Ensign
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4
So the short story is that I have been reading and researching for days trying to make a viable end game character and am overloaded with opinion but no fact or clear path. My main is a Sci and I bought an Atrox. It turns like a oil tanker. The Eng console for faster turning lets it turn like a submarine. I loaded up all turrets so I could fire no matter where my oil tanker might be facing but it kills my dps. The fighters seem to do less than stellar damage. I thought about saving up for a bunch of cutting beams since they drop 300dps base but I know that consoles will not increase thier damage so maybe no such a good investment. I also leveld up an Eng thinking that might be a better class (ground combat for sure), but my Eng gets pwnd more than my sci.

I am flexible. I can take criticism. I have tons of MMO exp. I have intelligence. I can afford zen. But our fleet is just getting started; we only just hit T1. What I don't have is a clear cut method for being productive in STFs so as to not drag down my fellow players (fleet friends or otherwise).

I keep reading that despite best efforts for equal capabilities, DPS trumps all else. Do I kick my eng and sci and roll up a tac? It is bad to fly a sci/eng in an escort? Can someone tell me which ship really is the "best"? I know people say its all style, but I need some direction. MVAE and tetryons? Atrox with cutting lasers? Dreadnaught (did they add in saucer sep yet) with cannons, spinal and some consoles for turn speed? Chimera with its Lotus and lots of phasers? Pay someone to let me build a fleet ship?

In short, I am getting frustrated and my brain is melting. I am fearful of spending real money on ships that suck (my Atrox is a little disappointing) or wasting time getting Omega marks for my sci captain if I need to roll a tacital captain. Time efficiency is important (wife and kid) so I need a very specific, direct path.

Thank you so much everyone!

PS: I am not posting my stats or loadout on purpose. Because they undoubtedly suck.
Career Officer
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 89
# 2 Toon Builds
02-18-2013, 02:04 PM
OK so I run a TAC, and an ENG in a TAC ship build, however I also have a fleetmate that won't touch TAC with a ten foot pole and is great in STFs with a Sci or an Eng.

so what I know of the Atrox is Make use of your pets, use the targeting subsystems ability on the cubes, but is useless on like generators, gateways, etc.

Beams are your best weapon, of any energy type you like. Limited turn rate lends to broadside attacks. Throw a tac team and beam overload in your TAC slots, depending on what you choose for eng and sci abilities.

Reminder, only one Borg Cutting Beam can be put on a ship at a time, so no need to buy more than one.

Spec your captain into sci abilities that drain shields, repulse isn't bad either especially in STFs. Let the TACs use their DPS to blow the ships to pieces, but use your SCI abilities to give them the extra time (repulsars), or drop the tragets shields to open up the hull.

The Atrox carrier is sexy, yes, but also a viable option to fly in STFs, if you know what you're doing.
Ensign
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4
# 3
02-18-2013, 02:17 PM
Thanks Franc, that information is very useful. But I could really use some more direct examples, and not necessarily related to the Atrox. I dont mind flying it but I can buy something else from C-Store if need be.

So let me clarify what I am hoping to learn here:
1. Should I dump efforts in sci/eng and roll a tac chatacter? Levelling is pretty easy so it wont take long to do this, but dont want to waste the effort if its unecessary.
2. Can a sci fly an escort as well as a tac? Are there any unusualy combinations like an eng in a sci ship that make for great capability?
3. Should I pony up some bucks and buy an MVAE, Dread, or buy a lifetime to get a Chimera?
4. Is all of the above worthless compared to high end fleet gear?
5. Can someone offer a good character build for sci (or eng/tac)?
6. Can someone tell me what are the 'must-haves' in terms of consoles and weapons?
7. Can we put that all the above together to make a viable play strategy (inc skill rotations)?
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,001
# 4
02-18-2013, 02:53 PM
Ok, lot of questions, will try to answer them one by one. Disclaimer: like you already said, playstyle and preferences matter. I love my Fed-side sci, because I think their escort-style and cruisers get boring soon. I also love my KDF tacs and sci's, including some cruiser play, as their ships have different features to shake things up.

Now then.

1. Should I dump efforts in sci/eng and roll a tac chatacter? Levelling is pretty easy so it wont take long to do this, but dont want to waste the effort if its unecessary.
- No. I would say get the 4 extra character slots and roll one of each. Best decision I ever made in this game: all 6 play completely different, and this way I can switch around between completely different specs and ships easily and without extra costs.

Having said that, dps is the most important thing around, yes, but science skills and abilities can make stf's a whole lot easier for entire teams - I've never had people complain. If you're going for Eng, make sure you include points in Threat Generation, if you want to make friends in stf's: those escorts are squishy, and a good tank is worth its weight in dilithium.

2. Can a sci fly an escort as well as a tac? Are there any unusualy combinations like an eng in a sci ship that make for great capability?
- Yes and no. A sci will never reach the same dps as a tac in the same escort, but gets neat debuffing tricks in return. Do you prefer a straight-up +50-80% damage, or an AoE -60-80 damage reduction, from which your team benefits too? Eng in a sci ship makes her more durable, sci in a cruiser adds debuffing. Try the mirror ships on the exchange, I recommend. They cost like 200k EC and allow you to mix and match, see which fits you best. You can get all lvl 40 free fed ships and some KDF ships that way.

3. Should I pony up some bucks and buy an MVAE, Dread, or buy a lifetime to get a Chimera?
- See previous point. See which kinds of ship you like first, and remember that the upgrades are not game-shattering. Once you know how you want to fly, you can always upgrade. For my fed sci and tac, though, I'm currently considering the tactical Vesta, as a dps/science vessel. I also own the Dread, but that is... a tricky one. Not as easy to fly well, suffers from some flaws. If you want a tactical cruiser, maybe look at the Regent, or, if willing to get the 3-pack, the tactical Odyssey with Chevron Separation for great turn rate. MVAE is the escort to beat for sci's, for now, pending the Andorian one launching this week.

However, and I feel I need to stress this: you do not NEED to shell out big bucks to be effective in STF's. Stock lvl 40 level-up ships will get you a long way, at least until you know what you feel comfortable doing.

4. Is all of the above worthless compared to high end fleet gear?
- No. C-store stuff isn't all that worst than fleet stuff, and the difference between regular rare or very rare exchange stuff isn't relevant for PvE, really. Maybe for high-end PvP, but even then, regular mk xi or xii purples do just fine.

5. Can someone offer a good character build for sci (or eng/tac)?
- Will edit one in later, just a moment. Edit: http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skil...ild=sargetip_0

6. Can someone tell me what are the 'must-haves' in terms of consoles and weapons?
- Neutronium alloy engineering consoles. Boost resistance to all damage types. Tac consoles: use strictly consoles boosting the damage type of your energy types, all the way. Weapons, hm. For escorts, 3 DHC's and a quantum torp or 4 DHCs fore, turrets aft. Cruisers: single cannons/DBB's/beam arrays fore, beam arrays/turrets back, potentially with one torp fore and aft. Sci vessels I'd recommend at least one beam for subsystem targetting, and definitely atorpedo. Energy types are your pick, but always use just one type at a time.

7. Can we put that all the above together to make a viable play strategy (inc skill rotations)?
- See boff layout under 5, for an example.
Generally: run tactical team to redistribute shields, whenever under fire, and heal those shields with emergency power to shields (and potentially reverse shield polarity and/or transfer shield strength). Be wary of Eng and Sci teams, as they put your tac team on cooldown, leaving you vulnerable. For sci ships: use crowd control skills to benefit your team and heal when able. Grav well stuff together for torp spreads and team mates, repulsor borg units approaching mission-critical points.

The character sheet at point 5 is aimed at science vessels, but with the option of effectively flying carriers, cruisers and escorts too. The ship is a general lvl 40 free ship, available on the exchange in a mirror variant cheaply. It is a good ship, as are the other cheap mirror ships. They just don't come with the fancy consoles c-store ships tend to feature, or the buff to shields and hull that some fleet ships get. You can, however, do great in these "free" ships in stf's, and give you an idea of where to spend your money on. Don't like the cruisers? Don't get a dreadnought. Don't like the sci ships after all? Don't get a Vesta or Wells. Escort play not appealing? You get it by now

Footnote: I do not profess to know everything, nor am I a min-maxer for dps, per se. I do fly all careers and ship types, and have been doing so for the past year. All to good effect in elite STF's and, sometimes, pug PvP. Many people around here are way more experienced than me, and may give different advice - just compare notes, check the wiki (linked under the community tab of this website and the homepage) and go with what seems right. I can be wrong, I make mistakes, and most of this is based on own experience and loyal forum-browsing.

Last edited by twam; 02-18-2013 at 03:26 PM.
Ensign
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4
# 5
02-18-2013, 03:42 PM
Thanks Twam very informative. Looks like the MM series was what I should have considered from the get go ... part carrier, all science and way better manuverability so I can mount something with a bit more of a punch than turrets ...
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 38
# 6 The real kicker is...
02-18-2013, 04:05 PM
What do you want to do wiht this?

Do you want ot have nice big numbers flashing?
Do you want to take massive amounts of damage?
Do you want to make ppl throw things at the screen?

That is the key.

Form the get go you went atrox, (interesting concept) agian you can mount DCH but you really have to base the build around those cannons.

Sci/scorts, can do well, but Ive never outpaced an actully tact/tact before in terms of dps.

Dps does trump, its a design flaw in alot of games.
Now I would say , why not hucker down and get, stuff like:

Atrox 5km sphere attaks:

Pet; purple runabouts
weapons...phasers or phasred polarn beams (accx2 or acc/crth)
lt tact:
TT1
FAW2 or BO
LCT Eng:
EMPtW 1 and EmPtS 2
DEM2 (or your prenfece)
LCT sci:
TB1, TsS2, CPB2
Commander sci:
TB1, HE2, TTS3, GW3
(you could double up on TTS3, and spawm EMptW 1 and 2)

As you can see its not strightforawd dps, but it would alow you to do some aoe damage, while being able to prove extra support with the shield removale.)

this is the main issue with most science builds, many play mutlti-alts, and most will go tact, cause its pretty much push 3-4 buttions im done, sci, is more like chianing attacks, you do 1,4,3, then 5, for prefered effect.
Ensign
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4
# 7
02-19-2013, 10:15 AM
Brish ... why runabouts?

I have been reading forums and everyone says to use one of adv stalkers and one of adv peregrines. Do runabouts provide something else other than the holds from tractor and chronotons?

Also, I cannot seem to find, ANYWHERE, a post or guide that shows the dps of various hangars. I see some estimations and guesses based on play trials, but nothing concrete like with weapons. Its hard to estimate the value of hangars without hard data. I think I also read that hangars do not benefit from tac consoles, and other posts that say they do ... Same for shield repair units - how much shields per second do they heal? All facings at once or just one. If ts just one is it based on the arc where the drone is at or the lowest shield value? So shield heals increase if the shield capacity is lower (e.g. diminishing returns on shield facings over 75%)?

Also dont Delta flyers have better shield strip abilities, or is that still broke?

Many questions. Few answers.
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 959
# 8
02-19-2013, 10:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sarqe View Post
Do runabouts provide something else other than the holds from tractor and chronitons?
Those are priceless...

The other hangar stuuf is fairly useless compared to that.
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 38
# 9 Why you ask..
02-21-2013, 11:51 AM
Stakers are only useable in the Atrox, pergrines can do dps, IF you keep them alive, flyers drain is only usefull *if* you are going for shield drain. So out of that mess what works the best with the strox...runabouts, why, they're ulitity to the Atrox. That is Unless you find a way to do damage with a boat that hasa turn rate of...5.


As to the guide, wont ever find one...why blaim the in game tooltips. Yes they are effect by consoles, but you better off downloading act with the sto plugin for that honestly.

Really at this point (and im reading between the lines + asuming on this) but I would just say you know what, drop in a escort, its fairly simple to master, dont have to think about anything, and would give you the best in terms of raw damage. (In fact I still prefer my mobuis for that reguard, I use my vesta for my team surport).
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