Survivor of Remus
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 318
# 81
01-16-2013, 11:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gulberat View Post
LOL, yikes. Am I right that Khas is an insectoid of some sort?
Khas could be described as an anthropo-arachnoid. He's about what I'd imagine you'd get if a Xenomorph and an accountant had a baby and then had that baby join Starfleet.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,991
# 82
01-16-2013, 11:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gulberat View Post
On a psychological level, perhaps the extreme genetic closeness between the two meant it was a bit of a narcissistic thing on Marcus' part?
Yes, I think that there would be a certain amount of narcissism to it, overall, I just figured GSA would be a suitably significant personality flaw

Quote:
Originally Posted by gulberat View Post
Yeah...definitely not arguing that. I was just explaining why I had thought she was even more nuts than she really was.
I think if it had been a longer piece, I might indeed have had the interactions with the modern crew taking more sinister turns, but mostly, I just wanted to reinforce that the haunting had been a genuine experience

Quote:
Originally Posted by gulberat View Post
I never understood why we didn't see more evidence of human influence on Worf. There should've been at least something, unless he deliberately played ignorant of human customs. BTW, he should, specifically, have shown at least some influence of Belorussian culture. Even a little reference or vocabulary word here and there would've helped to make that backstory feel less tacked-on.
Worf made a comment in DS-9 about how he had accidentally killed another child while playing soccer, so I think as a child, he may indeed have participated more in Human culture, but become more withdrawn after that incident. The episode of TNG where they found the other Klingons showed just how separated from Klingon culture Worf truly was. If anything, Sisko embraced the Klingon lifestyle much more than Worf ever did

Quote:
Originally Posted by gulberat View Post
The difference between Alyosha and a "native-raised" Devidian is much greater. I would imagine young Devidians are taught to ignore the terror of their victims. There's a telling line in "Time's Arrow" where it was apparently so bad that Troi is able to feel an aftershock of the victims' fear even though their life force has been completely consumed already. That made me think that the process was a) deeply distressing or painful to the victim and b) the victims felt their attackers' malevolence and hunger.

(That's also why--besides the fact that I had a mutiny to prevent!--that I allowed the victims to feel Alyosha's emotions as he fought to bring them back.)

They probably view it from the same moral standpoint as when you raise a child on a farm and teach him or her to accept the slaughter of livestock. (Of course to many humans there's a big difference between livestock and another human being, but the point remains.) When Alyosha accidentally killed his caretaker as a child, no one had ever taught him that, so he reacted from a "natural" conscience and it absolutely shook him to the core.
It could be, that Devidians are somewhat like Vampires when it comes to learning to ignore the terror of their victims. I often wondered if a Vampire's 'lack of a soul', was what enabled them to feed without feeling sympathy for their victims. You're definitely going to have to post up more of Alyosha's escapades, I'd love to read them

Last edited by marcusdkane; 01-16-2013 at 12:19 PM.
Captain
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,586
# 83
01-16-2013, 12:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by squatsauce View Post
Khas could be described as an anthropo-arachnoid. He's about what I'd imagine you'd get if a Xenomorph and an accountant had a baby and then had that baby join Starfleet.


This is warping my ability to comprehend.
Kathryn S. Beringer - The Dawn Patrol

Solaris build - Veritatum Liquido Cernene
Survivor of Remus
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 318
# 84
01-16-2013, 12:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrscarlet View Post


This is warping my ability to comprehend.
Well, there comes a time in every accountant's life where having a crusty, disconsolate baby with a ravening space monster is simply the most fiscally responsible thing to do. I know what you're thinking: "Who would even want to have a baby with an accountant?" But the answer to that is pretty straightforward: Aliens.

I hope that explains everything satisfactorily.
Captain
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,586
# 85
01-16-2013, 02:11 PM
Yes ... yes it does.

I'm going to get a beer from the ramifications of this discussion.
Kathryn S. Beringer - The Dawn Patrol

Solaris build - Veritatum Liquido Cernene
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 881
# 86
01-16-2013, 04:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcusdkane View Post
Yes, I think that there would be a certain amount of narcissism to it, overall, I just figured GSA would be a suitably significant personality flaw
Yeah, especially since "normally" GSA occurs when the siblings were not raised together (and therefore the Westermarck effect didn't prevent the attraction).

Quote:
Worf made a comment in DS-9 about how he had accidentally killed another child while playing soccer, so I think as a child, he may indeed have participated more in Human culture, but become more withdrawn after that incident. The episode of TNG where they found the other Klingons showed just how separated from Klingon culture Worf truly was. If anything, Sisko embraced the Klingon lifestyle much more than Worf ever did
Not so sure about Sisko, but it might well be arguable that Curzon and Jadzia Dax were more into the "modern" Klingon culture than Worf was.

And yeah, I was definitely thinking about the soccer incident that Worf had. But it strikes me that he seems ignorant of human culture to the point of not even knowing the basics that you couldn't help seeing if you were watching TV, or the 24th-century equivalent thereof.

Quote:
It could be, that Devidians are somewhat like Vampires when it comes to learning to ignore the terror of their victims. I often wondered if a Vampire's 'lack of a soul', was what enabled them to feed without feeling sympathy for their victims.
Quite possibly. Then again, plain old human psychology is capable of some pretty serious extremes on its own (think of the Milgram and Stanford Prison Experiments! ). Even regular people, if not specifically educated to watch for it, are subject to dangerous and even cruel cognitive biases. That's part of why I decided to go with the explanation of it being a learned behavior rather than some sort of genetic inability to emote or feel sympathy. There's a whole evolutionary explanation I've been coming up with, but I won't post it here because it would take up way too much room.

[quote[You're definitely going to have to post up more of Alyosha's escapades, I'd love to read th]m [/quote]

Thanks! Hopefully the next prompts will inspire me. Exploring the fallout of this incident is definitely something I would do, given the opportunity.
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Do you like story-based Foundry missions? If so, please check out my mission, "Finding Lascaux."

Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,991
# 87
01-17-2013, 03:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gulberat View Post
Yeah, especially since "normally" GSA occurs when the siblings were not raised together (and therefore the Westermarck effect didn't prevent the attraction).
That's very true... Of course, incest is not illegal in Japan, so I think the Westermarck effect may be as much social conditioning, as some 'inbuilt' biological awareness. Equally, Alix's genetic re-sequencing could have nullified the Westermarck effect in regards to her own behavior, and Marcus could simply be a deviant in his own right, because as mentioned, people felt he was 'too perfect', and as I wasn't willing to change him with regards that perfection, I had to add a flaw equally disgraceful to compensate

Quote:
Originally Posted by gulberat View Post
Not so sure about Sisko, but it might well be arguable that Curzon and Jadzia Dax were more into the "modern" Klingon culture than Worf was.
Dax was definitely into Klingon culture, and 'got it' more than Worf ever did. As for Sisko, I was thinking of the episode where they had to go undercover as Klingons at some event to assassinate Gowron, and Sisko was able to really 'get into character'

Quote:
Originally Posted by gulberat View Post
And yeah, I was definitely thinking about the soccer incident that Worf had. But it strikes me that he seems ignorant of human culture to the point of not even knowing the basics that you couldn't help seeing if you were watching TV, or the 24th-century equivalent thereof.
I do see what you mean, I'm just wondering if some of that wasn't simply feigned behavior and deliberate cultural rejection, so no one could doubt his Klingon Credentials, rather than a genuine ignorance

Quote:
Originally Posted by gulberat View Post
Quite possibly. Then again, plain old human psychology is capable of some pretty serious extremes on its own (think of the Milgram and Stanford Prison Experiments! ). Even regular people, if not specifically educated to watch for it, are subject to dangerous and even cruel cognitive biases. That's part of why I decided to go with the explanation of it being a learned behavior rather than some sort of genetic inability to emote or feel sympathy. There's a whole evolutionary explanation I've been coming up with, but I won't post it here because it would take up way too much room.
That's very true, and definitely makes sense that you went with that route. The explanation sounds fantastic, it would be great to read it

Quote:
Originally Posted by gulberat View Post
Thanks! Hopefully the next prompts will inspire me. Exploring the fallout of this incident is definitely something I would do, given the opportunity.
You're very welcome, and likewise, thanks for your feedback on my own entry, it's very much appreciated, I'll look forwards to seeing what entries future challenges inspire you to create
Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 394
# 88
01-17-2013, 04:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by squatsauce View Post
I never understood why the away teams tended to consist of "all the guys who know how to run a ship" and, maybe, "a guy who can die to underline how dangerous away missions can be". Don't they have a few annoying ensigns and non-critical crewmen they could assign to those things? Seriously, the Enterprise was always, like, one transporter accident away from leaving Wesley Crusher or Guinan in charge of the ship.
I completely understand and agree with you here. That's one of the reasons I find it such a brilliant line
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 881
# 89
01-17-2013, 09:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcusdkane View Post
I do see what you mean, I'm just wondering if some of that wasn't simply feigned behavior and deliberate cultural rejection, so no one could doubt his Klingon Credentials, rather than a genuine ignorance
Could be. It would certainly be quite the irony if (assuming he knew where Worf was raised) Alyosha went up to Worf speaking Russian and expecting Worf to be interested in talking about things from that part of the world. Worf would be none the wiser about the irony, of course, but it would be rather funny.

Quote:
That's very true, and definitely makes sense that you went with that route. The explanation sounds fantastic, it would be great to read it
Still fine-tuning it, so it's not quite ready for prime time yet.

Quote:
You're very welcome, and likewise, thanks for your feedback on my own entry, it's very much appreciated, I'll look forwards to seeing what entries future challenges inspire you to create
You're most welcome.

BTW, I am not sure if it works when I send a PM on this board. Did you receive the one I sent you? If not, I could try in-game mail instead.
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Do you like story-based Foundry missions? If so, please check out my mission, "Finding Lascaux."

Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,991
# 90
01-17-2013, 11:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gulberat View Post
Could be.
I'd be willing to borrow money at Ferengi rates of interest to bet on it Worf might have liked to act like a Klingon, or more accurately, how he thought a Klingon should act, but deep down, he was pretty insecure, and when confronted with other Klingons, his behavior was always a little off compared to the others...

Quote:
Originally Posted by gulberat View Post
Still fine-tuning it, so it's not quite ready for prime time yet.
Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by gulberat View Post
BTW, I am not sure if it works when I send a PM on this board. Did you receive the one I sent you? If not, I could try in-game mail instead.
I didn't think PMs worked on here either, but I got the message and have replied
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