Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 12,165
# 11
02-07-2013, 05:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by emoejoe View Post
Strangely enough math is purportedly mine. I have spent many hours elucidating math noobs on the merits of algebra over trial and error. And frankly thats what alot of this game is about. Meta-game.

Figuring out what should happen is part 1, executing a plan is part 2.

As someone who has been calling out "dps" types for years, Ive said all along this game is about meaningful burst damage, even if that means very slow refresh or recycle times. Thus making damage per second is lower.

And of course dont forget that the battle situation is what determines the necessary required "burst" to down a specific target. Their current heals being obvious, the overall battle position being more relevant.

To answer how much dps you need to know who when where and why. God knows most bug ships flown by good players have many more "skillpoints" into defensive measures than offensive. There base tac skills and crf is "usually" enough.

But behold the awesome power of an uber alpha bop, and you will know that dps is moot for all but that one second when he killed you.
I guess part of this is the stigma attached to the term DPS. I'm using it at it's most basic, most literal sense.

If it's a case of saying that you need to do 80k damage in 2-4 seconds - then that's saying you need 20-40k DPS. Just something along those lines... just the damage over the period of delivery. Not some parse from 5-10minutes in an STF or anything like that.

For the most part, what I'm seeing is that it's got almost nothing to do with DHCs as much as it is about two Sci and 3-4 guys hitting you at the same time with whatever they've got.

Which is why I'm looking for that perspective - those numbers - in regard to the necessity of DHCs. Cause it's looking mainly like DBBs and THY Torps are putting out the most damage while everything else is just something to do while waiting on the BO/THY CDs and the Sci to set up the kill.
Maal, Klingon, Mogh - Vegar, Orion, Marauder - R'ebel, Romulan, Haakona
Willard the Rat, Reman, F.T'varo - Rave, J.Trill, Kar'Fi - Mysk, Gorn, Varanus
Kopor, Nausicaan, Guramba - Nivuh, Ferasan, B'rel - Venit, Lethean, M.Qin
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 269
# 12
02-07-2013, 06:13 PM
There are some moments when a player is beating on you and you think to yourself, "Ow, Owww, OWWW!" *boom*

That's dps
K'eg/T'lol/Dude/Yak
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,679
# 13
02-07-2013, 06:15 PM
Yeah, or you're about to click and you're dead.

Damn Cryptic UI.


Click here and here if you are interested in learning more about PvP.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,455
# 14
02-07-2013, 06:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by virusdancer View Post
This is from three CnH. I had spent two hours earlier in Ker'rat (split between both sides), but that was...well, pointless.

It's from my incoming damage - just for DHCs.

Average
MinHit
MaxHit

Dual Heavy Antiproton Cannons
556.88
58
1,319

Dual Heavy Antiproton Cannons: Rapid Fire I
1,096.92
176
1,757

Dual Heavy Antiproton Cannons: Rapid Fire II
908.68
154
2,475

Dual Heavy Disruptor Cannons
332.59
31
1,375

Dual Heavy Disruptor Cannons: Rapid Fire I
677.25
55
1,066

Dual Heavy Disruptor Cannons: Rapid Fire II
340.00
52
750

Dual Heavy Phased Polaron Cannons
602.90
21
2,318

Dual Heavy Phased Polaron Cannons: Rapid Fire I
581.87
29
3,915

Dual Heavy Phased Polaron Cannons: Rapid Fire III
739.78
41
4,969

Dual Heavy Phased Tetryon Cannons
581.31
74
2,543

Dual Heavy Phased Tetryon Cannons: Rapid Fire II
543.31
81
2,406

Dual Heavy Phased Tetryon Cannons: Rapid Fire III
797.59
107
1,903

Dual Heavy Phaser Cannons
387.30
61
1,109

Dual Heavy Phaser Cannons: Rapid Fire I
629.00
52
1,127

Dual Heavy Polarized Disruptor Cannons
459.50
69
1,391

Dual Heavy Polarized Disruptor Cannons: Scatter Volley I
556.50
109
1,183

Dual Heavy Tetryon Cannons
498.06
49
2,148

Dual Heavy Tetryon Cannons: Rapid Fire I
628.00
145
1,111

Dual Heavy Tetryon Cannons: Rapid Fire II
247.75
36
557

Dual Heavy Tetryon Cannons: Rapid Fire III
504.88
73
1,215

They all just seem low to me, kind of very low. They're better than what Ker'rat showed, but they're just low. The closest one to what I was expecting was the CRF3 Phased Polaron DHC hit for 4969.

So I check his hits with it (and lucky me was the highest), but his numbers were:

750.57
38
4,969 (yeah, lucky me)

Thing is, his next highest hit (lucky me again) was only 2,868. Have to figure that almost 5k shot landed when I was tractored, debuffed to Hell, etc, etc.

The largest hit I took was a 13k crit from BO2 Phased Polaron DBB (from the same guy).

For what I was expecting (5k+), I took the following:

1x THY1 Photon
1x TS1 Quantum
4x Isometric
1x BO3 Disruptor DBB
3x BO2 Phased Polaron DBB
5x BO3 Phased Polaron DBB

So 15 5k+ hits.
10k+: 2
9-10k 0
8-9k: 2
7-8k: 4
6-7k: 3
5-6k: 4

Out of 9743 hits it says I took.

For Beam Arrays (not including DBBs, just Arrays), for those that might be curious for a comparison - this is a quick rundown on the Avg/Max Array damage I took:

Disruptor: 224/1338
Disruptor BO1: 1586/2764
Disruptor BO3: 1748/2996
Disruptor FAW2: 263/1348
Phased Tetryon: 179/1149
Phaser: 163/836
Polaron: 165/758
Polaron FAW2: 246/981
Romulan Plasma: 275/1175
Romulan Plasma Hull Melt: 724/1443 (is that the 3pc Harness when you've got the Experimental?)

So like I said earlier, the numbers for those DHCs seem way too low.

What kind of numbers (no, doesn't have to be all pretty and crap) are folks seeing with their DHCs and the hits they're taking from DHCs?
As you mention it gets more complicated.

For example, I've been messing w/a Voquv using 4x beam arrays @ minimum power just for procs/tssx. Anyone doing this or similar w/turrets and crf/cvs for the proc spam will scew your numbers.

On the otherhand, in a cloaked ship I'll prebuff, mostly outside of 10, decloak , then Tb then alpha. CRF and DCHs front loads a volley which will usually strip shields. This is b/c so many hits occur in a very short time frame. So while per shot damage is lower, it's basically a spike ability w/the high rate of fire.

Beams have slower firing, higher damage per shot (not per volley). Compare DHCs to Dual Beams and you'll see this. It's why BO is so effective at spike damage.

But, I think for PvP the answer is something a team decides unless it's for 1v1s or PuG builds which would be different than a premade vs premade.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,757
# 15
02-07-2013, 07:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtheyak View Post
there Are Some Moments When A Player Is Beating On You And You Think To Yourself, "ow, Owww, Owww!" *boom*

That's Dps :d
Lmaorotfatpms.
Roy Hatch (stryker) soldier, friend, and good man.
1945-2014
RIP
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 269
# 16
02-07-2013, 07:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoge00f View Post
Yeah, or you're about to click and you're dead.
lol clicking

jk
K'eg/T'lol/Dude/Yak
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,441
# 17
02-07-2013, 08:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoge00f View Post
Yeah, or you're about to click and you're dead.

Damn Cryptic UI.
Or when you click a defensive power that WILL save you..but it hangs for the second you needed it to fire off and you die..

One thing I am also wondering..

IF some one were to Decloak at full evasive, Unloading DHC shots from -10k and reaching 4k before the shots even hit and fire another volley.. is the game properly tracking the damage from the first volley from under 10k.. or is it reading the damage from when you reach 4k and fire your second volley as if you were at 4k out when you fired your first volley?

For example:

A Bird of Prey Decloaks at 9.5km away from a target, Rapid Fire 2 Omega 3 Fires the first volley as they Evasive Maneuvers Bull rushes a target, activating Tractor beam to hold a target at just in 4.9km and Stops at 3.5k to fire a second volley so that both volleys will hit at the same time. (NOTE: No this is not a trolling or joking question, it is a serious and worrisome thought.)
You think that your beta test was bad?
Think about this:
American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,540
# 18
02-07-2013, 08:42 PM
i finally got so tired of dieing from fail clicks, i started using key binds. as a secondary benefit, it massively quickens buff stacking both offensively and defensibly, and made me significantly better. simply because the ui lag is sooooo bad.
gateway links-->Norvo Tigan, Telis Latto Ruwon, Sochie Heim, Solana Soleus
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,679
# 19
02-07-2013, 08:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobtheyak View Post
lol clicking

jk

I swear I use all binds. I was thinking of Hilbert. Hehe.


Click here and here if you are interested in learning more about PvP.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,441
# 20
02-07-2013, 10:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by snoge00f View Post
I swear I use all binds. I was thinking of Hilbert. Hehe.
"I don't always use Keybinds.. But when I do. I use Hilbert's.."~Most interesting man in the world
You think that your beta test was bad?
Think about this:
American Football has been in open beta for 144 years. ~Kotaku
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:08 PM.