Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 Perpetual's vision for STO...
02-07-2010, 10:51 AM
There is a post in Suricata's blog about STO, as developed by Perpetual Entertainment. How about a little intellectual honestly, then. Since people are so fond of picking apart the current STO, let us take a critical look at the information in the blog entry. Turnabout is fair play, and there is no reason to be all moon-eyed over something that wasn't produced.

Let us first look at the pictures on that blog as though they are actually from a competed game.

Firstly, space is still super-colorful and crowded with crap. So no difference there.

Did you look at the guy on the ground? He is RIPPED! Must be sucking down 'roids. Yeah, THAT'S really Star Trek...

How about the image of that interaction with an alien. Looks like Saturday Morning Cartoon quality art design. Yeah, THAT really brings across the "Star Trek" feel...

Marvel at the power bar across the bottom, which looks oh so very "Star Trek" in its visual theme and layout. And it is so very intuitive and helpful in its layout. Why, at a glance I can see the status of my power levels, my shields, my ship hull...oh, wait...those don't even exist!

That equipment screen looks not too bad...oh, wait....it looks fugly and clumbsy! My bad! What are these slots? What do they do? How is that a "clean" interface in any way?

Hmmm...come to think of it, the big "Ground" and "Space" button in the lower left is oh so helpful! I wouldn't know if it was ground or space without it!

And that chat area! So streamlined! So uncluttered! Oh, wait, it is just like this one and any other MMO chat area!

Frankly, I do not see anything in those pictures that actually looks better than what the game looks like RIGHT NOW when I play. I don't even have the graphics settings cranked all the way up. Perhaps people should check their settings?


Now, lets look at the text content, shall we?

Everything above the section labeled "The Players" is almost EXACTLY what we have RIGHT NOW. The ONE feature that doesn't exist from that area is the nebulas, and I do not know how much of a critical game addition that would be. Unless these are nebulas that exist in a system, at which point we have THOSE, too.

So, "The Players" section...

Quote:
Players would start as cadets and it was intended that within playing for a few hours the player would gain access to their first space vessel, which would of been a shuttle of some description.
Oh, YEAH, that'll really go over well! People already LOVE having to play a Fed for a few hours before being able to play a Klingon! How about you don't even get a ship at all, and then when you finally do it is some PoS shuttle! Huzzah! That's giving players what they want!

Quote:
As players progressed though the game they would have been able to align themselves to various factions, these included a klingon faction, a trade faction, a commerce faction as well as Section 31. Although players would still serve in Starfleet, different content would be made available via you affiliation with these fringe factions.
Right...name a show or movie in which the Star Trek universe was portrayed as a balkanized place of competing factions... If you can't its because it ISN'T. The Federation is the Federation. The Klingon Empire is the Klingon Empire. There may be groups within these, but they are part of these larger organizations. They do not stand in the place of them. Your primary association is to the ideals of these larger organizations (and, yes, it IS debatable as to whether Cryptic has represented these ideals well). Splitting up the players among these "factions" for "different content" would result in even LESS community interaction than we have now.


The ships:

The artistic objectives were maintained by Cryptic. We have modifiable appearances, a more "heavy plated" look, several classic ship designs, etc.

Multi-player ships....BWAHAHAHAH! I can see it now..."Sorry guys, I lagged and couldn't balance the shields." "You noob! You fly for sux! LtP!" "Sorry, can't log on tonight, you'll have to find another guy to run tactical."

This would have been a option for small groups of people who are already close friends. Since schedules and the fluid nature of online communities would have meant that there would be very few groups that could always be on together, you would have a lot of PUGs. Those are always SO very efficient and skilled...

So what if you just played solo? After all, there is nothing that says you HAVE to be in a group.

Quote:
When players grouped on a ship more abilities would appear, increasing as more players joined.
Oh...so to have all the powers possible, I have to have multiple people in my ship. Content would therefore either have to be scaled with this in mind, or be trivialized by it. So, grouped ships would either be an even EASIER easy mode than we have now, or people would be SOL without a group ship, forever shouting to "nerf grouped ships". The nerf cries would be particularly loud in PvP, as would the drama matches between players on the same ship.

Yeah, THAT would have worked SO well.

The pièce de résistance:

Quote:
At the time of the tour player ships were not intended to have full interiors, although hubs were intended to have very extensive interiors for players to get their Trek experiance of walking around ships. Player ship interiors were planned for post launch, along with player housing.
Yes, you read that right folks! NO REAL DIFFERENCE THAN NOW! Heck, the Bridges that have been thrown in there are actually MORE than Perpetual would have had. LOL


As for server stability...Perpetual was even MORE rinky-dink than Cryptic is. Do you really, HONESTLY, think the server stability and load issues would be BETTER under Perpetual?


Look, Cryptic has provided a watered-down version of a Star Trek MMO. That, there is no denying. There is much more that could have been and should yet be done with STO. However, they actually produced something. Maybe they will add to it. Maybe they will not. Who knows? What can be known is that it actually exists, rather than being someone's pipe dream way off in the future that may never be realized.

Seeing something that was never actually produced lets us project our hopes on to it, with no actual basis in facts. If you just look at the facts that were provided, STO is not likely to have really been much different than what we have now, and it is possible it would have been much worse in several key ways.

Work with what we have, try to push it to reach its full potential. Or don't, honestly I don't care and expect the "fanboy" flames to come flowing without people doing a simple search on my post record.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
02-07-2010, 10:58 AM
i agree with most of your post, except that this is a watered down mmo. it's the first non wow clone mmo i've played in the past two years, and while it isn't free range open world like the mmo's of yesteryear, this is the current trend in mmo's. at least it isn't follow this path through five zones for 50 levels. you can go to any sector, any starbase as soon as your done the tutorial. and like any other quest driven mmo, you can only do quests of lower levels before you can do higher level quests.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
02-07-2010, 12:24 PM
Little known fact: The Perpetual screenshot showing the NPC dialog was photoshopped. No such system was ever coded and working. The NPC dialog box was a mock-up that was placed over an engine render screencap.

The 3D ship models, while detailed, were too highly detailed for an MMO. With a poly count as high as they had, they would have been better used in a single-player game.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
02-07-2010, 12:34 PM
perpetual wasn't even at the stage of working with a game engine after two years of development.

that's part of why they went out of business and lost the license.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
02-07-2010, 12:47 PM
I'm sorry, but Perptua'ls vision of "Floating Houses in Space" wasn't something that I wanted. If I wanted a game where I could only run around inside starship's instead of actually flying and fighting with them, then I would play with action figures, and cardboard boxes.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
02-07-2010, 04:53 PM
Whats the point of this post? Your bashing a pre-beta or maybe even pre-alpha version of a game that never made it out from a company that failed versus a complete product? And you call this intellectual honestly?
I call it a straw man. Your defending cryptic by bashing a non-existent game.

Why is picking apart real flaws in the current game = mooning over perpetuals version? Most importantly, do you shill for Cryptic for business or pleasure?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ThomasGideon
There is a post in Suricata's blog about STO, as developed by Perpetual Entertainment. How about a little intellectual honestly, then. Since people are so fond of picking apart the current STO, let us take a critical look at the information in the blog entry. Turnabout is fair play, and there is no reason to be all moon-eyed over something that wasn't produced.

Let us first look at the pictures on that blog as though they are actually from a competed game.

Firstly, space is still super-colorful and crowded with crap. So no difference there.

Did you look at the guy on the ground? He is RIPPED! Must be sucking down 'roids. Yeah, THAT'S really Star Trek...

How about the image of that interaction with an alien. Looks like Saturday Morning Cartoon quality art design. Yeah, THAT really brings across the "Star Trek" feel...

Marvel at the power bar across the bottom, which looks oh so very "Star Trek" in its visual theme and layout. And it is so very intuitive and helpful in its layout. Why, at a glance I can see the status of my power levels, my shields, my ship hull...oh, wait...those don't even exist!

That equipment screen looks not too bad...oh, wait....it looks fugly and clumbsy! My bad! What are these slots? What do they do? How is that a "clean" interface in any way?

Hmmm...come to think of it, the big "Ground" and "Space" button in the lower left is oh so helpful! I wouldn't know if it was ground or space without it!

And that chat area! So streamlined! So uncluttered! Oh, wait, it is just like this one and any other MMO chat area!

Frankly, I do not see anything in those pictures that actually looks better than what the game looks like RIGHT NOW when I play. I don't even have the graphics settings cranked all the way up. Perhaps people should check their settings?


Now, lets look at the text content, shall we?

Everything above the section labeled "The Players" is almost EXACTLY what we have RIGHT NOW. The ONE feature that doesn't exist from that area is the nebulas, and I do not know how much of a critical game addition that would be. Unless these are nebulas that exist in a system, at which point we have THOSE, too.

So, "The Players" section...



Oh, YEAH, that'll really go over well! People already LOVE having to play a Fed for a few hours before being able to play a Klingon! How about you don't even get a ship at all, and then when you finally do it is some PoS shuttle! Huzzah! That's giving players what they want!



Right...name a show or movie in which the Star Trek universe was portrayed as a balkanized place of competing factions... If you can't its because it ISN'T. The Federation is the Federation. The Klingon Empire is the Klingon Empire. There may be groups within these, but they are part of these larger organizations. They do not stand in the place of them. Your primary association is to the ideals of these larger organizations (and, yes, it IS debatable as to whether Cryptic has represented these ideals well). Splitting up the players among these "factions" for "different content" would result in even LESS community interaction than we have now.


The ships:

The artistic objectives were maintained by Cryptic. We have modifiable appearances, a more "heavy plated" look, several classic ship designs, etc.

Multi-player ships....BWAHAHAHAH! I can see it now..."Sorry guys, I lagged and couldn't balance the shields." "You noob! You fly for sux! LtP!" "Sorry, can't log on tonight, you'll have to find another guy to run tactical."

This would have been a option for small groups of people who are already close friends. Since schedules and the fluid nature of online communities would have meant that there would be very few groups that could always be on together, you would have a lot of PUGs. Those are always SO very efficient and skilled...

So what if you just played solo? After all, there is nothing that says you HAVE to be in a group.



Oh...so to have all the powers possible, I have to have multiple people in my ship. Content would therefore either have to be scaled with this in mind, or be trivialized by it. So, grouped ships would either be an even EASIER easy mode than we have now, or people would be SOL without a group ship, forever shouting to "nerf grouped ships". The nerf cries would be particularly loud in PvP, as would the drama matches between players on the same ship.

Yeah, THAT would have worked SO well.

The pièce de résistance:



Yes, you read that right folks! NO REAL DIFFERENCE THAN NOW! Heck, the Bridges that have been thrown in there are actually MORE than Perpetual would have had. LOL


As for server stability...Perpetual was even MORE rinky-dink than Cryptic is. Do you really, HONESTLY, think the server stability and load issues would be BETTER under Perpetual?


Look, Cryptic has provided a watered-down version of a Star Trek MMO. That, there is no denying. There is much more that could have been and should yet be done with STO. However, they actually produced something. Maybe they will add to it. Maybe they will not. Who knows? What can be known is that it actually exists, rather than being someone's pipe dream way off in the future that may never be realized.

Seeing something that was never actually produced lets us project our hopes on to it, with no actual basis in facts. If you just look at the facts that were provided, STO is not likely to have really been much different than what we have now, and it is possible it would have been much worse in several key ways.

Work with what we have, try to push it to reach its full potential. Or don't, honestly I don't care and expect the "fanboy" flames to come flowing without people doing a simple search on my post record.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
02-07-2010, 05:02 PM
Those fake screenshots are really nice.

But highly impractical. Those kinds of visuals in an mmo would break servers, and only allow the most high-end rigs to play, thus alienating a huge amount of players - ultimately condemning the game.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
02-07-2010, 05:34 PM
Preach on Brother Beavis.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
02-07-2010, 05:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sylverlokk View Post
Whats the point of this post? Your bashing a pre-beta or maybe even pre-alpha version of a game that never made it out from a company that failed versus a complete product? And you call this intellectual honestly?
I call it a straw man. Your defending cryptic by bashing a non-existent game.

Why is picking apart real flaws in the current game = mooning over perpetuals version? Most importantly, do you shill for Cryptic for business or pleasure?
The "perpetual was going to do it this way" or "perpetual was going to do it better" argument is common among a certain group of naysayers. He's just refuting their obvious troll posts.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
02-07-2010, 05:51 PM
To be honest I like that UI WAAAAAAAAAAAAY better.
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