mk XII gear. The Romulan weapons are mainly for the gimmick. If you don't like the gimmick, then there is no need to get them.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 518
# 3
01-03-2013, 10:17 PM
But if you get the Mark XII you get a cool helmet !

Yeah, I'm kinda with you. I got the MACO MK XII space and ground set pre-season 7 and the lottery almost drove me out of the game. All of those STFs just for a freakin' helmet- not much better on stats.

At least the old way you could do normal stfs, grind up edc and buy a set of Mk XI eventually.
It would take awhile, but you'd know how long that would be. That's kinda the point of the reputation system.

I agree with the OP, the price difference between MXI & Mk XII is not reflected in the stats.

I gotta slightly disagree with starkaos though. I would get a Mk XI set if I were going to do any kind of endgame play.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 95
# 4
01-04-2013, 06:31 AM
Yeah, it's just the sheer fact that you grind to get to T5, only to realize how crazy expensive the stuff is once you get there.

Seriously, the concept is frustrating that you grind to get the priviledge to pay an insane amount for gear. Just cut out the grinding crap and give me the upfront price. Ponzi-scheme.
Career Officer
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 120
# 5
01-04-2013, 06:43 AM
Well, the Adapted MACO ground set is really amazing (i.e. not just for "minmaxers")... the grenade launcher is an item that the fedside didnt have before.

Also the adapted KHG spaceset... +25 torp / +8? Aux power is a great 2-pce bonus.

Sure it was expensive, but only took me a couple dozen elite STFs for all the OMEGA marks... and the cost of the items at T5 are weighted towards more OMEGA marks and less dilithium required, so I really couldn't complain.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,054
# 6
01-04-2013, 07:03 AM
yeah, I made a similar post about this.
I wrote how stupid this was. I mean the mk xi and mk xii borg engines were exactly the same, the only reason you had to buy it, so you can get a buff on the set bonus (and a tiny bonus on the deflector and shield)
there needs to be either a buff on these items, or the prices need to be adjusted
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,553
# 7
01-04-2013, 01:18 PM
Have you looked on the exchange recently? I will use that as a comparison to what you're talking about and to help iterate my point.

Neutronium Alloy mk XI gives a 17.5 increase to all defense. Neutronium Alloy mk XII gives and 18.8 increase, and a Neutronium Alloy mk XII gives an increase of 20.

Now when you actually look at the in game defense values, in reality that defense increase of 17.5-18.8-20 only gives about 0.75-1% defense bonus per increase per console. Miniscule at best. But look at the average exchange prices.

Neutronium Alloy mk XI: 250k ECs
Neutronium Alloy mk XII: 4.4 million ECs
Neutronium Alloy mk XII: 35 million ECs

So... we have a puny increase in effectiveness (~1%), but a massive, over 8-10x increase in cost.

Now let's look at mk X to mk XI to mk XII sets. Same thing. You have only a TINY increase in performance (5% at best), but a huge hike in costs. But guess what, we already did that to ourselves. And that's how it's always been. Take your vendors for example. They sell you a mk I phaser beam array for what, 500? And yet if you look at it's stats, it's just under half as powerful as your standard mk XII phaser beam array, whose value is listed at over 11k. That's not a +100% cost increase for the +100% effectiveness, that's actually closer to +1900% increase in cost for the +100% effectiveness.

That's how prices have always been. If you want things that have that small increase in power, then you have to pay for it. We already do that to ourselves with the market we control (the exchange), so Cryptic is just continuing that trend.
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
Tired of Wasting EC and Time trying to get Superior Romulan Operative BOffs? Here's a cheap and easy way to get them, with an almost 100% chance of success.
Why the Devs can't make PvE content harder.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,054
# 8
01-04-2013, 01:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hereticknight085 View Post
Have you looked on the exchange recently? I will use that as a comparison to what you're talking about and to help iterate my point.

Neutronium Alloy mk XI gives a 17.5 increase to all defense. Neutronium Alloy mk XII gives and 18.8 increase, and a Neutronium Alloy mk XII gives an increase of 20.

Now when you actually look at the in game defense values, in reality that defense increase of 17.5-18.8-20 only gives about 0.75-1% defense bonus per increase per console. Miniscule at best. But look at the average exchange prices.

Neutronium Alloy mk XI: 250k ECs
Neutronium Alloy mk XII: 4.4 million ECs
Neutronium Alloy mk XII: 35 million ECs

So... we have a puny increase in effectiveness (~1%), but a massive, over 8-10x increase in cost.

Now let's look at mk X to mk XI to mk XII sets. Same thing. You have only a TINY increase in performance (5% at best), but a huge hike in costs. But guess what, we already did that to ourselves. And that's how it's always been. Take your vendors for example. They sell you a mk I phaser beam array for what, 500? And yet if you look at it's stats, it's just under half as powerful as your standard mk XII phaser beam array, whose value is listed at over 11k. That's not a +100% cost increase for the +100% effectiveness, that's actually closer to +1900% increase in cost for the +100% effectiveness.

That's how prices have always been. If you want things that have that small increase in power, then you have to pay for it. We already do that to ourselves with the market we control (the exchange), so Cryptic is just continuing that trend.
well there are many uncommon duty officers that cost less, than their common counterparts. so with your logic, I could argue that the higher lvl gear should be cheaper.

also, since EC is not timegated, and easy to get, those prices are somewhat real (and driven by market), however these prices are just there to take our dilithium away, so the dil/zen rate is low. now there is nothing wrong with that, as long as we are getting something. but if the upgrade is not worth it, why bother. it is their interest, to make us purchase these items, but at this point, there is minor increase in usefulness (minor as in even smaller than the usual upgrades you can get on items, that are out there, and not tied to rep system)

edit: also what you picked is a uniqe (aka useful) item, and its price is high. there are many items which are cheap even at mk xii very rare
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,553
# 9
01-04-2013, 01:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ferdzso0 View Post
well there are many uncommon duty officers that cost less, than their common counterparts. so with your logic, I could argue that the higher lvl gear should be cheaper.

also, since EC is not timegated, and easy to get, those prices are somewhat real (and driven by market), however these prices are just there to take our dilithium away, so the dil/zen rate is low. now there is nothing wrong with that, as long as we are getting something. but if the upgrade is not worth it, why bother. it is their interest, to make us purchase these items, but at this point, there is minor increase in usefulness (minor as in even smaller than the usual upgrades you can get on items, that are out there, and not tied to rep system)

edit: also what you picked is a uniqe (aka useful) item, and its price is high. there are many items which are cheap even at mk xii very rare
Using your own argument, if these prices are so extravagant and the bonus so small, why bother to get the items? Just stick with "good enough". I was trying to be nice to OP, but I think I should just say what I was planning on from the start.

If you cannot be bothered to put out the resources for the slightly better gear, and you don't think the cost is justified, then you don't deserve this slightly better stuff and should stick with your "good enough" gear. The prices are there so that only the players who are really committed to getting these items get them, players who are willing to put out the resources and time to earn these items.

I won't argue it's a slightly off system of doing things, but if you look at the time it takes to get the dil (provided you don't blow a bunch of cash on zen, in which case you should get the items for supporting the game, doesn't make you a better player) and the methods of getting dil (usually ESTFs/FAs), then you kind of did earn your keep already.
It is said the best weapon is one that is never fired. I disagree. The best weapon is one you only have to fire... once.
Tired of Wasting EC and Time trying to get Superior Romulan Operative BOffs? Here's a cheap and easy way to get them, with an almost 100% chance of success.
Why the Devs can't make PvE content harder.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 25
# 10
01-04-2013, 04:00 PM
ok why do you now cry about prices ? arent you happy you are almost 100% sure you will get the set ? i was raiding stfs before and only thing i got was full mk xi ground set and 1 mk xii space shield and mk xii space deflector.. now i am happy that i know i will one day for sure get my hands on mk xii sets and other stuff
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