Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 13,511
# 391
03-12-2013, 05:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thisisoverlord View Post
Well the thing is it seems your railroaded and the progression is pre-ordained so I don't think you get much of a choice, even if you might get a lot of skills.
AFAIK the early levels are a pretty straight forward, no choices, you just get skills, BUT that changes and at higher levels things branch. I think it starts around 30-ish.

Also I think at level 11, I started getting points to put into choosing between several passive stat bonuses.
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Career Officer
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 953
# 392
03-12-2013, 05:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by markhawkman View Post
AFAIK the early levels are a pretty straight forward, no choices, you just get skills, BUT that changes and at higher levels things branch. I think it starts around 30-ish.

Also I think at level 11, I started getting points to put into choosing between several passive stat bonuses.
Yeah but it's not the same as the classi DnD Skills & Feats system that I love I was shocked when I leved up and couldn't put points into dodge x)
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 13,511
# 393
03-12-2013, 08:43 PM
well the passives that I had to choose from were class-based. I was playing as a Tiefling Control Wizard, and the passives were specific to that.
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I can haz joystick!
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Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 5,984
# 394
03-12-2013, 09:29 PM
It is kind of hard to not think that this is D&D when it has Mimics and Gelatinous Cubes. Although I encountered less than 5 Mimics from levels 1-30 and 1 Gelatinous Cube at level 29. IMO D&D is more about the lore, monsters, etc rather than gameplay. DS9, Voyager, and TOS are all Star Trek even though they have completely different styles. It is the same with Neverwinter Online and D&D.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,628
# 395
03-12-2013, 09:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thisisoverlord View Post
Yeah but it's not the same as the classi DnD Skills & Feats system that I love I was shocked when I leved up and couldn't put points into dodge x)
You mean 3rd?

3rd is dead, its up to 5th now ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by starkaos View Post
IMO D&D is more about the lore, monsters, etc rather than gameplay.
It annoys me after I ditched it after the .5 update back in 3rd I apparently still care about this.

D&D started from Chainmail, Chainmail was a miniatures wargame that is why D&D was always so combat heavy since its origin is from a wargame.

D&D was also about killing things and take their stuff, it was very dungeon crawling as first modules attest and eventually Gary group seasons lead what became Greyhawk that was still pretty much kill things and take their stuff.

Sure they were splits, DragonLance became the 2nd campaign world, then come Forgotten Realms ... now this would be long, boring and I would stop when in 3rd since I stop following it ... well most of it but the thing is the entire system revolved around combat because thats the part were it originated from and the part that needed to work, we just need to look at alignment to see how rules about roleplaying would leads us.

D&D back in 3rd was still very much about combat but added a skill system, this very much were non-combat was added to the game for all classes, sure there was something like that back in 2nd AD&D (noweapon proficiency) but as a optional rule.

Now "lore" taken time to build, GreyHawk didnt just started as lore usually account to "why are killing then and taking their stuff" as a reason why you were murdering women and children in their houses and then loot their corpses, it also taken a hell lot of time too.

But anyway ... I am sure were this is going to take place or should I say when because 4th Edition did one thing that was.

Forgotten Realms is not Eberron enough, now it is.

This is very much why I am NOT ever playing Neverwinter Nights or ANYTHING D&D that is done under Hasbro regime.

Last edited by f2pdrakron; 03-12-2013 at 10:13 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 953
# 396
03-13-2013, 04:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by f2pdrakron View Post
You mean 3rd?

3rd is dead, its up to 5th now ...



It annoys me after I ditched it after the .5 update back in 3rd I apparently still care about this.

D&D started from Chainmail, Chainmail was a miniatures wargame that is why D&D was always so combat heavy since its origin is from a wargame.

D&D was also about killing things and take their stuff, it was very dungeon crawling as first modules attest and eventually Gary group seasons lead what became Greyhawk that was still pretty much kill things and take their stuff.

Sure they were splits, DragonLance became the 2nd campaign world, then come Forgotten Realms ... now this would be long, boring and I would stop when in 3rd since I stop following it ... well most of it but the thing is the entire system revolved around combat because thats the part were it originated from and the part that needed to work, we just need to look at alignment to see how rules about roleplaying would leads us.

D&D back in 3rd was still very much about combat but added a skill system, this very much were non-combat was added to the game for all classes, sure there was something like that back in 2nd AD&D (noweapon proficiency) but as a optional rule.

Now "lore" taken time to build, GreyHawk didnt just started as lore usually account to "why are killing then and taking their stuff" as a reason why you were murdering women and children in their houses and then loot their corpses, it also taken a hell lot of time too.

But anyway ... I am sure were this is going to take place or should I say when because 4th Edition did one thing that was.

Forgotten Realms is not Eberron enough, now it is.

This is very much why I am NOT ever playing Neverwinter Nights or ANYTHING D&D that is done under Hasbro regime.
I refused to play 4ed onwards, I hate it. Spell Plague was a joke and the change to the systems to dumb it down was a joke, just like when Warhammer 40k went from the 2nd Edition to 3rd Edition.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,662
# 397
03-13-2013, 06:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by thisisoverlord View Post
This is exactly how hugely successful F2P's like DDO work you pay for stuff of substance, I.e. access to entire zones, quest chains and epic raids...
If you paywall content, most of your players will never see that content. Cryptic prefers to have EVERYBODY see the content, and let the content drive sales of other items. Otherwise, they'd be spending the majority of their effort on things that most people would never see.

DDO isn't any more successful than STO. Both strategies are good strategies; Cryptic's means more people get to play all the content.
Career Officer
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 953
# 398
03-13-2013, 07:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by syberghost View Post
If you paywall content, most of your players will never see that content. Cryptic prefers to have EVERYBODY see the content, and let the content drive sales of other items. Otherwise, they'd be spending the majority of their effort on things that most people would never see.

DDO isn't any more successful than STO. Both strategies are good strategies; Cryptic's means more people get to play all the content.
When STO reaches it's 8th year and has the level of content DDO has without out paying for a single area / quest pack then maybe we can discuss it.

For me I'd rather pay $15 dollars for Gianthold which has almost as much content as STO's entire end game than pay $50 dollars for a ship I'll use for 4 weeks.

By your logic no one will ever use the ships Cryptic designs because they are pay-walled and pay-walled much much worse than massive amount of content you get in one DDO zone.

The truth is it has nothing to do with what Cryptic prefers but what Cryptic a capable of doing. They cannot create the volume and complexity of content Turbine can for DDO so they don't even have the option of looking at selling zones as content, for example New Romulus with it's 5 rep tied missions and pretty much nothing else than tagging animals is about 1/10th of the content in DDO's Gianthold zone which is I think a Level 14 zone.

Cryptic simply don't have the ability to generate that kind of quality content in great volume so they instead they open up what content they have to everyone and have to rely on Lockboxes and ship sales as their main source of income.

There is a reason why no one raves about Cryptics content, I think if you ask anyone on here what they think about the content in this game most would say it's not exactly the most titillating. Thats not say it isn't fun in parts, but for example STF's are only fun for me because I love teaming up, but the PVE challenge there is hardly the same grabbing a team and doing Eyes of Stone on Elite (and that isn't even an End-Game mission.. it's only level 15-16).

The game is what it is, and some people like the way it is, others not and others again don't really care either way, but trying to argue that it is as successful as DDO which frankly was the game that showed F2P was actually profitable I think is not possible.

Last edited by thisisoverlord; 03-13-2013 at 08:00 AM.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 13,511
# 399
03-13-2013, 08:13 AM
Drakron mde a good point. The thing about DnD that is truely unique is the backstory. The rest of it borrows from far too many generic fantasy tropes to be unique.
HAIL HYDRA!

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I can haz joystick!
MMOs aren't charities. Corporations are supposed to make a profit. It's what they do.
Career Officer
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 953
# 400
03-13-2013, 09:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by markhawkman View Post
Drakron mde a good point. The thing about DnD that is truely unique is the backstory. The rest of it borrows from far too many generic fantasy tropes to be unique.
Well, I guess that all depends on the campaign setting, the whole Steampunk feel and associated tropes in DDO (Eberron) is markedly different to the High Fantasy feel of FR pre Spell Plague.

Last edited by thisisoverlord; 03-13-2013 at 09:25 AM.
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