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Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 12,816
# 11
02-12-2013, 04:33 PM
First...a disclaimer: I LOVE PLASMA!

Ahem, no - really I do. It's insane how many PDoTs you can load somebody up with from a combination of Omega, Hyper-Plasma, Regular Plasma Torps, Plasma Mines, Energy Weapons, and EWP. And they suffer from the one crit-chain crit with each PDoT (you're Omega's crit isn't going to crit your Hyper's - but if your Omega PDoT crits...and with how high you can get crit these days - mmmmm, yummy!)...

If HE wasn't already in the game, folks would be begging for something like it to be added.

Against a normal person running HE - let them. I'm spamming so much plasma in my wee tank Battle Cruiser...let them. Now then, if they're one of those AtB junkies...you're going to run into problems. If they've got friends with HE's to spare...you're going to run into problems.

It's either oozing that hot awesomesauce...or you better have a backup plan, because on the ladder of usefulness - you still haven't found the ladder yet otherwise.

Which...is a problem with a lot of things in STO. It's ON or it's OFF - there's no happy medium - Hell, there's no middleground at all. It's ON or it's OFF.

It's not just a problem with HE. It's a problem with all the cleanses. And it's not just a problem with cleanses, it's also a problem with SNB.

Just like a cleanse shouldn't be a complete cleanse, SNB shouldn't be a complete strip. It makes these abilities too powerful. They should cleanse X-Y debuffs and SNB should strip X-Y buffs. Maybe make the different levels cleanse more - maybe have SNB DOFFs that give the chance to strip more.

I shouldn't be able to cook people willy nilly with my Plasma...I agree with that completely. At the same time, my brothers - should they be able shut me down completely? Think about the other cleanses - you put all that effort (heck, your team may have put all that effort) into dropping a buttload of debuffs on them...they clear it all away with some little Ensign BOFF ability that they didn't have to spend a single skill point on to ruin all your fun? Think about SNB - you put all that effort (heck, your team may have put all that effort) into buffing up your lil' hunk 'o junk 'n space...to have some Bill Nye come along and strip that all away?

Hell no, I say... make it so cleanses only cleanse X-Y debuffs and SNB only strips X-Y buffs. Make it so they only remove a limited number of what's going on - do you catch what I'm going on about?

We need to move away from this it's ON or it's OFF nonsense...am I right?

edit: BTW, if you're parsing your PDoTs with STOICs or ACT...well, unless they've been updated since this http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/sh...d.php?t=514751 back on Feb 6th...then you're not parsing your PDoTs with STOICs or ACT. Break out the Notepad++ and LibreOffice Calc or Excel...

Cryptic needs to write the log better so the guys working on the parsers have an easier go at it...meh.
Maal, Klingon, Mogh - Vegar, Orion, Marauder - Rave, J.Trill, Kar'Fi - Mysk, Gorn, Varanus
Kopor, Nausicaan, Guramba - Nivuh, Ferasan, B'rel - Venit, Lethean, M.Qin

Last edited by virusdancer; 02-12-2013 at 04:56 PM.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 4,787
# 12
02-12-2013, 07:16 PM
Please, don't shout "ur just a whiney tac!". But I have to voice my say as an escort captain. I seriously don't need my friends setting new records on how fast they can melt my 44k hull through full shields with the conga line of plasma spam. It's bad enough that I can't defend against something I can't even do anything about. HE only lasts so long.

Also, as mentioned above subnuc shouldn't completely strip my alpha strike. Then I'm essentially just a roast waiting to be thrown on the plasma grill. So if you reduce the effectiveness of HE, my only way of prolonging my inevitable death by fire, then I might as well not battle. And having subnuc take it away altogether is not fun.

One OP way after another of completely wrecking eachother. Maybe I'm at a disadvantage by sticking to the ol' escort way of just loading up as much tactical power as I can. Maybe it really is that I just can't do anything against plasma. If you're trying to bring balance, nerfing HE is not the way to do it. Now there is a whole lot else that needs to be balanced, but let's not get into that now.


I went through some kind of ramble here about plasma, but I underlined the main point.
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Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 959
# 13
02-13-2013, 06:49 AM
With only 22k hull in my BoP, I thing plasma is quite strong enough, thank you.
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 14
02-13-2013, 06:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shar487a View Post
2) Plasma fires are instantly removed by any Hazard Emitters

If you force your target or their team mate to waste an HE (45s CD) on a plasma fire that came "free" from a 2.5% chance to proc that required no other effort, then you have clearly won the exchange.

Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 303
# 15
02-13-2013, 08:39 AM
I think that in this moment in game everybody would need as much HE can load .
Plasma is quite strong in this moment and ships specialized in plasma make fast kills.
Sometimes I have to run away and try to heal because I was hit twice or thrice by plasma and I have just one HE.

To balance plasma versus HE in my opinion would mean that everybody would get a supplemental HE beside the one it already has.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,201
# 16
02-13-2013, 09:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ussultimatum View Post
If you force your target or their team mate to waste an HE (45s CD) on a plasma fire that came "free" from a 2.5% chance to proc that required no other effort, then you have clearly won the exchange.
Plasma procs do not occur frequently enough to generate sufficient plasma fire stacks needed to actually threaten a ship unless it has already taken significant hull damage.

Large plasma fire stacks are usually delivered by plasma torpedoes, and these slow projectiles are easily avoided or shot down.

The only reliable high damage plasma-fire dot in the game at this time is the Hyperflux firing mode of the Romulan Experimental Beam Array.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,360
# 17
02-13-2013, 09:10 AM
Meh, just slap on some Mk XII Electroceramic Hull Plating under a Mk XII Maco shield, and let it burn. I fly around engulfed in green flames more often than not.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,201
# 18
02-13-2013, 09:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dova25 View Post
I think that in this moment in game everybody would need as much HE can load .
Plasma is quite strong in this moment and ships specialized in plasma make fast kills.
Sometimes I have to run away and try to heal because I was hit twice or thrice by plasma and I have just one HE.

To balance plasma versus HE in my opinion would mean that everybody would get a supplemental HE beside the one it already has.
Thanks for this tid-bit... I'll run more plasma in PVP and see how it goes. The few times that I did fight using my breen plasma ship, the results were acceptable but not stellar.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 19
02-13-2013, 09:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shar487a View Post
Plasma procs do not occur frequently enough to generate sufficient plasma fire stacks needed to actually threaten a ship unless it has already taken significant hull damage.
I think we can safely say that's the case for every proc that is not Phaser.

This was also not your original premise, your original premise was how easily plasma procs are healed by HE.


As far as I'm concerned weapon procs should be relegated to harassment effects and not dramatic effects (which phasers are guilty of).


So while I agree on some of the points you brought up about passive healing and plasma procs being generally low damage from energy weapons, I see nothing wrong with how HE currently clears plasma procs.

Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,123
# 20
02-13-2013, 11:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shar487a View Post
Plasma procs do not occur frequently enough to generate sufficient plasma fire stacks needed to actually threaten a ship unless it has already taken significant hull damage.

Large plasma fire stacks are usually delivered by plasma torpedoes, and these slow projectiles are easily avoided or shot down.

The only reliable high damage plasma-fire dot in the game at this time is the Hyperflux firing mode of the Romulan Experimental Beam Array.
No, seriously. I should introduce you to my fleetmate.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ussultimatum View Post
I think we can safely say that's the case for every proc that is not Phaser.

This was also not your original premise, your original premise was how easily plasma procs are healed by HE.


As far as I'm concerned weapon procs should be relegated to harassment effects and not dramatic effects (which phasers are guilty of).


So while I agree on some of the points you brought up about passive healing and plasma procs being generally low damage from energy weapons, I see nothing wrong with how HE currently clears plasma procs.
There's nothing wrong with phasers. What they shutdown is completely random and there's an immunity for 5 seconds. There is also no stacking of system shutdowns. In effect, once a subsystem is shutdown, there's a 10 second immunity to additional system shutdowns.

If there's any weapon type to complain about, it is Polarons. There's a reason why they are referred to as "lolarons".

http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/sh...hlight=polaron
http://sto.perfectworld.com/news/?p=685121

It gets a bonus from Flow Capacitors. Has a 5 second drain duration with no immunity after those 5 seconds. The duration drain has a limited stack (note, the notes do not say it cannot stack or can only stack once...just that it has a limited stack). It also has an instant drain that has no stack limits.

Power Insulators will not help you with all of those drains hitting you at the same time. You can easily shut down 2 or 3 subsystems.

Last edited by shookyang; 02-13-2013 at 11:19 AM.
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