Go Back   Star Trek Online > Feedback > PvP Gameplay
Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Captain
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 585
# 31
01-29-2013, 12:24 PM
With just decloak+Tac buffs it'll one-shot a Fleet Defiant through full shields and BFI w/o needing to debuff it first.

It's overall base damage should come down while the Torpedo: High Yield and Torpedo: Spread need to stop nerfing the Shield penetration on Transphasic Torpedos. Otherwise the only reasonable Transphasic "spike" weapon will be the Cluster Torpedo to the end of days, as well as the mines.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5,587
# 32
01-30-2013, 08:53 PM
Alright, well, I had some numbers...but, a storm took out my power yesterday, and they were on an un-saved document...so...yeah...that happened.

But basically it all boiled down to this:

1. Against a target with no kinetic resistance, it's good regardless of anything else.

2. Even fully buffed by a tac and hitting a resisted target on a non-crit, it can still be good, but far from being overpowered or a 'one hit kill'.

3. The only time I ever vaporized my target in one shot (or nearly so) was only when it did the 'one crit to rule them all'. Because of that, the sheer damage regardless was enough to destroy the target regardless of anything else.



So yeah, pretty much the crit issue is the only true problem here. Get rid of that, and any hints of OPness disappear pretty quickly. After that is gone, it's a very good weapon, dare I say...balanced.

Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5,587
# 33
02-02-2013, 11:14 AM
Sorry to bring this up again, but...

I got to thinking about this and, I'm curious about something:

How does the Omega Graviton Amplifier passive affect the Breen Cluster torp? If it procs on the torp, does it proc on all of the mines? Or none of the mines? Or does it proc seperately (like hopefully it should)?

Even if it did it like the crit bug does, it could be making it a bit too powerful and causing potential one-shots, but I'm not 100% sure, because I don't know how that passive is affecting the cluster torp.

Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 145
# 34
02-02-2013, 11:17 PM
Runing a fully spec tran cluster, its decent but not op, fully spec drop in my rotaion with full tac Alpha + omega it gets high but is not the finisher. Ive seen each mine range from 300-3000( This really depends on what buff/consoles they are running).

If I was a escort it would be pointless to spec this high , also a fully spec cannon scort droping tac alphas would kill much faster. Pls dont nerf another alternative spec, full kin is fun for some and for once has a nitch in this game.


Ps It is a bigger pleasure watching two previously fully buffed normal trans mines crit a shieldless opponent for 2x7k(30km away) , A random mine is the ace in team warfare. WtF was that scottie.
Nova Core
ParadiseKiller

House of Beautiful Orions
Zeadonouse
ToLate

Last edited by paradise1killer; 02-02-2013 at 11:36 PM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,060
# 35
02-02-2013, 11:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by webdeath View Post
Breen Transphasic Cluster Torpedo, is it OP now?
Shhhh! Don't make them nerf it!
_________________
Nebula coffee is the best coffee
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 81
# 36
02-02-2013, 11:55 PM
I like what you have done with the trics. I have a kinetic/crit chance build and have never one shotted anything with the tranphasic cluster torpedo. Whatever you do please don't force us all into an all canon build.

For the record, if you disconnect the one-crit they all-crit this weapon and all mines will be trash.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5,587
# 37
02-03-2013, 12:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mozoha View Post
For the record, if you disconnect the one-crit they all-crit this weapon and all mines will be trash.
How so? In what way would fixing a bug like that suddenly make all mines trash? What do you have to feel that would be the case?

Honestly, if they removed the crit-all bug, I feel it might actually improve mines in a couple different ways:

1. It'd probably remove any chance of mines being considered 'OP' by anyone at all, since the whole crit-all thing is why Tric mines can be such an issue, or at least they were.

2. By removing the crit-bug, it means your mines will each have a chance to crit individually, and would probably mean a general increase in damage with them, because instead of knowing that you will have either no mines crit, or they all do at once, you'd have each mine having it's own chance to crit.

Say you use a Tric mine DPB 3 as they are now.

Pretend they do 20k damage to bare hull with no resists, nothing higher, nothing lower. Say on a crit, each will do 100k.

If you have say...10% chance to crit. Now if you crit the initial launch, great, that's four mines of 100k each. But if you don't, that's only 4 mines of 20k each, and you have to wait 30-60 seconds to do it again.

However, fixing this bug might mean the loss of the super-huge spike damage due to the bug being gone, but you'd most likely see a general increase of damage, because each mine is seperate. Mine 1: 10% chance, Mine 2: 10% chance, Mine 3: 10% chance, Mine 4: 10% chance.

So that means you could do 80k damage with no crits, and 400k if all crit. But you could also do anything in between. Say 3 don't crit, that's 60k, but if the final one does, that is a big 100k still on top of that. In PvE, and PvP, that can still be a tremendous hit.

In turn, you might not be doing as much spike damage, but you would have more consistent damage over time, instead of the current extreme highs and lows. Which from what I can tell, is what Cryptic is wanting these to do.

This whole example is presuming a lot, like they don't get shot down, what kind of resists the person has, whether or not they actually DO hit something, and so on from there.

Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 81
# 38
02-03-2013, 02:01 AM
Garbage becuz spike damage is king and imagine the following: dropping 10 mines with a 10% crit chance means I will get 1 mine to crit, dropping sets of mines 10 times means that I have critted a total of 10 mines spread out across 2-3 minutes, which anybody can out heal. As is, once every 2-3 minutes I have a chance to crit an entire set of mines and seriously damage someone..... Not vaporize them but damage them enough that it is worthwhile to follow up with some sort of kill combo.
I don't pretend to know all the math, but the way I see it is mines and the breen trans torp should stay with the chain crit or I THINK they will become useless.
I could be wrong... But I think you are.
Commander
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 361
# 39
02-03-2013, 09:02 AM
its not op, its affected by doffs as well as the tricobalt torpedo does ( dont compare the cluster to a mine, because it is not a mine ) and the tricobalt torpedo is affected by skills, which the cluster isnt, its dmg is pretty inside the standards, but nothing compared to tricobalts, its still a targetable torpedo, so on my opinion it is not op.

if its chain crit is op ? hmm guess so, but its not only the cluster, its any chain crit, thats op, the chain crit, not the cluster
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 5,587
# 40
02-03-2013, 12:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mozoha View Post
Garbage becuz spike damage is king and imagine the following: dropping 10 mines with a 10% crit chance means I will get 1 mine to crit, dropping sets of mines 10 times means that I have critted a total of 10 mines spread out across 2-3 minutes, which anybody can out heal. As is, once every 2-3 minutes I have a chance to crit an entire set of mines and seriously damage someone..... Not vaporize them but damage them enough that it is worthwhile to follow up with some sort of kill combo.
I don't pretend to know all the math, but the way I see it is mines and the breen trans torp should stay with the chain crit or I THINK they will become useless.
I could be wrong... But I think you are.
It's very true how spike damage is king in this game, but that is also getting into another topic.

Well, if you drop 10 sets of mines, yes, on average you will get 10 mines to crit, or if you one-crit them all, you will get 10 all at once. But in an open PvP, like Ker'rat, who knows what could be happening though.

There's a lot of things in there (Ker'rat), primarily other players and the Borg. Often times people are alone as well. As such, some people may not have the heals (escorts most of the time) to handle that, especially if they have been attacked by others or the Borg.

In a decent PvP match between two teams (regardless of the match type), it can just be out-healed, true, but it can be potent to keep a dedicated healer healing themselves, preventing heals on other people.

I use normal transphasics, transphasic mines, and the Breen cluster torp on my B'rel in Ker'rat all the time. I don't always get kills with the Cluster torp, but I can often times really lay a quick hurting on someone if I time it right, and will keep up on a person, holding the pressure and such.

All of this is even without the chain-critting.

Now the only real way of knowing who is 'right' isn't this discussion, we'll only really see if and when they actually fix the chain-critting issue. Only then we will see just how mines are affected, for good or ill.

Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:53 PM.