Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
02-06-2010, 05:22 PM
Originally Posted by Mephane
I would love to flank enemies, but even if I command all my BOs to focus on my target, it seems I never lose aggro, so they are always facing me.
I know- I try to get as many enemies facing me so that my BOs can flank them. Works out rather well.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
02-06-2010, 07:15 PM
give us FPS combat

try running directly to an objective, putting up a cover shield around it (if you are an engineer) to block enemy fire, so you can use it
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
02-06-2010, 07:21 PM
totally agree, ground combat is just one big time sink with no skill required at all and you being there doesn;t actualy change the outcome... don't believe me watch my ground combat videos...

here is how i do ground combat missions

1) right to first fight

2) let go of mouse and keyboard and turn on xbox, put in a game, play game...

3) check to see if fight is finished, run to next fight

4) go back to xbox game

5) rinse and repeat

p.s. even if you die you continue to get skill points from your BO doing the mission and then they heal you after

i also agree for both space and ground combat i'd prefer less enemies but harder enemies that actually provided a challenge...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
02-06-2010, 08:21 PM
I agree, Ground combat is completly boring, even with enemys healing each other (im cmmander 1).
The main prob is, that it has absolutely no atmosphere, and zero Star trek-feeling, and it completly unrealistic.
everyone just crouches down right where he is and starts fireing.-Boooooring.
And the indoor desingn is mostly extremly poor. It just doesnt rock.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
02-06-2010, 08:41 PM
I don't agree with the fps idea, it has a strategy squad leader feel that could be capitalized on. Crouch is fine but the camera sucks. The only problem I have with indoor environments is that the ceilings seem to high (probably for the camera I guess) and the outdoor environments don't feel like star trek bc 90% of the ST I've seen has taken place indoors/in space.

I too would like to see better enemies but I like the shoot'em'up feel and just wish I had more bridge officer "command" abilities to make me feel like a captain/commander of troops. I'll take RTS over FPS any day of the week
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
02-06-2010, 08:43 PM
My tac officer usually takes things out really fast while my other characters mostly let the bridge officers do their thing, this is a game where you are a captain not a soldier so of course your abilities don't determine the match, but what we need is to be able to command our troops. And we need the crouch thing fixed so that we can direct them while crouching. Could be awesome as hell.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
02-06-2010, 09:25 PM
I agree, ground combat is terrible. It's definitely a chore and it feels long, drawn out, and more work than fun. I've come to the conclusion that the reasons for this in my mind are:

1.) Players and NPCs have way too much HP. I like in space combat that once your shields are down, you're pretty much screwed. Players and away team NPCs have way too many HPs. I've made it to Lt. 1 now twice (once in beta, once live) and not ONCE have I been challenged by ground encounters. I never at any point felt that I was in any danger or could be defeated. It's even more impossible to die when I can make shield/health generators and have BOs with healing and shield restoring powers/items up the wazoo. I CAN'T die! Just for laughs earlier I ran ahead of my away team into a big room filled to the gills with Klingons and aggro'd all of them. I don't even think they depleted my shields all the way.

2.) Enemy HP way too high: Couple the fact that I can't die with the fact that enemies take FOREVER to kill and combat boils down to me just standing there tee'ing off on the enemies waiting for their HP to reach 0. Of course there's no risk to me, and they defeated.

3.) Enemy spawn sizes are huge. Combat is boring enough as it is, the sheer mass of enemies even without a team, just makes every fight that much more of a snore fest while I stand there and press 1 and 2 until the tank like enemies that can't actually harm me fall over.

4.) weapons are boring: Maybe they improve later on, but so far every single weapon I've seen comes with a single target attack, a long recharging AoE or cone of some type, and the melee swing. This really limits the fun of weapons. Long recharges on the AoE attacks are pretty annoying, as well. Weapons should include the recharge time of their attacks in their descriptions, at least for AoEs. Having a DPS indicator for the AoE attacks is pretty useless, as that's calculated against a single foe so it's a useless statistic to show us

My solution would be to drastically reduce the HP of both players, away teams, and enemies. Leave weapon damage alone. This actually places a bit of urgency on keeping shields up and provides an exciting challenge knowing that I can actually be defeated. It also prevents the severe boredom that comes from taking 20 shots to defeat a single weak enemy. Basically, once the shields are down, it should only be a few shots at most to kill a standard enemy. Players should be a bit tougher, of course, but not nearly as tough as they are now.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
02-06-2010, 09:30 PM
Want easy ground battles? Go to DS9 and buy a Bat'leth [provided you are at least commander.]

You know the 5 minutes that it usually takes to kill those Romulan commanders? Takes less than 1. If your entire team is outfitted with Bat'leths in the endgame they will annihilate everything. No joke, ranged weapons absolutely blow in comparison.

Because enemy NPC [especially late game, borg especially] have insane shields, but average HP. So melee attacks, specifically bat'leth, own the crap out of them.

funny huh?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
02-06-2010, 09:47 PM
On a more objective note, there are a lot of ground combat technical issues that need to be ironed out. Specifically, after spending considerable time messing with it, I've concluded the camera needs to be totally reworked. Everything feels incredibly janky and laggy but not in a net-lag kind of way. More of an interface lag.

Effects feels like they are happening about a half second after the animations. The easiest way to see this is when an enemy throws a photon grenade at you and it takes about a half second for the damage to appear, then a split second longer for you to actually be KB'd.

Clicking on powers doesn't feel responsive and clicking on targets can be extraordinarily difficult when there are a lot of targets on your screen. For example, the target boxes on things like shield gens and phaser turrets are enormous. Animations in general are clippy and weird, specifically a lot of sliding around the ground during KB effects and projectiles such as the big gorn thing's rock throw where the rock doesn't even show up in his hands. It's hard to explain but it;s the same way in champions. To me there has always felt like there's a weird but noticeable disconnect between issuing a command, the animation, and then the actual effect.

Then there are bugs such as the controls reversing themselves (back is forward, left is right) which seems to happen when the enemy manages to circle strafe around you. Crouching has some kind of screwy effect on the controls/camera.

Then there's the enemies that always seem to target you NO MATTER WHAT. They also have the tendancy to flat out bum rush you no matter what. The only thing that seems to take their attention away from me are fabricated equipments. Being an aggro magnet isn't that big of a deal though, when I can easily tank 10+ even level mobs with absolutely no risk.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
02-06-2010, 10:40 PM
i agree with you all and as more people experience the higher tier content with the regenerating engineer shields, the romulan commanders etc etc... they'll flood here with complaints.

ground combat feels so much like a chore sometimes that i put a cover shield around objectives so i am covered while i interact with them and run to each objective and do this.

right now its gotta substantially better, ive given my officers more expose powers, i think ihave 5 in total out of the 4 bridge officers and i have 2. then i have 2 exploit rifles and 2 officrs with exploit rifles.

i get lots of exposes. helps it go much faster.

it just doesnt seem right to be shooting one enemy over and over, te pacing of ground combat in mass effect felt much better, i thiknk sto cold be like ME, if they did away with the push 1-2-3 thing to fire....

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