Captain
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 954
# 111
04-20-2013, 03:19 AM
Quote:
Do you even konw physics?
Resistance AKA friction and inertia are two completely different things.
I am not that up on science, though thank you for the info, you learn something new every day. I am NOT being sarcastic here.
Starfleet Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 995
# 112
04-20-2013, 03:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cynder2012 View Post
just to note...the REFIT version of the DD has a LT TAC, COMM Eng, LT SCI and LT UNI....its almost like they are forcing us to buy a ship just for a better layout -_-...that we cant even test until LoR goes live
It'd only be worth it to buy the version available at VA rank, much like the Exploration Cruiser Retrofit. It'd be nice if the Exploration Cruiser Retrofit also got a universal BO station to match.
---------------------------------------------------
U.S.S. Endeavour NCC-91771 - Nebula-class
Commanding Officer: Captain Pyotr Ramonovich Amosov
Dedication Plaque: "Leave nothing unattempted" - James Cook

Last edited by amosov78; 04-20-2013 at 04:41 AM.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 45
# 113
04-23-2013, 08:23 AM
This should be pretty easy. All they need to do is take the lt commander engineer from the Galaxy and make him a tactical to show that the D'deridex is more combat focused than the Galaxy.

Then you'd have less survivability but more alpha strike punch from having access to teir 3 tac abilities, which jives well with the "decloak and fire" design philosophy.

Then you just do the same for the consoles. Move one of the sciences to tactical to show that it's a Warbird and not a "Scansgaseousanomoliesbird".

So in the end you have

lt tac, lt cm tac

cm eng

lt sci

en eng

4 eng consoles
3 tac consoles
2 sci consoles

Now it feels like a battlecruiser/warship like it's supposed to be, and not an explorer and research vessel like the Galaxy.

The turn rate is fine, it should be slow given how big it is. It should also however have shield and hull points to likewise reflect how big it is.

I'd also argue for a 5/3 weapon split front to back instead of the usual 4/4 as the Warbirds always struck me as having a forward weapon facing bias. That's pie in the sky stuff that'll never happen though. I'll be happy if it doesn't get saddled with 4/3.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 107
# 114
04-23-2013, 12:29 PM
The D'Deredix is both an icon and a cruiser. Thus we can infer that it, like the galaxy class, will be relegated to the echelons of uncompetitiveness.

Welcome to Star Trek: Escorts Online.

One Year and Three months waiting for Fleet Galaxy X - "Technical Difficulties" Since 8th Feb 12.
Landmark Technical Difficulties Dates: 13/01/12 - 8/11/12 - 14/11/12 - 14/12/12 - 26/04/13
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,192
# 115
04-23-2013, 12:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozy83 View Post
The D'Deredix is both an icon and a cruiser. Thus we can infer that it, like the galaxy class, will be relegated to the echelons of uncompetitiveness.

Welcome to Star Trek: Escorts Online.
Don't worry, the devs make sure the Galaxy will remain the worst end-game cruiser in STO.
Captain
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,462
# 116
04-23-2013, 12:48 PM
It has been stated many many many many many times that the stats and layout of the D'deridex and other high-level ships are not finalized.

Which you should all have figured out for yourself, seeing as it's on the test server, not the release server. Why not head over to Tribble and see what's actually going on instead of getting all bent out of shape over something that's not an issue yet.
Captain
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 734
# 117
04-23-2013, 12:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ouroboros99 View Post
This should be pretty easy. All they need to do is take the lt commander engineer from the Galaxy and make him a tactical to show that the D'deridex is more combat focused than the Galaxy.

Then you'd have less survivability but more alpha strike punch from having access to teir 3 tac abilities, which jives well with the "decloak and fire" design philosophy.

Then you just do the same for the consoles. Move one of the sciences to tactical to show that it's a Warbird and not a "Scansgaseousanomoliesbird".

So in the end you have

lt tac, lt cm tac

cm eng

lt sci

en eng

4 eng consoles
3 tac consoles
2 sci consoles

Now it feels like a battlecruiser/warship like it's supposed to be, and not an explorer and research vessel like the Galaxy.

The turn rate is fine, it should be slow given how big it is. It should also however have shield and hull points to likewise reflect how big it is.

I'd also argue for a 5/3 weapon split front to back instead of the usual 4/4 as the Warbirds always struck me as having a forward weapon facing bias. That's pie in the sky stuff that'll never happen though. I'll be happy if it doesn't get saddled with 4/3.

I doubt they would do it cause universals on a "free" ship are few an far between, but if they just made the ltc. spot universal, I think it would well reflect the "this ship has to do everything" as the backbone of the romulan fleet, and it can be taken more tac heavy, more eng heavy, or more sci heavy depending on the circumstances/mission/captain flying it. That to me would be ideal.

I think the console layout on the D'Deridex on tribble is already supposed to be slightly more tactical than the galaxy in that it has 3 tac consoles rather than three sci consoles. Additionally, I think the ship has slightly more hitpoints and something silly like a 1.01 modifier that just ever so slightly gives it like 1% more shields... unless it's a typo and it's supposed to be 1.1
Captain
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 4,916
# 118
04-23-2013, 01:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by momaw View Post
Which you should all have figured out for yourself, seeing as it's on the test server, not the release server.
As past history indicates, a lot of stuff never gets changed while on test and really only gets noticed once it goes live. So while I appreciate what you're saying you should also appreciate that people who've dealt with Cryptic's testing protocols in the past definitely have experience in seeing something go unchanged and get released bugged or mistake-filled.

Quote:
Why not head over to Tribble and see what's actually going on instead of getting all bent out of shape over something that's not an issue yet.
A lot of folks still can't access Romulans on Tribble. So what would be the point?
Ensign
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 13
# 119
04-23-2013, 02:36 PM
Ok, if any devs are reading this, please keep in mind that it's called a Romulan Warbird. Not a Sciencebird or Engineerbird. Please give the final version the tac stations/consoles it deserves.
Lieutenant
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 45
# 120
04-23-2013, 06:04 PM
The point of early testing would be to spot potential problems early before they're multiplied and entrenched into problems that become harder to correct.

The D'deridex having the bridge officer and console layout of the Galaxy would qualify as a problem. The fact the Galaxy is a ship that is almost never seen in high level play is sufficient evidence to prove that the combination of that Boff/console layout and ship type is not something that should be duplicated or imitated.

Given that the Romulans will have such a limited number of ships available to them at launch every effort needs to be made to ensure that those ships that are available are each useful and competitive in their own way. No one wants to see a Romulan faction where everyone flies endgame ship X, because endgame ship X is clearly and obviously better than endgame ships Y,W, and Z.

The reality of the game as it stands is that "tank" type builds that can sustain a lot of damage, but put out virtually none, have little value in end game content where everything is about DPS and timers that cause you to fail optionals if your team doesn't have enough DPS. I'm saying this as a Cruiser captain. Damage potential coming from boff layouts and consoles is the reason why cruisers like the fleet Excelsior are fantastic and the Galaxy dread that I also own is almost never played.

While it's bad enough that ships like the Galaxy and Galaxy dread are forever stuck filling this tanking role that isn't required or wanted in endgame teams, the idea of creating more NEW ships to also sit on the bench next to them is even worse. Especially when it's being done on something like the TNG D'deridex warbird, which given that a lot of us likely grew up watching TNG, will no doubt sell like crazy so long as it doesn't suck too bad to bear.

The time to voice any kind of disapproval for this is now though, while it's still being tested. That's the point of beta testing. If you don't like it speak up now and say so and hopefully, if the stars align and the magical Romulan faeries are in a good mood, it'll be fixed before it goes live and Romulan players won't get stuck with a mile long paperweight where a historic battlecruiser should have been.

I haven't flown it myself but I've flown the Galaxy dread and spent ages trying to find a role and setup for it that didn't feel underpowered. If the D'deridex is just the galaxy dread in a green skin with a better cloaking device, worse turn rate and massive power generation penalties in exchange for gimmick powers it will be one of the worst endgame ships in Star Trek Online.

Please make it not so.
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