Cryptic Studios Team
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,053
# 41
01-25-2013, 08:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mancom View Post
Maybe you could give us the formula that is used for hitrate calculations? Just in case the old Geko one is wrong.

(As I understand it, only Defense and Accuracy are relevant. So things like range are not being taken into account, correct?)
These calculations haven't been changed. The information previously published is still accurate.

Quote:
And also: maybe your dev magic powers are the problem? Maybe you are affecting the calculations in a way that differ from actual weapon mods. Why are you testing with dev +1000 anyway instead of simply equipping Acc3 weapons and compare them to no Acc weapons?
Equipping Acc3 weapons would give such a small variance that a very large sample size + parser would be required to retrieve the data that was being gathered. I have neither an abundance of time, nor experience using the parsing tools available in the community, and so opted for a more dramatic/simplified test scenario that would reveal obvious issues if they existed.

For the purposes of my testing, I created a Phaser Beam Array with an [Accx1000] modifier. This wasn't a Temporary power, or "Dev magic" beyond creating the item. I cloned off the data from an existing [Acc] modifier and increased the value, then attached it to a standard Phaser Beam Array. Simple stuff, and there's no reason it should have created skewed results of any kind.
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Jeremy Randall
Cryptic - Systems Design
"Play smart!"
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Kurland here...
Career Officer
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 207
# 42
01-25-2013, 08:09 AM
Bort,
I would be interested in purchasing said Beam Array for a hefty sum. Please send PM with price
Career Officer
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 556
# 43
01-25-2013, 08:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by borticuscryptic View Post
For the purposes of my testing, I created a Phaser Beam Array with an [Accx1000] modifier. This wasn't a Temporary power, or "Dev magic" beyond creating the item. I cloned off the data from an existing [Acc] modifier and increased the value, then attached it to a standard Phaser Beam Array. Simple stuff, and there's no reason it should have created skewed results of any kind.
That sounds good. Of course there is still the question of whether there are any hard caps in place that might skew results by clipping such huge values (like e.g. there is supposedly a 25% minimum hitrate, maybe there are similar cutoff points to limit max defense values). Hard to tell without access to the source code.
http://hilbertguide.com
Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,465
# 44
01-25-2013, 08:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by borticuscryptic View Post
For the purposes of my testing, I created a Phaser Beam Array with an [Accx1000] modifier. This wasn't a Temporary power, or "Dev magic" beyond creating the item. I cloned off the data from an existing [Acc] modifier and increased the value, then attached it to a standard Phaser Beam Array. Simple stuff, and there's no reason it should have created skewed results of any kind.
Unless there was a flaw inherent in the way the [Acc] modifier is interacting with FaWs coding (or vice-versa) that isn't apparent at extremely high multiples of said modifier, no?
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,015
# 45
01-25-2013, 08:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by borticuscryptic View Post
I have neither an abundance of time, nor experience using the parsing tools available in the community...
Quote:
Originally Posted by mancom View Post
Hard to tell without access to the source code.
Just let him in under a NDA. Problem solved, problem staying solved.

Hilbert would you accept consulting fees in dil?
Career Officer
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 556
# 46
01-25-2013, 08:36 AM
It would probably take months to get any useful info from the source code. I guess that's also the reason why nobody remembers that beams and cannons use different formulas (which I am certain of - the data fits the two plausible formulas too good to be a mere coincidence, especially in the absence of any other explanation). (I won't even start with the oddities regarding CSV and accuracy (but they are minor and not gamechanging).)
http://hilbertguide.com
Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,118
# 47
01-25-2013, 09:03 AM
I've run quite a few logs and looked in detail.
My tac escort with cannons scores 99.5+ % in all areas of cannon fire in STFs, with acc trait and acc weapons.

My eng cruiser with beams and BFaW with the exact same weapons is scoring 94%, with lower dips shown in BFaW.

This this example its hard to tell how much overage both the eng and tac are getting in PvE.



When I look at incoming damage, BFaW hits 100.00% always. Even on 100 defense score escorts
Delirium Tremens
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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 238
# 48
01-25-2013, 10:05 AM
So lets pretend everything is now right with BFaW, is it then the purpose of the buff to feel "gimped" and be a spam clearing tool, I personally have never been a fan of stupid skills that always are better but I think we made this skill too bad, Its better to not use Bfaw in pvp then using it, and clearing spam with active doff powers puts you at a disadvantage from the start of the match.
Noone.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,926
# 49
01-25-2013, 10:36 AM
its not a reporting error. in that duel when FAW was on the guy was able to heal his shields faster then i could damage them, when FAW was cooling down he couldn't keep the facing up and started taking hull damage. it must have been a relief when e turned FAW back on. i could also see nearly half the shot fly past him when FAW was on, and what do you know, it had a ~60% accuracy ratting

if he were to stop, FAW would have been much more accurate. ive notice it actually hits held targets pretty well. so defense score clearly effects it , but it operates like you have 0 innate ship accuracy and 0 acc mods.


also, back in the day, accurate FAW would balloon score board numbers considerably. in those loged matches i had some of the worst numbers.


anyway thanks a bunch for looking into this bort, we really appreciate it! especially since your squeazing it in among other assigned tasks.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lordlalo View Post
I just wanted to say, I've never seen a more disturbing avatar
the pvp build and help thread
gateway links(should actually work now) -->Norvo Tigan, Telis Latto Ruwon, Sochie Heim, Solana Soleus

Last edited by dontdrunkimshoot; 01-25-2013 at 10:39 AM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 222
# 50
01-25-2013, 10:44 AM
I applaud. It's beginning to start. Again, I applaud you Cryptic...

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