Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 677
# 21
03-27-2013, 08:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ussultimatum View Post
If we assume

The Target has Res A Resilient (5% absorb) and opponent has Phaser weapons (15%).

The target has EPTS 3 (30% resistance)

The target has 125 shield power (35%).

The target has 10 stacks of the adapt property, at 2% per stack.


Then, the difference between MACO and a Resilient Res A shield at that point should be about 8 or 9% resistance (with Res A sitting around 69 to 70% SDR).


The value of Res A / B vs. MACO actually becomes larger if the target has lower power and lower EPTS.

For example, EPTS 1, 75 power would see the above example change from 8 or 9% to a difference of about 13% between MACO and Res A / B.
yup, this is the nice effect of diminishing returns ^^
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 12,429
# 22
03-27-2013, 09:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by darkfader1988 View Post
yes yes lot of players abuse fleet shields to adapt to your weapons, you simply do the same and use both ResA and ResB weapons, but i agree its rather redundant, remove fleet shields!!!!
Or they...uh...just use attacks that don't care about shields.
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Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,677
# 23
03-27-2013, 10:58 AM
Yeah, elite fleet shields have made me rethink my builds, it might be a good idea to give up pvp.

I assume there is no point to pvp if you don't have commander level sci disable abilities and do spike damage? That might suck for me, I'm not good at that.
Reality is WAR

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Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,616
# 24
03-27-2013, 11:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deokkent View Post
Yeah, elite fleet shields have made me rethink my builds, it might be a good idea to give up pvp.

I assume there is no point to pvp if you don't have commander level sci disable abilities and do spike damage? That might suck for me, I'm not good at that.
Transphasics and DEM, Omega Passive Graviton (bypasses shields), Team up with a Sci (you MUST have at least ONE In your fleet who's on when you are, and not totally afraid to PvP...)
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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 25
03-27-2013, 11:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ussultimatum View Post
If we assume

The Target has Res A Resilient (5% absorb) and opponent has Phaser weapons (15%).

The target has EPTS 3 (30% resistance)

The target has 125 shield power (35%).

The target has 10 stacks of the adapt property, at 2% per stack.


Then, the difference between MACO and a Resilient Res A shield at that point should be about 8 or 9% resistance (with Res A sitting around 69 to 70% SDR).


The value of Res A / B vs. MACO actually becomes larger if the target has lower power and lower EPTS.

For example, EPTS 1, 75 power would see the above example change from 8 or 9% to a difference of about 13% between MACO and Res A / B.

I wanted to come back to this, as there is a chance that (new info, for me anyway):

> MACO 10% vs. all is not multiplicative
> Brings into question the possibility that Resilient Absorb 5% is also not multiplicative
> Also brings into question the same regarding 15% from Res A or Res B.


Last edited by ussultimatum; 03-27-2013 at 11:41 AM.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,616
# 26
03-27-2013, 11:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ussultimatum View Post
I wanted to come back to this, as there is a chance that (new info, for me anyway):

> MACO 10% vs. all is not multiplicative
> Brings into question the possibility that Resilient Absorb 5% is also not multiplicative
> Also brings into question the same regarding 15% from Res A or Res B.
Not sure if it helps, but observation shows that there is a definite bias regarding which resistant shields are going to be taken, and if you can spot it on a team, you can (if you have the gear in your inventory) re-equip to a type that shield variety (except MACO, of course) doesn't have a resistance proc for.

(easiest time to do so, of course, is while you wait in respawn, but it IS possible. KNOW YOUR SHIELD TYPES!)

iirc, at one point in the PvP community, it was common practice to have multiple sets, 1 for PvE, and others for PvP...
"when you're out of Birds of Prey, you're out of ships."
Empire Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 6,619
# 27
03-27-2013, 11:52 AM
i'll shed some light on somethings, from my personal observations. maco shields with a power level in the 80s will get you mid 50s resistance with EPtS2, the fleet elite will give about 10 more, so its resist is in the 60s. there does appear to be some diminishing return. i used renim's resist viewer to observe this.

also resistant shields have a hard cap of ~76.8%, not 75. at the very least that 5% they come with is not subject or maybe doesn't even count against diminishing return. im pretty sure both maco and fleet elite top out at that 76.8%.
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Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,677
# 28
03-27-2013, 12:22 PM
Lol DEM huh? I never would have considered that one, I guess it's worth a try.
Reality is WAR

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Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 729
# 29
03-27-2013, 12:33 PM
ooooh purty fleet shields... i wants o.o
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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 197
# 30
03-27-2013, 03:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ussultimatum View Post
> Brings into question the possibility that Resilient Absorb 5% is also not multiplicative
From what I know, the 5% resilient absorption isn't treated like regular shield resist at all. Essentially, resilient shields send 90% of an incoming attack to shields, 5% of that to hull, and the remaining 5% just disappears. (Compare to normal shields, where 90% of the attack is borne by shields, and the remaining 10% hits hull.)

Suppose you have an incoming attack that hits your resilient shields. 90% of that would hit shields (assuming the shields aren't broken by the attack). Shield resist would apply after this 90% was calculated; the actual damage your shields take is (1 - Shield Resist) * 0.9 * base damage of attack. 5% of the attack would bleed through to hull; hull resist would apply to this, so the damage the hull takes is (1 - Hull Resist) * 0.05 * base damage of attack. The remaining 5% of the attack simply vanishes.

Resilient shields don't take less damage from an attack; they just make sure that the hull takes half as much damage as usual while the shields are up.
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