Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,123
# 281
03-05-2013, 09:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by unheard1978 View Post
with season 7s new updates to sets and weapons and fleet weapons is there any way to add them to this torpedo boat ?

also with the hull being so weak is it worth putting skill points into the hull and Armor Reinforcements as i know a lot of science ship people don't ?

where do you slot your rom and omega torpedoes fore and aft or one at each end ?

http://www.stoacademy.com/tools/skil...orpedoboat_993
Huh...your build is very similar to my old build...right down to the one point into Warp Core Efficiency. Actually, I'd say it is exactly the same as my old build.

Yes, it's worth putting points into hull and armor. The times that you're fired on while decloaked help keep you alive. I've taken on a two volleys from an all cannon Defiant and made it out alive with over 50% hull. This was before I respeced.

I'd suggest changing some of your skill point distributions. Namely, reduce Armor Reinforcement to 4 and put 6 points into Threat Control. Also, I moved the one point in Warp Core Efficiency to Subsystem Repair. Why Threat Control? Well, it also gives you a boost to your resistance for both kinetic and energy. It's less, but once you start getting to a certain point in Armor Reinforcement, it is cheaper to put points in Threat Control and you get a better increase in kinetic/energy resistance. To get a better idea, check out this: http://home.comcast.net/~amicus/Skil...%20Effects.htm

I use Advanced Fleet Quantum torpedoes for now. Otherwise, I use Bio-Neural Warhead, Breen Cluster torpedo, and Hargh'Peng in the fore. On the aft, I use Omega and a Chroniton torpedo with [crth][crtd]x2.

It's really up to you on where you want to put your torpedoes, but just remember that you decloak when you fire. The rapid fire rate of the Omega and Hyper torpedoes will not allow you to recloak.
Survivor of Remus
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 132
# 282
03-05-2013, 10:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shookyang View Post
Huh...your build is very similar to my old build...right down to the one point into Warp Core Efficiency. Actually, I'd say it is exactly the same as my old build.

Yes, it's worth putting points into hull and armor. The times that you're fired on while decloaked help keep you alive. I've taken on a two volleys from an all cannon Defiant and made it out alive with over 50% hull. This was before I respeced.

I'd suggest changing some of your skill point distributions. Namely, reduce Armor Reinforcement to 4 and put 6 points into Threat Control. Also, I moved the one point in Warp Core Efficiency to Subsystem Repair. Why Threat Control? Well, it also gives you a boost to your resistance for both kinetic and energy. It's less, but once you start getting to a certain point in Armor Reinforcement, it is cheaper to put points in Threat Control and you get a better increase in kinetic/energy resistance. To get a better idea, check out this: http://home.comcast.net/~amicus/Skil...%20Effects.htm

I use Advanced Fleet Quantum torpedoes for now. Otherwise, I use Bio-Neural Warhead, Breen Cluster torpedo, and Hargh'Peng in the fore. On the aft, I use Omega and a Chroniton torpedo with [crth][crtd]x2.

It's really up to you on where you want to put your torpedoes, but just remember that you decloak when you fire. The rapid fire rate of the Omega and Hyper torpedoes will not allow you to recloak.
forgive me shookyang it is your build. all thanks goes to you. ( old post has been edited )

please can you tell me were would you place the Hyper-plasma torpedo fore or aft and what space set Romulan Prototype/Reman Prototype or Honor Guard would you use with the new weapons ?
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,123
# 283
03-05-2013, 02:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by unheard1978 View Post
forgive me shookyang it is your build. all thanks goes to you. ( old post has been edited )

please can you tell me were would you place the Hyper-plasma torpedo fore or aft and what space set Romulan Prototype/Reman Prototype or Honor Guard would you use with the new weapons ?
No problem. I initially thought that it was just a coincidence.

Before I answer your question, I should first explain why I use my torpedoes in the arrangement that they are in. Of all of my fore torpedoes, only the Quantums will befit from torpedo abilities. This is by design.

If I were to go with Hyper-plasma and change how I attack with my B'rel, I would probably keep the Quantum, Bio-Neural, Omega, and Hargh'Peng in the fore. With the Hyper-plasma and Breen Cluster in the aft. That, or put the Hargh'Peng or Bio-Neural in the aft and put the Hyper-plasma in the fore.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 5,836
# 284
03-05-2013, 02:11 PM
Fellow warriors, I have a question about the B'rel for you.

I have been more of a battlecruiser man myslef, but I'm changing my game a bit lately trying out smaller more nimble ships.
So, I'm getting the B'rel, what better there is to get a different angle of STO than on this classic that has a specific style of play

I was wondering, since I have max level tacs. and eng. captains, which class would be better off with the B'rel and is the engineer viable to use it or loses a lot on the damage that the tac. skills would bring to the table?
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,123
# 285
03-05-2013, 03:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shpoks View Post
Fellow warriors, I have a question about the B'rel for you.

I have been more of a battlecruiser man myslef, but I'm changing my game a bit lately trying out smaller more nimble ships.
So, I'm getting the B'rel, what better there is to get a different angle of STO than on this classic that has a specific style of play

I was wondering, since I have max level tacs. and eng. captains, which class would be better off with the B'rel and is the engineer viable to use it or loses a lot on the damage that the tac. skills would bring to the table?
Both could use it. But, I'd say stick with tactical. You really need the boost in damage to punch through the shields.

Also, if you're careful, the chances of you getting decloaked are pretty slim. As such, I can survive on just Aux2SIF1, HE2, and Engineering Team 1.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,241
# 286
03-05-2013, 05:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shookyang View Post
Namely, reduce Armor Reinforcement to 4 and put 6 points into Threat Control. Also, I moved the one point in Warp Core Efficiency to Subsystem Repair. Why Threat Control? Well, it also gives you a boost to your resistance for both kinetic and energy. It's less, but once you start getting to a certain point in Armor Reinforcement, it is cheaper to put points in Threat Control and you get a better increase in kinetic/energy resistance....
That's not very wise imo. Threat control does give you resists..yes.. a minimum amount (even devs stated this was so) but it also makes you the primary target of any npc around.

Problem with that? NPCs insta-target and insta-fire weapons..meaning torpedoes... at you. They fire the torpedo when they detect a shield is down and decloaking = shields down.

Threat control is the absolute worst thing you can put in a bird of prey. Any bird of prey.

Also, you do need good warp core skills... it boosts your engine and aux power levels and you do need those a lot. If you're worried about kinetic resist then equip polarize hull and aux to dampeners. You also have brace for impact... they will last long enough for you to recloak.

Quote:
It's really up to you on where you want to put your torpedoes, but just remember that you decloak when you fire. The rapid fire rate of the Omega and Hyper torpedoes will not allow you to recloak.
only if you have them on autofire. due to the cloak animation delay you will not re-cloak in a brel until 5 seconds have passed (1s decloak delay, 3 seconds timer to re-cloak, 1s delay as ship re-cloaks). Romulan boff reduces this a lot. Since you have 1s global timer on torps you need at least 4 seconds to dump all your torps out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shpoks View Post
Fellow warriors, I have a question about the B'rel for you.

I have been more of a battlecruiser man myslef, but I'm changing my game a bit lately trying out smaller more nimble ships.
So, I'm getting the B'rel, what better there is to get a different angle of STO than on this classic that has a specific style of play

I was wondering, since I have max level tacs. and eng. captains, which class would be better off with the B'rel and is the engineer viable to use it or loses a lot on the damage that the tac. skills would bring to the table?
Tac and Sci are viable. engineer is terrible in a b'rel. no abilities of it benefit the ship's offensive torpedo abilities... and you aint tanking in a bird of prey.

sci is only useful for support services in brel or bleedthrough specs (dual stacked sensor scan and beta3).
http://media.tumblr.com/160cacdb395f8340dac90864182ebe16/tumblr_inline_mx9yxhItkb1qg9pkt.jpg
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,123
# 287
03-06-2013, 01:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrskyfaller View Post
That's not very wise imo. Threat control does give you resists..yes.. a minimum amount (even devs stated this was so) but it also makes you the primary target of any npc around.

Problem with that? NPCs insta-target and insta-fire weapons..meaning torpedoes... at you. They fire the torpedo when they detect a shield is down and decloaking = shields down.

Threat control is the absolute worst thing you can put in a bird of prey. Any bird of prey.
I didn't have any points in Threat Control until recently, and I was getting aggro all the time anyways. If I'm going to get it, I may as well get some better resists out of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrskyfaller View Post
Also, you do need good warp core skills... it boosts your engine and aux power levels and you do need those a lot. If you're worried about kinetic resist then equip polarize hull and aux to dampeners. You also have brace for impact... they will last long enough for you to recloak.
Warp Core Potential, yes, I agree. Warp Core Efficiency, I disagree. I do not need power into my shields or my weapons. Boosting power to subsystems with Efficiency. You can't go below 25, so there's no benefit with getting Efficiency. Which was why I suggested that they put that one skill point into something else.


Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrskyfaller View Post
only if you have them on autofire. due to the cloak animation delay you will not re-cloak in a brel until 5 seconds have passed (1s decloak delay, 3 seconds timer to re-cloak, 1s delay as ship re-cloaks). Romulan boff reduces this a lot. Since you have 1s global timer on torps you need at least 4 seconds to dump all your torps out.
Right now, those Romulan BOFFs are bugged. We don't know how well those BOFFs will work until they fix the perma-cloak bug.
Survivor of Romulus
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 5,836
# 288
03-06-2013, 01:52 AM
Ah, thanks for the info guys.

I must admit I kinda' saw that coming, but still I wanted to cross-check with someone that actually has the ship.
Well that's settled then, the eng. will keep to his Bortasqu'.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,241
# 289
03-06-2013, 01:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shookyang View Post
I didn't have any points in Threat Control until recently, and I was getting aggro all the time anyways. If I'm going to get it, I may as well get some better resists out of it.
What i'm trying to say here is that threat control gets you aggro from all npcs not just the one you happened to pop damage to and didnt kill in the first attack.

The AI functions in 'groups'. Each group of ships shares 'hate' and each individual ship has its own 'hate'.

With no threat control, if you hit NPC # 1 of 5 then you get a lot of hate from NPC #1 and some hate from #2->5.

With threat control #2->5 will get a lot of hate on you.

In a group, your team-mates will almost always grab hate from #2->5 just by shooting at one of them a few times...this is why when in a bird of prey when you cloak after an attack only the one you hit keeps a 'lock' on you for much longer than the others.

..but with threat control...the entire group will keep hate on you. They may switch their hate to another when you cloak but the instant you uncloak to attack they target and pop a torpedo your way.

If memory serves me right I think the resists you gained from 9 in threat control were equivalent to 5% across the board. Its not much. My VoQuv tank has threat control 9 and frankly im going to respec out of it if there are no game mechanic changes in may update... i was once able to tank the ISE gate, tac cube and 6 spheres with a fully dedicated shield tank monster setup (no damage, 2 shield drones wings healing me,etc) and my team loved me for it...but as of a few patches ago the borg are firing super-torpedoes and super-plasma heavy cannons shots (torps for 300k+ dmg and hvy plasma cannon hits for 10k to shields... its idiotic) that makes aggro-holding-heal-tanking absolutely impossible.

Quote:
Warp Core Potential, yes, I agree. Warp Core Efficiency, I disagree. I do not need power into my shields or my weapons. Boosting power to subsystems with Efficiency. You can't go below 25, so there's no benefit with getting Efficiency. Which was why I suggested that they put that one skill point into something else.
Ah I see what you mean. However the potential and efficiency stack on each other if you set power levels just at 70. While wep power is not needed it does enable you to put full power to engines and the remaining power to aux (base aux power would be 50 if engine is 100 and wep/shld is 25) and watch the aux power bar beef up to the low 70's from the boosts...which is really all you need for a full heal with hazard1.

You could also argue the points saved in efficiency could be put in the aux box itself and get more oomph ..but those boxes cost a lot more points.


Quote:
Right now, those Romulan BOFFs are bugged. We don't know how well those BOFFs will work until they fix the perma-cloak bug.
probably wont fix them since it would also nerf the benefit it gives the federation defiant class.. and since we know that is what the devs use as a standard for all cloak related changes (fed bias.. yay) then it wont happen.
http://media.tumblr.com/160cacdb395f8340dac90864182ebe16/tumblr_inline_mx9yxhItkb1qg9pkt.jpg
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,123
# 290
03-06-2013, 02:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrskyfaller View Post
What i'm trying to say here is that threat control gets you aggro from all npcs not just the one you happened to pop damage to and didnt kill in the first attack.

The AI functions in 'groups'. Each group of ships shares 'hate' and each individual ship has its own 'hate'.

With no threat control, if you hit NPC # 1 of 5 then you get a lot of hate from NPC #1 and some hate from #2->5.

With threat control #2->5 will get a lot of hate on you.

In a group, your team-mates will almost always grab hate from #2->5 just by shooting at one of them a few times...this is why when in a bird of prey when you cloak after an attack only the one you hit keeps a 'lock' on you for much longer than the others.

..but with threat control...the entire group will keep hate on you. They may switch their hate to another when you cloak but the instant you uncloak to attack they target and pop a torpedo your way.

If memory serves me right I think the resists you gained from 9 in threat control were equivalent to 5% across the board. Its not much. My VoQuv tank has threat control 9 and frankly im going to respec out of it if there are no game mechanic changes in may update... i was once able to tank the ISE gate, tac cube and 6 spheres with a fully dedicated shield tank monster setup (no damage, 2 shield drones wings healing me,etc) and my team loved me for it...but as of a few patches ago the borg are firing super-torpedoes and super-plasma heavy cannons shots (torps for 300k+ dmg and hvy plasma cannon hits for 10k to shields... its idiotic) that makes aggro-holding-heal-tanking absolutely impossible.
I referred to this chart for how much you gain: http://home.comcast.net/~amicus/Skil...%20Effects.htm

As for increasing threat generation on all targets, regardless if you're firing on them, I have yet to see any information on this. Going by the wiki (http://www.stowiki.org/Skill:_Starship_Threat_Control), it simply increases the threat generation value per weapon hit on a single target, not targets you aren't firing on. If you're using a Torpedo Spread ability, well then I could see why you grabbed aggro on multiple targets.


Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrskyfaller View Post
Ah I see what you mean. However the potential and efficiency stack on each other if you set power levels just at 70. While wep power is not needed it does enable you to put full power to engines and the remaining power to aux (base aux power would be 50 if engine is 100 and wep/shld is 25) and watch the aux power bar beef up to the low 70's from the boosts...which is really all you need for a full heal with hazard1.

You could also argue the points saved in efficiency could be put in the aux box itself and get more oomph ..but those boxes cost a lot more points.
But the amount you get the closer you get to 75 is pretty low. You'd have to put more points into Efficiency to get 1 or 2 more power, and you still will not be able to break the 74 power level threshold. Also, I prefer to keep my engine power level lower, as I try and stay out of their 5km range, to avoid getting hit with reveal abilities. I put more power into Aux to improve my hull heal abilities, improve my offensive science abilities (I run a Lt. Commander Science slot), and increase my cloak/stealth strength.


Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrskyfaller View Post
probably wont fix them since it would also nerf the benefit it gives the federation defiant class.. and since we know that is what the devs use as a standard for all cloak related changes (fed bias.. yay) then it wont happen.
They are currently discussing how they can make the Subterfuge trait more useful to ships without Stealth. I suspect that a fix would also come to the perma-cloak around the same time.
http://sto-forum.perfectworld.com/sh...1&postcount=17
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