Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,400
# 21
04-02-2013, 07:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adjudicatorhawk View Post
Definitely not intended, though I'm not seeing it occur for me. All class-specific traits stand alone. Grace Under Fire should require you to be at least Captain rank, however, as it (along with Photonic Capacitor and Last Ditch Effort) modify Captain-rank abilities.

The same thing seems to happen with the Tac traits.

The character I tested on was L50.

Republic Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 451
# 22
04-02-2013, 08:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adjudicatorhawk View Post
Definitely not intended, though I'm not seeing it occur for me. All class-specific traits stand alone. Grace Under Fire should require you to be at least Captain rank, however, as it (along with Photonic Capacitor and Last Ditch Effort) modify Captain-rank abilities.
Its the only engineering traits that are doing that to me. I'm a vice admiral it also wouldn't let me remove EPS manifold efficiency when it moved over to the accept trait selection menu as long as I had grace under fire. Buts its also odd that your not seeing the same thing... Its happening on both of my vice admirals on tribble.

Last edited by cryptkeeper0; 04-02-2013 at 08:17 PM.
Rihannsu
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 258
# 23
04-02-2013, 08:16 PM
Engineer traits seem a bit weak.

Grace Under Pressure is very strong. No complaints really, as long as the trait only triggers when Miracle Worker is on cooldown.

The battery trait is strong, but requires the use of expandable items. While the EC cost of normal batteries isn't staggering, it can still add up, plus they only stack to 20, so they create an inventory headache if you're using a lot of them. No one else has a trait based on expendables. This trait would probably be better if it worked off of Emergency Power to X instead of batteries, since those are engineering abilities and don't cost anything but an ability slot. Either that or let engineers buy batteries at a discount and stack them to 100.

The ground traits, I dunno. Turrets, etc are really useful, so any resistance or regen is going to have some use, but the values seem very low. I probably wouldn't take it, even though I make constant use of pets. Better to grab a different ground trait, IMO.

The resistance trait also, would be amazing as a space power (OP, really) shields last 1-2 hits on the ground before you need to get cover, and even with the shield heals and resist powers they don't last very long. Not sure if even the fully stacked resist will matter more than any non engineer ground powers.

Tac powers all seem very strong. Science ground powers seem very strong. I need to test the space powers to see what I think.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 313
# 24
04-02-2013, 08:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adjudicatorhawk View Post
Definitely not intended, though I'm not seeing it occur for me. All class-specific traits stand alone. Grace Under Fire should require you to be at least Captain rank, however, as it (along with Photonic Capacitor and Last Ditch Effort) modify Captain-rank abilities.
I saw several space traits that didn't show up until some other trait had been taken, I think maybe it's just a display issue? I didn't keep track of all of them, but Astrophysicist didn't show up until I took Accurate and Grace Under Fire didn't show up until I had taken some ground trait (don't remember specifically). This was on a transferred level 50 character, so I could probably retransfer him and check again.

Edit: maybe because it's level restricted, only certain slots can actually have the trait? I'll try to check when it becomes available when I try again.

Level 50 Aliengen Engineer
Immediately after transfer:

Current Traits:
Elusive, Warp Theorist, Techie, Efficient Captain

Available Space Traits:
Accurate, Astrophysicist, EPS Manifold Efficiency

Available Ground Traits:
Acute Senses, Aggressive, Cold Blooded, Covert, Creative, Lucky, Mental Discipline, Nanomolecular Architect, Natural Immunities, Peak Health, Physical Strength, Resilient, Shield Harmonic Resonance, Soldier, Stubborn, Sturdy, Sure Footed, Telepathic

Grace Under Fire did not appear as a selectable trait until the 7th slot, regardless of the combination of new traits I tried to take, and disappeared again if I removed one of my newly selected traits. I was unable to replicate the disappearing Astrophysicist trait on this test.

The 6th slot on normal characters (and I assume therefore the 7th slot on an Aliengen due to the extra Optional) is the Captain slot, so it's probably a slot restriction on the trait.

Last edited by jbmaverick; 04-02-2013 at 09:02 PM.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 424
# 25
04-02-2013, 08:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adjudicatorhawk View Post
AlienGen characters will have four useful traits picked for them at character creation based on whether they are creating Tactical, Engineering, or Science captains. When they respec, they will be able to spec all 9 of their Trait Slots from any of their Trait options - they have higher versatility than all other species still, but the gap between AlienGen and non-AlienGen characters in terms of overall Trait usefulness should now be drastically reduced as compared to before.
Not quite on topic, but is it reasonable to assume that you were, at one point, an Arbiter?

On topic though, good basis, however, I am concerned when it goes live how we will obtain respecs [since inevitable, I'll make mistakes ].
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 129
# 26
04-02-2013, 08:58 PM
Engineer traits are generally weak and forces players to focus their build around batteries when most players don't even use battery consumables in-game.

Grace under pressure- I'm not happy about the fact that miracle worker even though we get a chance to pop it a second time provided that there's a 20% drop to health, essentially does not give us damage resistance or clenses to debuffs. All it does is delay the inevitable! I find that almost everytime i use miracle worker, sure it gives a big decent heals but it only delays my death by 5-10 extra seconds in a fight. It does not provide any damage resistance to shields whatsover. Miracle worker is used as a last resort when your dying with no more buffs to spare to heal yourself but almost always, players will only delay their death by a few more seconds which is why I believe there should be a trait that gives an enourmous shield damage resistence similiarly to go 'down fighting hull damage resistance trait' (makes sense) instead of a second Miracle worker when 20% health is lost.

As for battery trait, its not a very good idea to force players to focus their entire build around batteries when in fact it could mess with their build, rotation, or playstyle. Engineers have always been at a disadvantage compared to science and tactical players in space due to their lack of damage resistance debuffs to do some decent damage, lack of high boosting dps capabilities etc like Attack pattern Alpha. Providing an extra very VERY small amount of power (battery trait) isn't going to help boost engineers damage, or healing capabilities at ALL. A better solution would be to enable engineers to have a trait that gives them 200 power to weapons, shields, engines, aux power for like 5-7 seconds which could enable to give them enough dps to actually be useful. It would be powerful so having a cd of this trait would ensure that there isn't 100% uptime of this powerful would-be trait otherwise it would be OP ofcourse but it gives an engineer a fighting chance to actually do anything in the heat of the moment. So it would be nice for engineers to be able to go above 125 power cap to around 200 for 5-7 seconds which could help them heal if they are dying and miracle worker doesn't provide damage resistance so having extra 200 to shields and auxilarily can go along way too wards helping them even if its for a few seconds.

Did you know that in 3 years the total amount of batteries consumed by the average player amounts to paying 1.2 million energy credits for consumption on a daily basis of these consumables

Im not happy about the fact that tactical players get a 10% accuracy which debuffs others, especially engineers who's dps can't even keep up most of the time...and now to make it worse...engineers will be missing most of the time on top of their weak dps. Cryptic you might was well forcing them into using 1 restraining build instead of a varied builds which players are free to decide and what makes this game so good. You'd essentially be forcing them to only be healing boats, only heals! I know a couple of engineers who can make a pretty decent build for dps in pvp. So if you implement this advantage to tactical players it means that those engineers are going to be at an even further disadvantage then before considering they have no captain skills that provide damage resistance debuffs or damage boosting powers like Attack pattern alpha and go down fighting.

Its time to really start focusing on engineers too because quiet frankly its becoming mind-numbing to keep playing a "Escort Online"
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 313
# 27
04-02-2013, 09:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adjudicatorhawk View Post
AlienGen characters will have four useful traits picked for them at character creation based on whether they are creating Tactical, Engineering, or Science captains. When they respec, they will be able to spec all 9 of their Trait Slots from any of their Trait options - they have higher versatility than all other species still, but the gap between AlienGen and non-AlienGen characters in terms of overall Trait usefulness should now be drastically reduced as compared to before.
So I created a new Aliengen character to see how this would work. I created an Aliengen Engineer and it gave me Stubborn, Lucky, Warp Theorist, and Techie as my 4 optionals, but it also gave me a Regenerative racial trait (passive shield regen on the ground, faster out of combat health healing). You're saying that the optionals and the racial were chosen based on my career choice, and the racial could be removed via respec later? I also created a Liberated Borg Engineer and he got 3 Optionals and 1 Racial at character creation, and I couldn't select a 4th optional from the list despite having an open slot (also, Techie was labeled as Warp Theorist on the free list despite having the correct icon and description).
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,567
# 28
04-02-2013, 09:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacefortress View Post
Engineer traits are generally weak and forces players to focus their build around batteries when most players don't even use battery consumables in-game.

Grace under pressure- I'm not happy about the fact that miracle worker even though we get a chance to pop it a second time provided that there's a 20% drop to health, essentially does not give us damage resistance or clenses to debuffs. All it does is delay the inevitable! I find that almost everytime i use miracle worker, sure it gives a big decent heals but it only delays my death by 5-10 extra seconds in a fight. It does not provide any damage resistance to shields whatsover. Miracle worker is used as a last resort when your dying with no more buffs to spare to heal yourself but almost always, players will only delay their death by a few more seconds which is why I believe there should be a trait that gives an enourmous shield damage resistence similiarly to go 'down fighting hull damage resistance trait' (makes sense) instead of a second Miracle worker when 20% health is lost.

As for battery trait, its not a very good idea to force players to focus their entire build around batteries when in fact it could mess with their build, rotation, or playstyle. Engineers have always been at a disadvantage compared to science and tactical players in space due to their lack of damage resistance debuffs to do some decent damage, lack of high boosting dps capabilities etc like Attack pattern Alpha. Providing an extra very VERY small amount of power (battery trait) isn't going to help boost engineers damage, or healing capabilities at ALL. A better solution would be to enable engineers to have a trait that gives them 200 power to weapons, shields, engines, aux power for like 5-7 seconds which could enable to give them enough dps to actually be useful. It would be powerful so having a cd of this trait would ensure that there isn't 100% uptime of this powerful would-be trait otherwise it would be OP ofcourse but it gives an engineer a fighting chance to actually do anything in the heat of the moment. So it would be nice for engineers to be able to go above 125 power cap to around 200 for 5-7 seconds which could help them heal if they are dying and miracle worker doesn't provide damage resistance so having extra 200 to shields and auxilarily can go along way too wards helping them even if its for a few seconds.

Did you know that in 3 years the total amount of batteries consumed by the average player amounts to paying 1.2 million energy credits for consumption on a daily basis of these consumables

Im not happy about the fact that tactical players get a 10% accuracy which debuffs others, especially engineers who's dps can't even keep up most of the time...and now to make it worse...engineers will be missing most of the time on top of their weak dps. Cryptic you might was well forcing them into using 1 restraining build instead of a varied builds which players are free to decide and what makes this game so good. You'd essentially be forcing them to only be healing boats, only heals! I know a couple of engineers who can make a pretty decent build for dps in pvp. So if you implement this advantage to tactical players it means that those engineers are going to be at an even further disadvantage then before considering they have no captain skills that provide damage resistance debuffs or damage boosting powers like Attack pattern alpha and go down fighting.

Its time to really start focusing on engineers too because quiet frankly its becoming mind-numbing to keep playing a "Escort Online"
You should consider PVE too, not only PVP.

There, the ability to pop miracle worker again would help against the elite invisible torpedoes.
Cryptic Studios Team
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 475
# 29
04-02-2013, 09:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by voxinvictus View Post
The battery trait is strong, but requires the use of expandable items. While the EC cost of normal batteries isn't staggering, it can still add up, plus they only stack to 20, so they create an inventory headache if you're using a lot of them. No one else has a trait based on expendables.
Point noted, and I definitely hear you guys on this one, but EPS Manifold Efficiency also interacts with the Capacitor power on Very Rare quality warp cores, so it's not strictly limited to consumables. That should probably be explicitly spelled out in the tooltip - I'll get that fixed asap.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 703
# 30
04-02-2013, 09:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by adjudicatorhawk View Post
Definitely not intended, though I'm not seeing it occur for me. All class-specific traits stand alone. Grace Under Fire should require you to be at least Captain rank, however, as it (along with Photonic Capacitor and Last Ditch Effort) modify Captain-rank abilities.
I see it too.
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