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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 597
# 21
01-26-2013, 04:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bitemepwe View Post
Oh, funny how the OP went from Beams suck through escorts are OP to the KDF are OP back to beams suck in one long block of text.

Do beams suck or is it that cannons are OP or Escorts are OP or healing for Cruisers suck or fed ships suck or KDF ships are OP or........ What? Your post is all over the place and hints at many agendas within agendas...

Did you drink Sophies cool aid or just make your on?
I was trying to convey the domino affect of beams sucking causing Fed ships to be worse than KDF and cruisers worse than escorts.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 182
# 22
01-26-2013, 04:04 PM
I want to use my cannons broadside and fire all my 8 cannons at the same time, it's unfair that you can broadside with beams but not cannons.

All weapons should have the same DPS and the same firing arc, the same procs, the same everything. Weapons should only be a visuall aspect and should have nothing to do with the damage output of the ship.



Oh! also, cannons should do the same damage from a distance, just like beams, I don't need to be within 5km to do maximum damage with beams, why do I have to be so close with cannons, it's unfair.

and Escorts should have the same hull as any cruisers, otherwise it's not fair.

We should all have the same speed, DPS, Hull, turn rate, etc. the Same Everything for Everyone, the different weapons, armor, ships, etc.. should only be visual widget and not influence the space battles.

Last edited by deyvad; 01-26-2013 at 04:08 PM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 597
# 23
01-26-2013, 04:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by questerius View Post
I actually managed to get top damage a few times in my Intrepid (Gorn and Klingon PVE) so i wouldn't say beams are worthless. They do take more skill to use to their fullest effect though.
PVE? That is not saying anything. How do we know you weren't paired up with beginner pilots or a bunch of cruisers? Anybody can get top damage depending on what type of players was in with you.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 597
# 24
01-26-2013, 04:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deyvad View Post
I want to use my cannons broadside and fire all my 8 cannons at the same time, it's unfair that you can broadside with beams but not cannons.

All weapons should have the same DPS and the same firing arc, the same procs, the same everything. Weapons should only be a visuall aspect and should have nothing to do with the damage output of the ship.



Oh! also, cannons should do the same damage from a distance, just like beams, I don't need to be within 5km to do maximum damage with beams, why do I have to be so close with cannons, it's unfair.

and Escorts should have the same hull as any cruisers, otherwise it's not fair.

We should all have the same speed, DPS, Hull, turn rate, etc. the Same Everything for Everyone, the different weapons, armor, ships, etc.. should only be visual widget and not influence the space battles.
Right now broadsiding with beams don't do a damn thing. A cruiser and I broadsied eachother the whole match. I couldn't kill him or drain his shield fast enough and neither could he do the same to me. We just wasted PVP time trying to hurt one another with beams.
Career Officer
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 26
# 25
01-26-2013, 05:25 PM
A few things I would like to see happen to beams. Some more than others.

One would be either a rate of fire increase/shots per cycle or an inate increase to acc or CTH under the guise that Beams are a much more accurate weapon due to its instant hit ability. *Remeber heavy cannons get a bonus to Crit damage due to slower RoF compared to reg cannons.* Procs should should also be increased to give them the same chance to proc as a faster firing cannon.

Alot of powers we have been getting lately to our weapons have been adding chances per shot to add damage or proc some sort of ability. So the more something fires the more of a chance it will proc. I believe quad cannons fire the most shots per cycle atm. Cannons especially when using either Rapid or scatter. The chance to proc is greatly increased because you get more rounds down range.
Captain
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,348
# 26
01-26-2013, 05:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexindcobra View Post
PVE? That is not saying anything. How do we know you weren't paired up with beginner pilots or a bunch of cruisers? Anybody can get top damage depending on what type of players was in with you.
Maybe, but it shows that beams are not useless. Canons may give more DPS, but used correctly beams and torpedo combos can be lethal.

Though i don't play PvP that often i get plenty of kills there as well against both Escorts and Cruisers. Timing is critical though and hence beams take more skill to use to their full potential.

You have to take down the opponents shields at the exact moment the torpedoes arrive. Usually it's taking broadside pot shots to the point where you see someone recharging their shields, launch torpedoes, throw hazards their way, BO + target shields and they're down when the torpedo salvo strikes. Bye bye opponent.

Don't get me wrong i also run escorts with canons to great effect, but beams are far from useless. Beams, as i stated earlier, simply take more skill to master.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 622
# 27
01-26-2013, 05:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sophlogimo View Post
At this point, we should remind ourselves that STO is a PVE-centered game. 95% of players (if not more) do not really play PvP in any significant amount.

This is a very important thing to keep in mind.



That is an overgeneralization. No, PvP is just "player vs. player". That includes duels (which happen frequently via private challenges), Capture and Hold (which has its share of 1v1 encounters), and Ker'rat (which is full of 1v1).

Seriously. The game must work 1v1 with any ship pairing, or it does not work.



Even though this is drifting offtopic, I would like to point out that escorts can do a cruiser's job much, much, much, much, much better than a cruiser can do an escort's, and it can do a sci ship's "crowd control" job at least as good as a science ship, as there are "crowd control" (which means, to control crowds of smaller NPC's) tactical powers that are far more effective than sci ones: CSV, BFAW, TS control crowds better than GW, TR, PSW, CPB, TBR can even hope. Science vessels can debuff better, but escorts don't need to do that, because blowing up stuff is, ultimately, a much better "debuff" anyway.

Star Trek Online, in 99% of the existing space combat content (including most PvP), is Escorts Online right now.

I really do have trouble understanding how anyone could disagree with this.



I am all for a cautious approach when adjusting game mechanics. But before that, it is required to acknowledge that there is some adjustment needed.



Yes, they do only 60% of their base damage, where cannons do 40%. Unfortunately, with the existing base numbers, guess who wins.
Once again the misconception that player versus player denotes a one versus one interaction is perpetuated. Successful PVP is always balanced around team interaction which leads to the second point.

Also perpetuated is the fallacy that every ship/character/weapon/skill must be able to perform every function of every other ship/character/weapon/skill in an equal or even roughly equal fashion. When differentiation is removed, choices no longer exist and tactics become unnecessary.
All cloaks should be canon.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,060
# 28
01-26-2013, 05:51 PM
I this thread where we vote to have the massive power drain for beams reduced to match the damage output?

*votes yes*
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Commander
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 427
# 29
01-26-2013, 06:10 PM
Beams need less power drain.

/thread
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 155
# 30
01-26-2013, 08:22 PM
All weapons need their power usage scaled with DPS. With anything less than Dual Cannons, you get penalized twice for a better firing arc. Even turrets only use a whopping 2 less power per shot.

What good is it if you can hit everything with a pea shooter or dim flashlight?
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