Lt. Commander
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 134
# 1 Science?
04-01-2013, 07:35 AM
I just came back to the game after a year or so away....

What does one do with a science officer these days? It seems like all the science powers have been nerfed into oblivion, how do you do damage in a science ship? What is the best role for the most common elite ship missions?

Note: at this point I have a Recon(Luna) and the Nebula refit.

Any ideas or builds would be appreciated.
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,690
# 2
04-01-2013, 08:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by captainobvious09 View Post
What does one do with a science officer these days? It seems like all the science powers have been nerfed into oblivion, how do you do damage in a science ship? What is the best role for the most common elite ship missions?
One looks at the PvP forums for a few of the last remaining functional science builds I'm afraid
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,241
# 3
04-01-2013, 08:38 AM
Basically it comes down to this:

Offensively science is useless. Any science ability that did damage or disabled/drained is utterly useless now.

Heals still work. Of course they have to, otherwise how do escorts get any benefit from their sole little science stations?

Crowd control and sensor attacks are completely broken. They 'work' in the sense that the effect does happen..but it vanishes the instant the target takes ONE hit so... its pointless to use.

and yes, every science stat has been nerfed in effectiveness per point spent either via a direct reduction of the effect or by a ridiculously increased effectiveness of the skillboxes that counter science.

Aka, 1 point in power insulators counters 9 points in flow capacitors. Siphon/Tyken just dont drain anymore.

Special note is that siphon is still good to GAIN power but not to drain it.
http://media.tumblr.com/160cacdb395f8340dac90864182ebe16/tumblr_inline_mx9yxhItkb1qg9pkt.jpg
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,176
# 4
04-01-2013, 08:57 AM
Science in PvE....you're never going to do as well as before, based on what I hear. You could try stacking particle gens and chain Aftershock-doffed Gravity Wells, though. Add an Isometric Charge for that occasional boost. Might as well use a sci-scort. I set up my ship as a plasma torp boat combined with both Romulan and Omega Adapted sets. Seems to give fair DPS.

Science in PvP....can still do very well. I run a pure sci/sci in the Arenas, and I like to think I'm at least competent. My build basically centers around Viral Matrix (doffed) as the main force, along with Eject Warp Plasma (but I don't think your ships can manage this....or can the Nebula?)

A new handy piece of kit is Scramble Sensors combined with the new doff that increases ability cooldown when you hit people with it. I haven't tried it myself, but it is extremely irritating when I get hit by it.

Oh, and timing the classic Tractor Beam with APO going down is a must.

If you still want to run power drains though, you're going to have to build entirely for it, and even then you won't do very well.
PvP-ready toons: Ishmael - Betazoid Sci - Vesta - U.S.S. Yukikaze - The unsinkable destroyer - T'Scurr - Romulan Tac - Mogai - I.R.W. Archer - Countervape overwatch - Ffairl - Romulan Sci - T'Varo - R.R.W. Yuudachi - The nightmare of Solomon

Take it easy!
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,111
# 5
04-01-2013, 09:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrskyfaller View Post
Basically it comes down to this:

Offensively science is useless. Any science ability that did damage or disabled/drained is utterly useless now.

Heals still work. Of course they have to, otherwise how do escorts get any benefit from their sole little science stations?

Crowd control and sensor attacks are completely broken. They 'work' in the sense that the effect does happen..but it vanishes the instant the target takes ONE hit so... its pointless to use.

and yes, every science stat has been nerfed in effectiveness per point spent either via a direct reduction of the effect or by a ridiculously increased effectiveness of the skillboxes that counter science.

Aka, 1 point in power insulators counters 9 points in flow capacitors. Siphon/Tyken just dont drain anymore.

Special note is that siphon is still good to GAIN power but not to drain it.
Unfortunately the above post is correct. Science is...not in a good place right now. Don't even bother trying to do damage with sci skills.

I finally gave in and got the Vesta and it makes playing science bearable again. Mainly because of cannons, pets, and the Vesta death ray console. Notice that none of those things have anything to do with science. Oh well. That's just how it is sadly.
-Lantesh
Since Feb. 2009
Commander
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 407
# 6
04-01-2013, 09:36 AM
Fly a carrier or a Vesta for PvE - they have all the skills of a normal science ship while ALSO doing 2-3 times the damage.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,303
# 7
04-01-2013, 09:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmdrskyfaller View Post
Aka, 1 point in power insulators counters 9 points in flow capacitors. Siphon/Tyken just dont drain anymore.
then the borg must have 60 points in flow caps, because even at 6 PI, i'm still getting my shields ripped apart by their tachyon beams
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Originally Posted by sander233 View Post
Klingons use bathtubs as a severe form punishment.
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Originally Posted by oldkirkfan View Post
"You sniveling petaQ!!! If you are late for your shift one more time, you will spend two hours in the bathtub!!."

"WITH SOAP!!"
Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 857
# 8
04-01-2013, 10:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by captainobvious09 View Post
I just came back to the game after a year or so away....

What does one do with a science officer these days? It seems like all the science powers have been nerfed into oblivion, how do you do damage in a science ship? What is the best role for the most common elite ship missions?

Note: at this point I have a Recon(Luna) and the Nebula refit.

Any ideas or builds would be appreciated.
Well apparently, particle physics are the only powers that actually work properly. I used to think they nerfed them all and did some more research however it is just as bad as you say when 75% of science abilities are completely useless and what's worse is none of them are canon. sybnuc actually does not disable, altho most particle abilities have good use gravity wells don't actually hold anything in place all ships just fly right thru them, deflector abilities like tachyon pulse simply are a tickle to the shields even with full spec and 4 flow cap consoles, Tyken's rift should shut down engine power entirely, photonic officer is completely useless, For some reason Charged Particle burst is a sensor skill methinks they are trying to hard to make these systems effect the agonizingly slow sensor analysis because this system should be a particle ability easily, the only skills to improve feedback pulse are tactical skills which shouldn't affect any science skills at all and is part of the problem (and the two skills which affect FBP are only learnable by tactical captains), Energy Siphon and target subsystem hardly drains anything anymore because people's gearsets and mandatory cookie cutter spec requires that everyone have maxed out defenses from such things (there's no real penalty for choosing a defense against science skills in the skill trait trees everyone can get them without any drawbacks).

Not to mention the problems with the weapons. Everyone must have temporal shielding now because chroniton torps do not pass thru shields, to do anything you have to have cannons and when you get the ships that have cannons on them you basically have to turn your ship into an all energy weapon cannon vehicle, so basically you might as well be playing a tactical captain at this point, not to mention to do anything with beams you have to use plasma because that's really the only way you're going to damage your opponent, go ahead check out these forums every single beam build here and on the skill builder site that has any success are all romulan plasma builds.

So yeah they have alot of work to do if they want to balance this game. I'd personally suggest they make the abilities canon it would be a great start in the rebuilding of the balance of this game and would ensure that these science skills work as they did in the shows.
Is hoping that Isis is an adequate replacement for the Sensor Targetting Assault loss we'll experience in Season 9.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 165
# 9
04-01-2013, 10:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by the1tigglet View Post
So yeah they have alot of work to do if they want to balance this game. I'd personally suggest they make the abilities canon it would be a great start in the rebuilding of the balance of this game and would ensure that these science skills work as they did in the shows.
Fly next to the Enterprise when doing Tau Dewa patrols. Notice it's Torp Spread Quantums hitting for 130k, it's Gravity Well that nothing can escape from, an effective Tractor Beam and Tricobalt launcher.
Not to mention it has 320k hull.

Looks perfectly canon to me.

To the OP: Science has it's place but it has certainly been nerfed from before. They're potent in PvP and can do decent damage in PvE still, though it's more through weapon damage than ability damage now.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,022
# 10
04-01-2013, 10:45 AM
Particle generators do in fact buff feedback pulse...

I have no interest in this debate, tho.
Vice Admiral Space Orphidian Possiblities Wizard
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