Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
02-13-2010, 12:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RIP-Gallows
But you've made me sad.... I cannot troll this kind of rational approach. QUICK! Do some OP QQ so I quip back for my own amusement.
Feds should get it, and klingons shouldn't! It's obvious that Feds are better with computers, so it should be Fed ONLY. Klingons are overpowered! (Heh.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalnar
Well being sitting duck for 20+ seconds, isnt my idea of fun. I think for game sake, it should break after certain dmg done.
Agreed on the sitting duck. Not fun. However, disabling a ship temporarily is a viable CC strategy. So we don't want one extreme OR the other. Breaking on damage, however, doesn't make a lot of sense--you've put a virus in their system, so how does hitting them remove it?

Instead, make the duration semi-random, and allow various abilities and auxillary power settings a chance to periodically remove it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zakoriz
Didnt one of the Devs already mention making Science Team usable while the Viral Matrix is on you? I thought they did.. but anyway, that would make the most sense. Of course, it means the NPCs could counter it too.
Yes, they mentioned it. But if that's the only fix they make, everyone has to take Science Team II so they can withstand Viral Matrix III in any situation it might come up. This reduces everyone's options. Instead, find a few different ways to remove it BUT have a chance that they take a bit longer, or even fail once in awhile.

We'd be adding chance to the mix on both sides. Mixes things up without nerfing anyone or limiting choices.

1) VM duration is a range -- from X to Y seconds -- determined randomly.
2) Auxillary power settings increase chances of clearing VM every tick -- more power (or battery) means better chances.
3) Science Team can be used while under VM, for a CHANCE to clear the buff every tick while the team buff lasts.
4) Attack Pattern Omega breaks VM as intended.

And there we have a balanced system. VM is still very useful, but it can be countered a variety of ways.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
02-14-2010, 04:26 PM
BUMP!

Viral Matrix MUST be changed and changed soon for PVP.

It's so incredibly overpowered that it's an instant rage inducer for anyone who gets hit by it.

A BoP can equip it, hit you with it in a cruiser, and just there 1KM away from you blasting away. Takes 1 full sheild facing down and destroys your hull before you are even able to move or click anything, apart from the respawn button that is.

Real good job, make a skill that turns the other player in to an inactive sitting duck, I don't see how that could *possibly* be overpowered in anyway at all. How on earth this wasn't picked up on changed during testing is beyond me.

So sick of getting hit by this in PVP and just having another unavoidable death.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
02-16-2010, 10:46 AM
My "fix" to VM would be to make the projectile a bit slower, and make it destructible like a HPT.

Quote:
It's so incredibly overpowered that it's an instant rage inducer for anyone who gets hit by it.
Not "anyone". Some of us don't go around spitting at the screen whenever we are CCd. You could also l2p.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
02-16-2010, 07:17 PM
blackbox:

No reason to be like that.

Some people have trouble seeing the projectile, so it's just suddenly BOOM powerless. And the problem isn't that they're CC'd. It's that is for so long, and they can't do anything about it--unless they already did it BEFORE they are CC'd.

I'm all for random duration on VM, so it's not a sure lock-out (but it could still be). And having a chance to break based on Aux Power, so popping a battery COULD shake you out of it... or having Sci Team usable under CC, with a CHANCE to shake the bug on each "sweep."

Then you can still use it to lock someone down, but not guaranteed. And people can find DIFFERENT ways to try to counter it, instead of everyone having to have the same pair of abilities.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
02-16-2010, 08:05 PM
I honestly think that if Viral Matrix was counted by Science Team buff, everyone would be dependant on that skill than it being unique. (You know, one of those "must have' abilities).

It would be better if there was a Science Console that gave that gave resistance or a counter to abilities like Viral Matrix or Neo Beam.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
02-17-2010, 12:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by xMentalxLintx
It currently CAN counter it... it's just that you have to use it BEFORE it hits you... so it's a bit wonky.

I agree from an RP standpoint--the equipment is bugged, not the team. But making it a CHANCE to break with every pulse also touches on the fact that the team still has to USE the equipment to fix it.
Its being fixed to be activate-able after being VM'd... so relax..
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
02-17-2010, 02:45 AM
The core problem is that VM is a STUN with the duration of a MEZ.

STUN is typically a 1-3 second 'pause' where your opponent completely freezes, used tactically it allows you to interrupt/cancel an opponents attack, pause them at an opportune moment, or spammed to raise your DPS and lower theirs.

MEZ is typically a 10+ second block where your opponent freezes but resumes on damage, used 'strategically' you can take a particularly dangerous enemy out of the fight whilst you concentrate on his team-mates. It's typically cure-able and in extreme cases can last a very long time.

By making a STUN with MEZ duration, they've created the most powerful ability in the game by a somewhat insanely large margin. (I assume high level boss mobs are going to be 100% immune, as there is no way this can be balanced otherwise).

- if it's a stun, then it needs to be 'a few seconds' and/or have a side-effect and a lower cooldown.
- if it's a mez, then it needs to break on damage.

In terms of STO:
- VM is better than target subsystem: shields at disabling shields.
- VM is better than target subsystem: engine at disabling engines.
- VM is better than target subsystem: weapons at disabling weapons.
- VM is better than target subsystem: auxilliary at disabling aux.
- VM is better than tractor beam at rooting.
- VM is better than all of the above, combined.

Which is clearly not a sensible design choice.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
02-17-2010, 04:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurian View Post
I honestly think that if Viral Matrix was counted by Science Team buff, everyone would be dependant on that skill than it being unique. (You know, one of those "must have' abilities).

It would be better if there was a Science Console that gave that gave resistance or a counter to abilities like Viral Matrix or Neo Beam.
That's exactly why I'm saying it shouldn't just counter the abilitiy outright. That would make VM/Science Team one of those "power pairs" I was talking about--you have to have the counter, because without it the ability is too OP... but when everyone has the counter, the abilitiy is useless... so why take the counter, since no one uses the abilitiy... so the ability is OP since you don't have the counter.... etc.

If VM had a random duration range (6 to 15 seconds, for instance), that would be a start. Then, once it hits, you can use Science Team for a chance to clear it with each "sweep" of 3 seconds for the duration of the skill. Or, if you don't have Science Team (or at least of high enough level), you could try boosting your Auxillary Power for a chance to break it early.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Splutter
The core problem is that VM is a STUN with the duration of a MEZ.

STUN is typically a 1-3 second 'pause' where your opponent completely freezes, used tactically it allows you to interrupt/cancel an opponents attack, pause them at an opportune moment, or spammed to raise your DPS and lower theirs.

MEZ is typically a 10+ second block where your opponent freezes but resumes on damage, used 'strategically' you can take a particularly dangerous enemy out of the fight whilst you concentrate on his team-mates. It's typically cure-able and in extreme cases can last a very long time.
I agree on this distinction. I disagree with breaking on DAMAGE, however. That would put it in the category of ground CC--completely useless, wth all the AoE skills going on down there. Instead of breaking on damage, breaking on semi-random chance based on Auxillary Power is just as fair, only you give the DEFENDER some choice in how to counter it WITHOUT having to take an ability they might not otherwise want just to counter ONE skill.

Makes more sense from an in-game standpoint as well. If I konk you on the head to daze you, how does konking you on the head again wake you up? Put it in the defender's hand--throw Science Team and wait a few seconds... or pop an Auxillary Battery, if you were wise enough to slot one. Or just run with Aux a little bit higher than you usually do, when facing an enemy with VM (just like you'd do with shields against a tough enemy).

Let's keep the ability useful, just take away what makes it OP--the fact that it can last too long AND only be countered by two select abilities, only one of which everyone has access to.

To recap:

1) Science Team should "sweep" the ship every 3-4 seconds for the duration of the skill. And, as was said, it will be usable while under VM.

2) Auxillary Power levels should determine a chance to break VM early each "tick." Popping a battery could greatly improve your chances. Running with higher Aux power (instead of that automatically being the "throw-away" power level for all but science ships) could be a help, too.

3) VM's duration should fall within a range. You've got a CHANCE of that super-stop against a VERY unprepared opponent... but usually, it's just a mid-level mez or a few seconds of pause. It will also be far more useful AFTER you've lowered their auxillary power, which means it's best used in the MIDDLE of a fight, not at the beginning right after de-cloaking.

These three things don't ruin the ability, but they bring it right back into balance.
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